Charismatic Bishop In Lawsuit. - Page 43

Sam · #**421** 09-30-2010, 02:50 PM

Folks, why do we go on and on fighting amongst ourselves about this?

This is a tragedy! This is a reproach on the name of Christ!
A great minister, precious souls, family members, churches have already been hurt by this and there will just be more damage and pain. Some souls may even be lost over this. We don't really know how much, if any, of this is true.

Praxeas · #**422** 09-30-2010, 02:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ManOfWord

Since I work in law-enforcement (Sheriff's Chaplain) this reminds me of a person who is pulled over under suspicion for drug related activity. The officer asks them to step out of their vehicle and then asks if there is anything illegal in their vehicle. They respond, "No" and the officer asks for permission to search their car. Like an idiot, almost every time, the driver will say, "Sure, go ahead. I've got nothing to hide."

The officer searches, discovers a bag of "whatever", shows it to the person, who then say, "Hey, I don't know how that got there. It's not mine!"

It's like the person somehow believes that that when they give the officer permission to search that he'll say, "No, that's OK. I believe you. I'm not going to search your car."

It's human nature to hide our "darkness." But that is precisely the reason it gets exposed so that we can deal with it and get free. God gives ample opportunities for us to deal with the "darkness" privately so we are not "exposed." However, if we choose not to deal with it, it is not so much that God exposes us to shame us, it is simply that our failure to deal with it has caused that which we are hiding to continue to grow to a point that it gets exposed by virtue of its "size" and degree of impropriety.

I'm all for mercy for all who have sinned, but we either deal with it on our knees, get someone to help us etc. or we'll have to deal with it publicly. It really is our choice and God is on our side to heal us and set us free. If we choose our own route, then we'll just have to deal with the fall-out. Unfortunately, many others will get dragged into it as well and that is what AB is saying.

If you say no they take your license away, which I think should be unconstitutional

rgcraig · #**423** 09-30-2010, 02:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sam

Folks, why do we go on and on fighting amongst ourselves about this?

This is a tragedy! This is a reproach on the name of Christ!
A great minister, precious souls, family members, churches have already been hurt by this and there will just be more damage and pain. Some souls may even be lost over this. We don't really know how much, if any, of this is true.

Okay - - let's close the thread!

Who knew our sweet little Scott could start such a controversial thread!

Mr. Smith · #**424** 09-30-2010, 02:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Maximilian

I'm just asking the question, Smithy.

When friends and family encounter this situation in a church setting, we aren't a District Attorney, nor prosecuting someone to death row.

True enough. But there are principles that are valuable to learn from.

My question is finding ways to not make it difficult for people to come forward.

There is an element at play that will never go away that will always make it difficult to report, and that is, the element of shame. The very nature of these actions make the victim feel as if they are at fault and that is an element that will always make it difficult for people to come forward.

The fact is, most sexual crimes end up going unreported.

True and sad. It's embarrassing and often difficult to prove.

What's the best way to support those who have been victimized? Does doubting them until they can prove beyond a reasonable doubt serve them at all?

I'm not encouraging "Doubting" them. I'm encouraging making sure we have all the obtainable facts before we rush to judgment.

Sure, that should be the measuring stick for a court room, but what about a family?

It's a very difficult subject. But I think before we destroy the life of an individual who's been accused, we have to proceed with the greatest of care. I don't believe it's good enough to "have a feeling" they did it, or think "they probably did." For sure, if any of us are ever put in the position of arbitrating something like this, we would need the wisdom of Solomon!

So if your daughter told you the pastor molested her, you'd just leave it alone since she obviously couldn't prove it?

Oh my. This is the type of question that destroyed the political career of Michael Dukakis. Honestly, Maxi, I don't know what I'd do outside of the fact I'd wanna kill him. But hopefully, after I settled down, I'd beg God for His help in finding out all the truth.

I'm asking these questions because these are real situations I'm privy too that have happened. That fear of high-profile people (aka pastors) has scared many away from coming forward.

This is very true.

At the same time, I agree an allegation does not an indictment make. But it's definitely a situation where both parties should be respected.

And I totally agree.

Praxeas · #**425** 09-30-2010, 02:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rgcraig

Okay.

lol why you sending millions to death row and only 200 go free, or was that 200 go to death row?

Praxeas · #**426** 09-30-2010, 02:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rgcraig

16% wrongly sent to death row. That's pretty high.

However, it does appear that a good pecent of those are exonerated.

Oh so there are millions wrongly sent to death row but only 200 of them like the Jets for the superbowl? Gocha!

Mr. Smith · #**427** 09-30-2010, 02:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rgcraig

Okay - - let's close the thread!

Who knew our sweet little Scott could start such a controversial thread!

I think this is one of the most interesting and revealing threads I've seen on AFF. At least we're not debating standards, how many steps, how we're baptized, and trinity vs. Oneness!

That stuff gets OLD!

rgcraig · #**428** 09-30-2010, 03:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Praxeas

Oh so there are millions wrongly sent to death row but only 200 of them like the Jets for the superbowl? Gocha!

No - - I was first saying that out of the millions that are sent to prison if there's only been 200 wrongly send to death row that wasn't so bad.

But, I was reading too fast.

Mr. Smith · #**429** 09-30-2010, 03:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sam

Folks, why do we go on and on fighting amongst ourselves about this?

This is a tragedy! This is a reproach on the name of Christ!
A great minister, precious souls, family members, churches have already been hurt by this and there will just be more damage and pain. Some souls may even be lost over this. We don't really know how much, if any, of this is true.

So, so, so true. For the sake of those who will respond, "See, I knew it all along, I quit!", I'm desperately hoping this is all a scam. And for the sake of several young men who make have been harmed, I hope they really weren't. Easier to heal them of a con than a molestation.

Praxeas · #**430** 09-30-2010, 03:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cindy

For most perpetrators admitting guilt is very hard, no matter the evidence. And for the victims, admitting it happened, just as hard.

And for those that are victims in this kind of situation, the emotional pain far out weighs the physical.

unless someone gets a deal from the DA, I doubt any criminal admits he is guilty but for a small fraction.