Anger + Sadness = RAGE

[Pressing-On]

Originally Posted by tstew

Truth, the fact that instead of confirming he would be at the location of his truck (which he had already given) he said the police should call him to see where he was when they arrived leans far more towards his determination to continue to follow this teen who was "getting away" and "running away".

What if he had the thought that he might have to leave his location if the boy seemed to come back and give him some trouble? He doesn't know at that point. Of course, speculation, but it should be considered.

I heard a black minister, being interviewed by Sean Hannity, saying that given the history of the break-ins, anyone would have had the same perspective of the young black man in the apartment complex.

[MissBrattified]

911 Calls

Not sure if this link was posted earlier, so sorry if it's a repeat. It's the most complete audio of the 911 calls I've heard. At about 2:15 minutes in, it DOES sound like Zimmerman gets out of his truck and closes the door and it sounds like he's walking. At that point the 911 operator asks him not to follow Trayvon. I found it odd that he didn't want to give the operator his personal information.

11:43 minutes in, a woman says that there's a guy "on top" with a white t-shirt, presumably referring to Zimmerman since Trayvon was wearing a gray hoodie.

About 21:30, a woman says that she saw them "wrestling" before the shot. Very sad call, sounds like an older woman, very upset because a "young boy" has been killed. Cries (a LOT) and says that she would have helped if she could've. Her call is very long...and the 911 operator does a great job of calming her down and is exceedingly patient.

32:23 - a couple of kids call in--the "brother" to the caller says: "...I saw a man laying on the ground that needed help that was screaming and then I was gonna' go over there to try and help him but my dog got off the leash so I went and got my dog and then I heard a loud sound [and] the screaming stopped."

[MissBrattified]

Originally Posted by Pressing-On

Except there was an eye witness to corroborate Zimmerman's story. You been talking to Shelia Jackson Lee?

Actually, I haven't watched ANY newscasts about the Trayvon case (we got rid of our satellite TV), other than online snippets, and I've listened to limited radio talk shows. Most of my opinions have been based on what I've dug up on my own and read on this thread. I don't even know who Sheila Jackson Lee is.

I have no problem changing my view on this case if I am given more substantial evidence. If Zimmerman followed this boy with intent to harm, he needs to be prosecuted. If Trayvon instigated the attack, he paid for it already.

The reality is that even if Zimmerman were proven not guilty, his life is ruined and someone will end up killing him. He will always fear for his life. Thanks, especially, to Al Sharpton, The Black Panthers, et al. The race baiters who will not let it go and do their own people no justice at all.

I agree with the last part, and it's a worthy discussion, but I think where it fails in this case is that the actions of Al Sharpton, the Black Panthers and others have NO BEARING upon Zimmerman's actual guilt or innocence. While we can discuss it, IMO focusing on the bias of the MSM and on the purposeful provocation by members of the black community obfuscates the facts of the case and blinds people to looking at the facts. (In the same way that members of the black community are blinded by their focus on this being a hate crime.)

What I care about is: was Zimmerman's life threatened or not, and was he justified in shooting an unarmed teenage boy--one who he had been admonished to stop following. He acted on very lame suspicions. That much is clear from his 911 call. Further, I find it interesting that in his call (from the full audio) that he states that Trayvon is coming towards him and then comments about how *they* always get away. Trayvon saw him and took off running. Right? Doesn't sound like a confrontational kid to me. Sounds like he wanted to get away from Zimmerman; not attack him.

[MissBrattified]

Originally Posted by Truthseeker

Looking at gun pointed at him?

My thoughts exactly.

[Pressing-On]

Originally Posted by MissBrattified

Actually, I haven't watched ANY newscasts about the Trayvon case (we got rid of our satellite TV), other than online snippets, and I've listened to limited radio talk shows. Most of my opinions have been based on what I've dug up on my own and read on this thread. I don't even know who Sheila Jackson Lee is.

Google her, you will have a ball with it. LOL!

I agree with the last part, and it's a worthy discussion, but I think where it fails in this case is that the actions of Al Sharpton, the Black Panthers and others have NO BEARING upon Zimmerman's actual guilt or innocence. While we can discuss it, IMO focusing on the bias of the MSM and on the purposeful provocation by members of the black community obfuscates the facts of the case and blinds people to looking at the facts. (In the same way that members of the black community are blinded by their focus on this being a hate crime.)

It doesn't have anything to do with the actual case, but it has a whole lot to do with the racial narrative. I do care about that.

What I care about is: was Zimmerman's life threatened or not, and was he justified in shooting an unarmed teenage boy--one who he had been admonished to stop following. He acted on very lame suspicions. That much is clear from his 911 call. Further, I find it interesting that in his call (from the full audio) that he states that Trayvon is coming towards him and then comments about how *they* always get away. Trayvon saw him and took off running. Right? Doesn't sound like a confrontational kid to me. Sounds like he wanted to get away from Zimmerman; not attack him.

You don't know what the visual looked like, so you can't really make the claim that it was a "lame suspicion".

If he was coming toward him and then turned to run, I would want to know why he would act in that way, if in fact, it happened as Zimmerman states it did. And if he did run, as a neighborhood watch, I think I would want to know where he ran off to. If he says, "They always get away", I could see why he followed him. He doesn't want any more robberies in his neighborhood and wants to alert the police as to the boy's direction. If Trayvon was there to commit a crime, it may warrant why he ran. Of course, conjecture, but an attorney will present the same questions.

I think we are all just asking a few questions along the way. I am not claiming Zimmerman is innocent. I would just need more substantial evidence in order to hang the man. If I have to rule in a life or death case and it is my decision to make, I would want more details and none of us really have it. It's a 50/50 from my view without more evidence.

I don't have high hopes this case will be solved. I've been in a court room where the Prosecuting attorney asked the witness, "If you saw pictures, would you believe it?" He responded, "No." lol! That is what this case will more than likely turn out to be.

[MissBrattified]

Originally Posted by Pressing-On

Google her, you will have a ball with it. LOL!


It doesn't have anything to do with the actual case, but it has a whole lot to do with the racial narrative. I do care about that.



You don't know what the visual looked like, so you can't really make the claim that it was a "lame suspicion".

If he was coming toward him and then turned to run, I would want to know why he would act in that way, if in fact, it happened as Zimmerman states it did. And if he did run, as a neighborhood watch, I think I would want to know where he ran off to. If he says, "They always get away", I could see why he followed him. He doesn't want any more robberies in his neighborhood and wants to alert the police as to the boy's direction. If Trayvon was there to commit a crime, it may warrant why he ran. Of course, conjecture, but an attorney will present the same questions.

I think we are all just asking a few questions along the way. I am not claiming Zimmerman is innocent. I would just need more substantial evidence in order to hang the man. If I have to rule in a life or death case and it is my decision to make, I would want more details and none of us really have it. It's a 50/50 from my view without more evidence.

I don't have high hopes this case will be solved. I've been in a court room where the Prosecuting attorney asked the witness, "If you saw pictures, would you believe it?" He responded, "No." lol! That is what this case will more than likely turn out to be.

You're right. This will probably end up being unsatisfactory for a lot of people, because not all the questions CAN be answered absolutely.

None of us can really make absolute judgment calls until all the facts are out, which could take months. For me right now the evidence leans toward Zimmerman being over-zealous and shooting an unarmed teenager unjustifiably. However, if clear evidence shows otherwise, I'm okay with changing my mind. I'm not holding my breath, though. The more info that comes out, the more I'm liking Zimmerman for murder.

[aegsm76]

Originally Posted by MissBrattified

You're right. This will probably end up being unsatisfactory for a lot of people, because not all the questions CAN be answered absolutely.

None of us can really make absolute judgment calls until all the facts are out, which could take months. For me right now the evidence leans toward Zimmerman being over-zealous and shooting an unarmed teenager unjustifiably. However, if clear evidence shows otherwise, I'm okay with changing my mind. I'm not holding my breath, though. The more info that comes out, the more I'm liking Zimmerman for murder.

At this point, I think they will try to make him plea-bargain and not go to court.
This will help the state to get him into jail and avoid a court case.
If it goes to court, I think he walks.
There is too much conflicting info at this point.
The coroner's report could change my opinion and these results.

[Pressing-On]

Originally Posted by MissBrattified

You're right. This will probably end up being unsatisfactory for a lot of people, because not all the questions CAN be answered absolutely.

None of us can really make absolute judgment calls until all the facts are out, which could take months. For me right now the evidence leans toward Zimmerman being over-zealous and shooting an unarmed teenager unjustifiably. However, if clear evidence shows otherwise, I'm okay with changing my mind. I'm not holding my breath, though. The more info that comes out, the more I'm liking Zimmerman for murder.

I agree with these comments I read on-line, because he did have a right to follow as part of the watch program. That would be determined on what the visual on the ground looked like to me.

"If you are in my neighborhood...and I am part of the watch program...and I don't know you...I CAN follow you. It's a free country. If you turn on me...HIT me first...then start bashing my head into the concrete...THEN see my gun and say "You are a dead man"...I then have a right to SHOOT you dead."

Originally Posted by MissBrattified

911 Calls


11:43 minutes in, a woman says that there's a guy "on top" with a white t-shirt, presumably referring to Zimmerman since Trayvon was wearing a gray hoodie.

And an eyewitness said that the guy on the bottom was wearing red. Zimmerman had on a red paneled jacket.

About 21:30, a woman says that she saw them "wrestling" before the shot. Very sad call, sounds like an older woman, very upset because a "young boy" has been killed. Cries (a LOT) and says that she would have helped if she could've. Her call is very long...and the 911 operator does a great job of calming her down and is exceedingly patient.

This was an interesting call to me because we know it is dark and has been raining. She says she sees the guy putting up his hands and hears him say that he shot someone. He didn't deny it and he didn't try to run away from the scene. Again, perhaps he didn't have time between the 911 calls and the arrival of the police.

[Pressing-On]

Originally Posted by aegsm76

At this point, I think they will try to make him plea-bargain and not go to court.
This will help the state to get him into jail and avoid a court case.
If it goes to court, I think he walks.
There is too much conflicting info at this point.
The coroner's report could change my opinion and these results.

He's a dead man if he ends up in jail.

[MissBrattified]

Originally Posted by Pressing-On

He's a dead man if he ends up in jail.

I think he's a dead man either way, unless he goes into a WP program.