Can Women Pastor ? - Page 41

HeavenlyOne · #**401** 10-08-2009, 08:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rdp

Heavenlyone, have you not noticed that all 3 of your Scriptural references [from the OT economy, by the way], each have a M-A-N doing the preaching?

Now, pls. provide the Scripture reference where God tells a woman to "Preach" to a church congregation? Or, even just one example of it ever happening will suffice:______________? In fact, you can even use the OT!

Do you not fear to tamper w/ God's Holy Word like this?

Tks. Simplyme........you truly are a blessing!

Ahh.....just as I thought. When it's a man prophet, he's preaching. If it's a woman prophet, she's merely prophesying!

But guess what? The same word for 'preach' is used to describe what Deborah told Barak. Thank you and you're welcome.

But you first show me where any scripture says that women cannot preach to a church congregation. The one you keep using doesn't say that, so try again.

I'm waiting. If all you can do it use the same lame 'women cannot speak in the church' and use that to say women can't preach, sorry. The verse doesn't say that, in spite of you wanting it to.

Godsdrummer · #**402** 10-08-2009, 09:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rdp

Awww, I'm nobody to teach you, but I will simply point out that God is the one who took the time to enumerate their ornamentation in connection w/ the judgement that He was to visit upon them. Don't have my Bible w/ me, but doesn't vs. 1 [or somewhere around there] say "Therefore, because the daughters of Zion.....", then lists the various ornaments? "Therefore" & "because" are explanatory terms of His impending judgement.

See also Deut. 7:25, I Tim. 2:9, I Ptr. 3:3, Gen. 35:1-6, Ex., etc. just for starters....blessings!

This is why we have so many false doctrines running around, someone takes a negative passage like this and makes a doctrine out of it. Do you not realize this is just what the Pharasee were doing when Christ upbraded them so much. They had taken the laws of God and tried to make them better in thier eyes when they had only succeded in making things into traditions of men.
Isa 3:16 Moreover the LORD saith, Because the daughters of Zion are haughty, and walk with stretched forth necks and wanton eyes, walking and mincing as they go, and making a tinkling with their feet:

The statement here is why the Lord is Going to take away their jewlery not that it was wrong to wear. It is what their attitude was. Maybe your forgeting God gave it (jewlery to them) if the rings or jewls were a sin then why did God give it to them in the first place.

Eze 16:10 I clothed thee also with broidered work, and shod thee with badgers' skin, and I girded thee about with fine linen, and I covered thee with silk.
Eze 16:11 I decked thee also with ornaments, and I put bracelets upon thy hands, and a chain on thy neck. Eze 16:12 And I put a jewel on thy forehead, and earrings in thine ears, and a beautiful crown upon thine head.
Eze 16:13 Thus wast thou decked with gold and silver; and thy raiment was of fine linen, and silk, and broidered work; thou didst eat fine flour, and honey, and oil: and thou wast exceeding beautiful, and thou didst prosper into a kingdom.

Wow did God say he decked her with rings, bracelets etc.

Its not the wearing of jewlery that is the sin it is the attitude.

And the derogitive remarks made by a couple of the posters on here truly show your true spirit. Trust me I have been in the ministry for 30 plus years and born into Apostolic UPCI. I know all the scriptures you quote I preached them myself. I ask God 20 years ago to show me his word because I did not want to preach something that was not in the word of God I have sent the last 20+ years studing whe word front and backwards. You can think what you want to about the way I see things. Bottom line I am not closed to being wrong and I can admit to being wrong, because I know I don't know it all and neither do you. So when we judge our brother because we don't see eye to eye, remmember as you judge so will you be judged by God.

Godsdrummer · #**403** 10-08-2009, 09:17 PM

I noticed how you folks omit the primary definition of "Prophesy," which is to "for-tell". Primarily, prophecy deals w/ the spontaneous moving of God's Spirit to reveal the hidden [see Elizabeth, Zachariah, Lk.1]...not preaching a sermon from the Scriptures! The definitions that you are giving is only secondary, possible definitions. Why not list Strong's [for one] definition? And, I do not "do the same thing today"....& call it preaching [misrepresentation]. I Tim. 2, I Cor. 14, etc. is dealing w/ a church-setting, as I've pointed out NUMEROUS times.

Still waiting on you to deal w/ I Tim. 2, etc., etc., etc.....probably for a looooong time! Godsdrummer is sooo ridiculous that it does not even merit a scholarly response. But, I'll probably get around to him soon, when things slow down for me. In sum, he rerlegates the great apostle Paul's teaching to only relevant for his day!! Hmmm, I wonder if that also includes his teachings on faith?? Paul. appealed to headship in I Tim. 2...not just some arbitrary cultural idea!

I actually agree w/ Sis. Alvear...we'll be judged by SCRIPTURE [such as I Tim. 2, I Cor. 14, I Tim. 3, etc.]....not dream & visions.[/QUOTE]

How and where do you get that I Tim. 2 is speaking of a church setting? Come on you want someone to address these two chapters yet you act like only you know what they mean. Ya right. First Paul is addressing the way we are to deal with government dignitaries, ie Kings and all who are in authority. This is not the church this is the world.
Next:
1Ti 2:8 I will therefore that men pray every where, lifting up holy hands, without wrath and doubting.
Again this is not the church setting but the way we are to present ourself to the world.
So do tell me where you get that chapter 2 in speaking of the church setting?

Paul then changes his subject in chapter 3 when he speaks of spiritual leaders. This is called rightly dividing the word.
2Ti 2:15 Study to shew thyself approved unto God, a workman that needeth not to be ashamed, rightly dividing the word of truth.

Godsdrummer · #**404** 10-08-2009, 09:31 PM

To continue...

1Co 14:34 Let your women keep silence in the churches: for it is not permitted unto them to speak; but they are commanded to be under obedience, as also saith the law.
1Co 14:35 And if they will learn any thing, let them ask their husbands at home: for it is a shame for women to speak in the church.

As I have said before this is the church setting but just what is Paul saying here? That a woman cannot speak if God moves on her? As you are arguing a woman cannot speak at all. Silence mean silence by your interpretation. Yet
1Co 14:31 For ye may all prophesy one by one, that all may learn, and all may be comforted.

Act 2:17 And it shall come to pass in the last days, saith God, I will pour out of my Spirit upon all flesh: and your sons and your daughters shall prophesy, and your young men shall see visions, and your old men shall dream dreams:

You contradit yourself either a women can or cannot prophecy if she can prophecy then the silence in the church must mean something other than what you are trying to say it means. And the only one the word says a women cannot ursurp authority over is her own father or her husband. Even the Law does not make a women a lesser human. She is to be in subjection to her father until she is married then to her husband. Give me bible where a women is to be in all subjection to any other man.