Angels reproducing with humans possible?

[mfblume]

Originally Posted by thephnxman

We need to follow the thread and context of the scriptures in Gen. 4:26; Gen. 5:1-32; Gen. 11

This is the sequence:
Men (Seth and his generation) began to ask (invoke) the Lord God for his NAME.
Chapter 5 lists the names of men He deemed righteous , and their offspring:
God was making manifest the lineage of the Lord Jesus;
The Lord God makes a difference from those that are not His (the "daughters" of men); and those that are His, (the sons of God);
God is showing us that satan's plan is to corrupt God's seed (lineage);
Gen. 11:1-9 contrasts the descendants of men from those in Gen. 4:26!
Seth is seeking God's face; those men in Gen. 11 are seeking their own glory.

The pattern you so marvelously showed, continues in chapter 12.

While people set out to make their OWN NAME GREAT and BUILD THEMSELVES a city, God told Abraham HE WOULD MAKE HIS NAME GREAT and we later learn HE WOULD BUILD HIM A CITY.

Genesis 11:2-4 And it came to pass, as they journeyed from the east, that they found a plain in the land of Shinar; and they dwelt there. (3) And they said one to another, Go to, let us make brick, and burn them throughly. And they had brick for stone, and slime had they for morter. (4) And they said, Go to, let us build us a city and a tower, whose top may reach unto heaven; and let us make us a name, lest we be scattered abroad upon the face of the whole earth.

contrasted from:

Genesis 12:1-3 Now the LORD had said unto Abram, Get thee out of thy country, and from thy kindred, and from thy father's house, unto a land that I will shew thee: (2) And I will make of thee a great nation, and I will bless thee, and make thy name great; and thou shalt be a blessing: (3) And I will bless them that bless thee, and curse him that curseth thee: and in thee shall all families of the earth be blessed.

Saying angels are involved in the 6th chapter breaks the pattern between fleshly men versus godly men.

[mfblume]

Originally Posted by Aquila

What amazes me is that the Bible describes a God that creates the world in 6 days by His spoken Word. The Bible describes God creating woman from a rib. A global flood, miraculous plagues upon Egypt, the splitting of the Red Sea, miracle after miracle, the sun standing still, people being risen from the dead. Demon spirits being cast out. Miracle after miracle, supernatural event after supernatural event. Yet just following the natural reading of the language of Genesis 6, respecting ancient commentary on the text, and people get all full of doubt.

Ditch the spirit of doubt. Angels, even fallen angels, are capable of far more than we realize.

lol. It's not doubt. It's context.

[mfblume]

Originally Posted by Aquila

If the angels that left their first estate are the angels cast out of Heaven with Satan... their all bound in chains of darkness until judgment day... no need to cast them out of people or engage in spiritual warfare.

Whom do you think we cast out of people today, then?

[Lafon]

Originally Posted by thephnxman

[B]Understand this first: angels that "...had not kept their first estate...", are not allowed in God's presence.

In what manner do you reconcile your statement with the words of Revelation 12:7-12, which plainly advises that Satan, who was the first to willingly choose to leave his "first estate," continues to exercise the abiiity, even as I write this, to appear "before our God day and night" for the purpose of ACCUSING THE BRETHREN, yet will NOT be "cast out" (of heaven) into the earth UNTIL he and his wicked band mount a "war" there in an attempt to overthrow the throne of God, and are defeated?

Will it not be when Satan and his wicked band of fallen angels are cast down to the earth after being defeated in that "war," that the inhabitants of the heavens will be told to rejoice, for "Woe to the inhabiters of the earth and of the sea! For the devil is come down unto you, having great wrath, because he knoweth that he hath but a short time"? (vs. 12)

It is my understanding from the contents of these passages that Satan, as well as all of the fallen angels, continue, even to the present time, to exercise the liberty of having unfettered access to BOTH heaven and the earth, yet the privilege of accessing heaven will cease after the "war" that is come there has ended and they are all cast down into the earth!

If it be that I am in error in this expressed belief, please, won't you enlighten my understanding by providing sound scriptural evidence to the contrary.

[Aquila]

Originally Posted by mfblume

Whom do you think we cast out of people today, then?

I think you're misunderstanding my point. If these angels who left their first estate are merely the angels that rebelled with Satan, the verse implies that they and Satan are bound in chains of darkness until judgment day, making spiritual warfare silly because they aren't free to possess anyone or wreak havoc. However, IF these angels who left their first estate are a different group of angels who committed a sin so heinous that God decided to bind them from that point until judgment day, it all makes sense.

The question then becomes... what act... or what line... did these angels cross that would call for immediate binding until judgment day... while Satan himself and many others are permitted to roam freely at present? These angels crossed a line that Satan himself hasn't crossed.

[mfblume]

Originally Posted by Aquila

I think you're misunderstanding my point. If these angels who left their first estate are merely the angels that rebelled with Satan, the verse implies that they and Satan are bound in chains of darkness until judgment day, making spiritual warfare silly because they aren't free to possess anyone or wreak havoc. However, IF these angels who left their first estate are a different group of angels who committed a sin so heinous that God decided to bind them from that point until judgment day, it all makes sense.

The question then becomes... what act... or what line... did these angels cross that would call for immediate binding until judgment day... while Satan himself and many others are permitted to roam freely at present? These angels crossed a line that Satan himself hasn't crossed.

Okay, I see your point now.

However, who says demons we cast out cannot be the ones bound in chains of darkness? I consider sinners bound in chains of darkness, but they are still walking the earth. Why could not the chains of darkness simply mean they cannot be redeemed in their case?

[Aquila]

Originally Posted by mfblume

Okay, I see your point now.

However, who says demons we cast out cannot be the ones bound in chains of darkness? I consider sinners bound in chains of darkness, but they are still walking the earth. Why could not the chains of darkness simply mean they cannot be redeemed in their case?

Why is it your every response is based on "Why could not..." the text mean something other that what it appears to mean???

I'm serious. I'm noticing this trend with some of you brothers. When someone starts telling me that a text doesn't mean what it appears to mean or doesn't imply what it appears to imply over and over... I get real leery. Do you ever grow weary of trying to find a way for a text not to mean what it apparently says???

[mfblume]

Originally Posted by Aquila

Why is it your every response is based on "Why could not..." the text mean something other that what it appears to mean???

I'm serious. I'm noticing this trend with some of you brothers. When someone starts telling me that a text doesn't mean what it appears to mean or doesn't imply what it appears to imply over and over... I get real leery. Do you ever grow weary of trying to find a way for a text not to mean what it apparently says???

I can ask the same thing to you about Genesis 6.

But to answer you about binding, binding is commonly used in the entire bible, and it does not always mean what you imply here that it means. And we are talking about spirits.

The fact is is what is it that YOU have for your doctrine of two sets of fallen angels, without a plain statement saying there were two?

Seriously.

[Praxeas]

Originally Posted by mfblume

It was always wrong for godly people to marry sinful people. But the fall wasn't the marrying. They fell before marrying which is why they married sinners.

Scripture for that these females were sinners or that it was a sin for the offspring of Seth to marry them?

[Praxeas]

Originally Posted by mfblume

To say that Christ's words included "in heaven" so as if to distinguish unfallen angels from fallen ones is seriously a weak point. If angels had the ability to change themselves to be able to procreate, then whether they'r unfallen and not doing so, or fallen, Jesus would not have said there is no marriage.

The changing ability is simply absurd. If they had that ability then God was apparently robbing them of something they wanted.

No, the idea seems to be that the ability of angels is simply non-existent, whether to change themselves or not.

There's just too much assumption that must be made.

And, you know what? Who cares to begin with? lol

Genealogies.

Things are not a weak point just because you say so.

Second you keep misquoting that verse and leaving out the word Heaven...it changes EVERYTHING. Why? Because Heaven is a spirit world not a physical worl. He is not comparing us to Angels but Angels IN HEAVEN