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  #431  
Old 12-24-2012, 08:16 AM
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Steve Epley Steve Epley is offline
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Re: All Trinitarians are Lost!!!!!!!!!!!

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Originally Posted by houston View Post
I'm a trinitarian. I became trinitarian when I spent a year in Utah.
Lot of seducing spirits in Utah. Just saying..........................
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  #432  
Old 12-24-2012, 08:45 AM
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Michael The Disciple Michael The Disciple is offline
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Re: All Trinitarians are Lost!!!!!!!!!!!

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Originally Posted by seekerman View Post
You're taking Isaiah 9:6 and creating a mishmash of an interpretation as most oneness folks do. You ask, "Is He the Son"? Of course, the scripture states that a child is born a son is given. Yes, this person is the Son of God, no doubt about that. A critical error in your analysis of the passage is your failure to recognize that the passage then says that His NAME shall be called.....and then gives several attributes that this Son who is given will possess. Does anyone baptize in the name of wonderful? Of course not, that's an attribute as all the following are attributes of the Son who is given. Who is giving the Son? Not the Son, but God is giving the Son. This Son who God the Father gives has all the attributes of His God and Father per John 14.

Joh 14:8 Philip saith unto him, Lord, shew us the Father, and it sufficeth us.
Joh 14:9 Jesus saith unto him, Have I been so long time with you, and yet hast thou not known me, Philip? he that hath seen me hath seen the Father; and how sayest thou then, Shew us the Father?
Joh 14:10 Believest thou not that I am in the Father, and the Father in me? the words that I speak unto you I speak not of myself: but the Father that dwelleth in me, he doeth the works.
Joh 14:11 Believe me that I am in the Father, and the Father in me: or else believe me for the very works' sake.
Joh 14:12 Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that believeth on me, the works that I do shall he do also; and greater works than these shall he do; because I go unto my Father.
Joh 14:13 And whatsoever ye shall ask in my name, that will I do, that the Father may be glorified in the Son.
Joh 14:14 If ye shall ask any thing in my name, I will do it.

Jesus was not His Father, Jesus was in His Father and His Father was in Him therefore He had the attributes of His God and Father. In fact, He did nothing other that what He saw His God and Father do.

Heb 1:1 God, who at sundry times and in divers manners spake in time past unto the fathers by the prophets,
Heb 1:2 Hath in these last days spoken unto us by his Son, whom he hath appointed heir of all things, by whom also he made the worlds;
Heb 1:3 Who being the brightness of his glory, and the express image of his person, and upholding all things by the word of his power, when he had by himself purged our sins, sat down on the right hand of the Majesty on high;
Heb 1:4 Being made so much better than the angels, as he hath by inheritance obtained a more excellent name than they.
Heb 1:5 For unto which of the angels said he at any time, Thou art my Son, this day have I begotten thee? And again, I will be to him a Father, and he shall be to me a Son?



No it doesn't. See the scriptures above. Jesus knew very well that He wasn't the Father but that He was in His Father and His Father was in Him, per scripture.


Not true. Christ must have the attributes of His God and Father.



If Jesus is the Christ, then He can't be His own Father. Someone anointed Jesus, thus His title the Christ, and He did not anoint Himself. His God and Father anointed Him, per scripture, and was with Him.

Act 10:38 How God anointed Jesus of Nazareth with the Holy Ghost and with power: who went about doing good, and healing all that were oppressed of the devil; for God was with him.



I'm not sure if you're twisting scripture purposely or not, but you've again misquoted what the bible says.

1Jn 2:22 Who is a liar but he that denieth that Jesus is the Christ? He is antichrist, that denieth the Father and the Son.
1Jn 2:23 Whosoever denieth the Son, the same hath not the Father: (but) he that acknowledgeth the Son hath the Father also.
1Jn 2:24 Let that therefore abide in you, which ye have heard from the beginning. If that which ye have heard from the beginning shall remain in you, ye also shall continue in the Son, and in the Father.

Nothing there about confessing that Jesus is the Father and the Son. The passage makes a distinction between the Father and the Son as do hundreds and hundreds of scriptures.



We all have to make our own personal decisions. My personal decision is to consider you as a brother in Christ.



A Jewish Rabbi confessed that Jesus is the Father and the Son? What kind of Jewish Rabbi would make such a confession?



No doubt.
The anti christ spirit cannot confess Jesus is the Christ as defined by Isaiah the prophet. They make their own Christ who can be called anything but the Father.
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  #433  
Old 12-24-2012, 08:50 AM
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Cindy Cindy is offline
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Re: All Trinitarians are Lost!!!!!!!!!!!

Colossians 1:12-18

King James Version (KJV)

12 Giving thanks unto the Father, which hath made us meet to be partakers of the inheritance of the saints in light:

13 Who hath delivered us from the power of darkness, and hath translated us into the kingdom of his dear Son:

14 In whom we have redemption through his blood, even the forgiveness of sins:

15 Who is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of every creature:

16 For by him were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether they be thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: all things were created by him, and for him:

17 And he is before all things, and by him all things consist.

18 And he is the head of the body, the church: who is the beginning, the firstborn from the dead; that in all things he might have the preeminence.
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If my people, which are called by my name, shall humble themselves, and pray, and seek my face, and turn from their wicked ways; then will I hear from heaven, and will forgive their sin, and will heal their land.
2 Chronicles 7:14 KJV

He hath shewed thee, O man, what is good; and what doth the LORD require of thee, but to do justly, and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with thy God? Micah 6:8 KJV

Beloved, now are we the sons of God, and it doth not yet appear what we shall be: but we know that, when he shall appear, we shall be like him; for we shall see him as he is. 1 John 3:2 KJV
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  #434  
Old 12-24-2012, 10:09 AM
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Old Paths Old Paths is offline
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Re: All Trinitarians are Lost!!!!!!!!!!!

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Originally Posted by houston View Post
I'm a trinitarian. I became trinitarian when I spent a year in Utah.


How?

Why?

Please, I'm really interested............
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STILL believing the same after all these years
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  #435  
Old 12-24-2012, 01:14 PM
Originalist Originalist is offline
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Re: All Trinitarians are Lost!!!!!!!!!!!

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Originally Posted by Old Paths View Post
How?

Why?

Please, I'm really interested............
Are Trinitarians still lost if they obey Acts 2:38 but remain Trinitarian?
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  #436  
Old 12-24-2012, 01:30 PM
hometown guy hometown guy is offline
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Re: All Trinitarians are Lost!!!!!!!!!!!

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Originally Posted by Originalist View Post
Are Trinitarians still lost if they obey Acts 2:38 but remain Trinitarian?
Yes, but the Holy Ghost will lead them into all truth but it is up to them to except truth or reject it.

Last edited by hometown guy; 12-24-2012 at 01:33 PM.
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  #437  
Old 12-24-2012, 01:37 PM
hometown guy hometown guy is offline
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Re: All Trinitarians are Lost!!!!!!!!!!!

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Originally Posted by Steve Epley View Post
Lot of seducing spirits in Utah. Just saying..........................
False doctrine is false doctrine no Matter if its Mormonism or trinity they will both send someone to hell
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  #438  
Old 12-24-2012, 01:41 PM
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Re: All Trinitarians are Lost!!!!!!!!!!!

so if you believe any false doctrine at all you will burn in hell?
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  #439  
Old 12-24-2012, 01:50 PM
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Re: All Trinitarians are Lost!!!!!!!!!!!

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Originally Posted by Amanah View Post
so if you believe any false doctrine at all you will burn in hell?
"And there shall in no wise enter into it any thing that defileth, neither whatsoever worketh abomination, or maketh a lie: but they which are written in the Lamb's book of life" (Revelation 21:27, KJV).

After reading these words how do you answer your question???
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  #440  
Old 12-24-2012, 02:04 PM
Originalist Originalist is offline
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Re: All Trinitarians are Lost!!!!!!!!!!!

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Originally Posted by hometown guy View Post
Yes, but the Holy Ghost will lead them into all truth but it is up to them to except truth or reject it.
A very cliche type answer. If the former be true, "Yes,but...", then all Trinitarians are not lost, and the title of this thread is a lie. As for the latter, "the Holy Ghost will lead them into all truth but it is up to them to except truth or reject it", how does he lead them into "all truth"? Does the term "all truth" refer only to the Godhead? We Apostolics sure act as if that were the case. In fact, the minute a Trinitarian decides to embrace our doctrine, we then insist that he stop seeking more truth. We want him to check his brain at the door and not think for himself anymore. In effect, we tell them," Ok, you have all truth now. No need to keep seeking God. Once you've embraced Acts 2:38 and the Oneness doctrine, then there is nothing more as to enlightenment you need from God".

In the context that verse is quoted ("all truth"), we are all in trouble. In issues such as tithing, church government, eschatology, there are many varying views. So someone is wrong. Someone does not have "all truth". Quoting this verse in this context implies there will be those who literally will come to a place where there won't be anything more they can learn from the Spirit. The logical conclusion then is that we are using this verse out of context. To paraphrase John 16:13, Jesus was saying that whatever the Spirit leads us into will always be the truth. So again, with all the varying opinions on so many topics with our ranks, someone has believed teachings that are error. In fact, I dare say we ALL are guilty of this in some area. So I guess we ALL are going to hell.

As for the Godhead issue, let's get real here. I dare say that maybe TEN PERCENT of Oneness Christians have really had some sort of revelation or illumination from God concerning the Oneness doctrine. They embrace it because.....

A) They were raised in a Oneness church.

B) They came to Christ in a Oneness church and were discipled by Oneness believers.

I had had the Holy Ghost for 11 years and had been a licensed Assembly of God minister for 6 years when the Spirit further clarified the Godhead to me. This came after a year of agonizing study and prayer. So, to say that a Trinitarian who has the Holy Ghost will eventually be led into the truth about the Oneness doctrine is really not true any more than Oneness believers will finally be led into a uniform truth in all the other areas I mentioned previously. So be very careful in making such bold statements as "All Trinitarians are Lost". If you are judged by God with the same standard you heap upon Trinitarians, chances are you will also be in hell. We are fallible humans, even with the Holy Ghost. We are going to miss the mark doctrinally on some point. That is why God had to save us by his grace.

Last edited by Originalist; 12-24-2012 at 02:06 PM.
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