Scoffers on AFF

[Godsdrummer]

Originally Posted by Sean

How then does someone go from a literal flood to a spiritual fire?

Metaphors my friend, metaphors......LOL

And Sean before you use big words you don't understand get out your dictionary.

Metaphor
MET'APHOR, n. [Gr. to transfer, over, to carry.] A short similitude; a similitude reduced to a single word; or a word expressing similitude without the signs of comparison. Thus "that man is a fox," is a metaphor; but "that man is like a fox," is a similitude or comparison. So when I say, "the soldiers fought like lions," I use a similitude. In metaphor, the similitude is contained in the name; a man is a fox, means, a man is as crafty as a fox. So we say, a man bridles his anger, that is, restrains it as a bridle restrains a horse. Beauty awakens love or tender passions; opposition fires courage.

[J.A. Perez]

Originally Posted by Godsdrummer

10/7/2015
2 Peter 3:10
2Pe 3:10 But the day of the Lord will come as a thief in the night; in the which the heavens shall pass away with a great noise, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat, the earth also and the works that are therein shall be burned up.
Many take this passage and try to imply that the earth, this planet, and all that goes with it will be destroyed. That it will be dissolved by fire. And then God will create a new planet that is perfect, without sin. There are several things wrong with this thinking, and I wonder how they reconcile several things written in this passage. But I will only deal with this one verse, for in this verse there are still several issues that seem to be over looked.
First the issue of the day of the Lord. What is the day of the Lord? I have in my life heard several teachings on the meaning of the day of the Lord. The first one is the teaching that the day of the Lord is the rapture. A term I might add that is not found in scripture, nor with careful study is only found in the imagination of the minds that teach this.
But let us not just leave this idea with regards to my way of thinking. According to these teachers Christ is going to return to earth, and resurrect all the dead in Christ and rapture all those that are living and take them to a place they perceive as heaven. Now here is the problem with this thinking. In regards to the rapture, they take the part of this passage in verse 10, “the day of the Lord will come as a thief in the night” and apply it to the rapture. There is a big problem with this for the day of the Lord is a coming in judgment. They try to get around this by splitting the coming of the Lord into at least two comings, with a period of tribulation in between. Of course this poses another problem, they cannot agree if the supposed rapture happens before this tribulation, in the middle or at the end. Yet the biggest problem with all of this is that they teach that at the end of this tribulation, Christ returns and set up a 1000 year reign on the earth, and still the earth is not destroyed until after the 1000 years.
All of this in the face of Peter writing that the day of the Lord comes as a thief in the night, and the heavens and earth pass away with a fervent heat. How can all this happen in the short period of time implied by Peter in this passage? It cannot.
Instead of defending a theology that has so many holes in it, why not go back to scripture and rethink your theology?

I wasn't poking holes like you were doing. I was just sincerely asking how do you explain it?

You're not explaining your stand by mocking someone else's. You're just making haphazard statements.

[Monterrey]

Man, I go out to do a little work and look what I have missed!

Sean moving to the head of the class and teaching now!

LOL

[Godsdrummer]

Originally Posted by J.A. Perez

I wasn't poking holes like you were doing. I was just sincerely asking how do you explain it?

You're not explaining your stand by mocking someone else's. You're just making haphazard statements.

Sorry if you think all I was doing was poking holes, sometimes poking holes is the first step before explaining things.

I have not had as much interaction with you as with Sean so not too sure where you are coming from yet.
Here is part of the thing for me, I have taught and explained things is the past but if the person being taught is set in their mind they will like Sean not even consider or study that which disagrees with their theology.

The other thing is most people get their beliefs by indoctrination, rather that personal study. They were taught their beliefs over and over then began to teach those beliefs the same way to others. If one does not have reason to question those doctrines, they will continue to believe and teach them as God inspired. Thirty five years ago while I was pasturing a church, someone questioned two standards of holiness, that caused me to take another look. Although I thought I had studied them many times before, this time I looked at many outside resources outside the church. Also I began to study history and the context before and after the passages used to teach those standards. For me I could not reconcile the teachings taught by my organization. I also found that there were others in my organization that also agreed with the same understanding I was coming to.

The point to this is I now try to stay away from trying to persuade others to my way of thinking by giving my understanding. Because in doing so, all I am doing is indoctrinating others to my way of thinking rather they them finding it on their own. Therefore I will poke holes in doctrines, in the hope that it will cause others to question what they have been taught, and dig deeper in study.

I believe truth is truth and when someone studies to find truth with an open heart, truth will prevail. Paul told Timothy to study to show himself approved, he did not say go to the elders of the church to get your doctrine. The bible has always been and always will be my go to book for answers to life's problems, and it also holds the answers to the questions to prophecy, but one must study.

My last thought is don't look to other to teach you truth, study for yourself to find truth, truth will prevail. If there is one question, one contradiction in your mind then it cannot be truth.

[Evang.Benincasa]

Originally Posted by Sean

That is the dumbest thing you have ever brought to the open Benincasa.

Even David Bernard teaches the verse is about the 2nd coming.

You think that mature Christians gravitate from the Gifts, according to the context of the passage......


LOLOLOL


This is your idiotic doctrine....

Brother Bernard also teaches TITHING!

So stop robbing God and listen to Brother Bernard.

Originally Posted by Sean

8 Charity never faileth: but whether there be prophecies, they shall fail; whether there be tongues, they shall cease; whether there be knowledge, it shall vanish away.

9 For we know in part, and we prophesy in part.

10 But when that which is perfect (maturity in Christ) is come, then that which is in part shall be done away.

11 When I was a child, I spake as a child, I understood as a child, I thought as a child: but when I became a man, I put away childish things.

12 For now we see through a glass, darkly; but then face to face: now I know in part; but then shall I know even as also I am known.


The only reason you would come to the conclusion that this is the way you believe is the belief you have in preterism.

It shakes your doctrine, when you think of the ending of the gifts, when and only when Jesus returns

Sean, you are confused, maybe if you read the scripture slower, you may find out what Paul was teaching. You sound like a mixture of Church of Christ and Southern Baptist. When was the last time you spoke in tongues?

[Evang.Benincasa]

Originally Posted by Sean

How then does someone go from a literal flood to a spiritual fire?



Metaphors my friend, metaphors......LOL

Maybe you are ready to answer Brother Blume's post?

What world perished in Noah's flood?

[Sean]

Originally Posted by J.A. Perez

I wasn't poking holes like you were doing. I was just sincerely asking how do you explain it?

You're not explaining your stand by mocking someone else's. You're just making haphazard statements.

Yes exactly Bro. Perez.


These preterists are extremely embarrassed to come out and teach what they believe. It is only for those that embrace metaphors as a standard for reading the Bible.


Not a one of them will ever post what 1 Peter 3 is really talking about. They know I will hang them high and not EVER let them off the hook when they post it.

Therefore, they will only teach what they think it is metaphorically saying in secret preterist rooms that have no windows or listening devices....LOL

[Sean]

Originally Posted by Godsdrummer

Sorry if you think all I was doing was poking holes, sometimes poking holes is the first step before explaining things.

I have not had as much interaction with you as with Sean so not too sure where you are coming from yet.
Here is part of the thing for me, I have taught and explained things is the past but if the person being taught is set in their mind they will like Sean not even consider or study that which disagrees with their theology.

Wait a minute Loren.....What do I have to study?....A bunch of COMMENTARY?
That is exactly what preterism is loren....COMMENTARY.
It does not allow someone to think for themselves as they see a verse clearly tell them something, but intruduces 2nd and 3rd meanings to half of the Bible!

Study that????



The other thing is most people get their beliefs by indoctrination, rather that personal study. They were taught their beliefs over and over then began to teach those beliefs the same way to others. If one does not have reason to question those doctrines, they will continue to believe and teach them as God inspired. Thirty five years ago while I was pasturing a church, someone questioned two standards of holiness, that caused me to take another look. Although I thought I had studied them many times before, this time I looked at many outside resources outside the church. Also I began to study history and the context before and after the passages used to teach those standards. For me I could not reconcile the teachings taught by my organization. I also found that there were others in my organization that also agreed with the same understanding I was coming to.

Loren, I am indoctrinated by the Bible I own. It clearly teaches me my doctrines to believe. The last thing I need is someone telling me it means something else, other than what I am reading........Capeesh?


The point to this is I now try to stay away from trying to persuade others to my way of thinking by giving my understanding. Because in doing so, all I am doing is indoctrinating others to my way of thinking rather they them finding it on their own. Therefore I will poke holes in doctrines, in the hope that it will cause others to question what they have been taught, and dig deeper in study.

I believe truth is truth and when someone studies to find truth with an open heart, truth will prevail. Paul told Timothy to study to show himself approved, he did not say go to the elders of the church to get your doctrine. The bible has always been and always will be my go to book for answers to life's problems, and it also holds the answers to the questions to prophecy, but one must study.

My last thought is don't look to other to teach you truth, study for yourself to find truth, truth will prevail. If there is one question, one contradiction in your mind then it cannot be truth.

Yes indeed, study ONLY the Bible and believe it as you see it. Not like others' tell you to see it. Study YOUR BIBLE!

[Sean]

Originally Posted by Godsdrummer

And Sean before you use big words you don't understand get out your dictionary.

Metaphor
MET'APHOR, n. [Gr. to transfer, over, to carry.] A short similitude; a similitude reduced to a single word; or a word expressing similitude without the signs of comparison. Thus "that man is a fox," is a metaphor; but "that man is like a fox," is a similitude or comparison. So when I say, "the soldiers fought like lions," I use a similitude. In metaphor, the similitude is contained in the name; a man is a fox, means, a man is as crafty as a fox. So we say, a man bridles his anger, that is, restrains it as a bridle restrains a horse. Beauty awakens love or tender passions; opposition fires courage.

Loren, this is what you guys have done to the Bible......




met·a·phor
ˈmedəˌfôr,ˈmedəˌfər/
noun
a figure of speech in which a word or phrase is applied to an object or action to which it is not literally applicable.
"“I had fallen through a trapdoor of depression,” said Mark, who was fond of theatrical metaphors"
synonyms: figure of speech, image, trope, analogy, comparison, symbol, word painting/picture
"the profusion of metaphors in her everyday speech has gotten pretty tiresome"
a thing regarded as representative or symbolic of something else, especially something abstract.




Good job, preterists.....Way to louse up a perfectly good Bible.....LOL

[Godsdrummer]

Originally Posted by Sean

Yes indeed, study ONLY the Bible and believe it as you see it. Not like others' tell you to see it. Study YOUR BIBLE!

Sean you are so off the wall and blind you don't know what you believe! You are reading a book written 2000 years ago, written in a different culture, with different understanding and ways to even talking. You think you can just read those words in English and understand what is being said?

After reading most of your responses to those of us that ask you questions or even answer your questions, I realize you don't comprehend most of what you read. No wonder you post some off the wall responses that have little or nothing to do with the post directed to you.

I don't believe you, you say you study the bible but the only thing I hear from you are direct quotes from Search for truth bible study. You think Mike Blume, or EB are ashamed to answer your questions? You are so far from the truth in making those accusations you should be ashamed. They are answering you with the questions they ask you, but you are too dense to understand that. Because you have not taken the time to honestly see what they are asking you.