Phoenix area church recommendations?

Originally Posted by BoredOutOfMyMind

The Father or Son?

I met the son when he was our Youth speaker a few years back.

The son is now pastoring the church his dad pastored. His sister,
Gayla I think, is married to a CA pastor up in your neck of the woods.

I believe elder Robert Bibb has started another work in another part of the Phoenix metro area.

[SoCaliUPC]

Originally Posted by philjones

I dare to differ with you on Rob Bibb. Of course, here on AFF we all know that even conservatives are someone's liberal so your assessment is, like mine, very subjective. I still contend that Rob is a moderate.

[embonpoint]

Originally Posted by chaotic_resolve

Hmmm, interesting. I've never heard of the "bolded"churches. Seems to be quite a few more than what I thought. Cool.

These three would most likely be classified as UC here. They are closely associated with Bro Garrett in Glendale.

[jackbauer]

For anyones info, The Outlaws Church is closed and no longer exists, The Valley Cathedral where Charles Combs is has NEVER been in the UPCI. It has always been a Trinitarian Charismatic Church.

[committed]

Originally Posted by SiblingRevelry

So I did go to church today...and got to hear a full-blown sermon on the subject of tithing. This UPC pastor was preaching strongly against the spirit of Tobiah (see the book of Nehemiah) in the church. I am a polite person, so I waited him out (i.e., I sat there through the entire thing like a good girl and just let it wash over me). But this pastor was very clear that he is entitled to all the tithing monies. I'll be honest, that set my teeth on edge, particularly since he made it a heaven or hell issue. In his preaching, if you weren't paying in the proper amount of tithing, you would go to hell. And he made it particularly clear that it isn't tithing unless you tithe on the gross.

I have to admit, this guy was a very good speaker, but the tithing and the grandiose plans he's got rather put me off. I particularly noted that although they had an outreach some months back that brought in quite a few visitors to the church over a couple of weekends, it didn't seem to have made a huge impact on the membership all these months later. But the pastor wanted to hand out thousands of fliers yet again this weekend. He wants to have a thousand members in a couple of years.

I did note this for Thad's benefit: this guy mentioned that he wanted to advertise on TV and "it's been approved."

Wouldn't it be great if the AFF and all other Pentecostal forums were a place of encouragement and uplifting words - sharing GOOD reports and testimonies of what God is doing - instead of trying to find something negative to say about one another?

I would say that the church isn't doing too bad, having grown from just a handful one year ago, to an average of 134 members. The Pastor does have a vision that so far has been right on target. Unfortunately, Sibling, you happened to visit on a Thanksgiving week-end, when there were several members out of town, as well as some viruses going around.

The message on tithing is not a norm for him. He doesn't dwell on finances, but if the Lord lays it on his heart to preach it - it doesn't bother me because I believe it. By way of clarification, you missed part of what he said about tithing. He's not going to take it all and live on it. It's for the MINISTRY - which includes assistants, music ministers, all those who are totally involved in the ministry of the church.

This past Sunday there was almost a full house (although the outreach had to be postponed because of the rain Friday and Saturday) - and an AWESOME service! The presence of the Lord was strong. Wish you had been there.

Don't be too sceptical. Do you believe there were 3,000 added to the church in the book of Acts? Why can't 1,000 be added today? If God made a promise, He will keep it - He won't let anyone down.

[commonsense]

My cousin and her husband retired and moved to Scottsdale. They were raised UPC. I know at one time they attended Valley Cathedral. Not sure if they still do. They liked the fact that it was a large church, good music etc.

[SiblingRevelry]

Originally Posted by committed

Wouldn't it be great if the AFF and all other Pentecostal forums were a place of encouragement and uplifting words - sharing GOOD reports and testimonies of what God is doing - instead of trying to find something negative to say about one another?

I would say that the church isn't doing too bad, having grown from just a handful one year ago, to an average of 134 members. The Pastor does have a vision that so far has been right on target. Unfortunately, Sibling, you happened to visit on a Thanksgiving week-end, when there were several members out of town, as well as some viruses going around.

The message on tithing is not a norm for him. He doesn't dwell on finances, but if the Lord lays it on his heart to preach it - it doesn't bother me because I believe it. By way of clarification, you missed part of what he said about tithing. He's not going to take it all and live on it. It's for the MINISTRY - which includes assistants, music ministers, all those who are totally involved in the ministry of the church.

This past Sunday there was almost a full house (although the outreach had to be postponed because of the rain Friday and Saturday) - and an AWESOME service! The presence of the Lord was strong. Wish you had been there.

Don't be too sceptical. Do you believe there were 3,000 added to the church in the book of Acts? Why can't 1,000 be added today? If God made a promise, He will keep it - He won't let anyone down.

Suppose it hadn't been me but someone off the street that had heard that message? I was shocked by it, in large part because I have heard tithing sermons before that turned into a general altar call and they worked. This did not. Seriously, it was very uncomfortable to sit there through a sermon that was *entirely and completely* geared towards tithing and directed only to the members of the church. I listened--I was waiting--for standard apostolic preaching including Acts 2 and I didn't hear a word of it.

As for cynicism--maybe it's all those years of education (including the process to become a lawyer) but "extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence." I don't consider that cynicism, but realism. I've been disappointed by more than a few grand visions that actually were more grandiose than based in reality.

*shrug* To each his own. It was just not a good experience for me.

SR

P.S. I am no longer a lawyer; I came to my senses.

[deadeye]

I know that this is an old thread, but I seldom get on here so I thought I would address some of the things on here.

1. In my book Rob Bibb is pretty liberal....especially according to most of the Arizona District direction.
2. CC1 ...you are full of bologna...Az is one of the most beautiful and Diverse states in the Union, canyons, rivers, mountains, forest you name it we have got it...well except for oceanfront property.
3. Wilkins, Franks, Myers, are independent, conservative GOOD men who would treat anyone right, I would recomend thier churches without reservation. (Greg are you reading this...give me a call)
4. Chaotic Resolve...have you ever considered Bro Hudsons church?...a very loving and intimate atmosphere.

Originally Posted by SiblingRevelry

Suppose it hadn't been me but someone off the street that had heard that message? I was shocked by it, in large part because I have heard tithing sermons before that turned into a general altar call and they worked. This did not. Seriously, it was very uncomfortable to sit there through a sermon that was *entirely and completely* geared towards tithing and directed only to the members of the church. I listened--I was waiting--for standard apostolic preaching including Acts 2 and I didn't hear a word of it.

As for cynicism--maybe it's all those years of education (including the process to become a lawyer) but "extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence." I don't consider that cynicism, but realism. I've been disappointed by more than a few grand visions that actually were more grandiose than based in reality.

*shrug* To each his own. It was just not a good experience for me.

SR

P.S. I am no longer a lawyer; I came to my senses.

We had a missionary at church last night and he was talking about the night his Dad received the Holy Ghost. Guess what the subject of the sermon was......you guessed it---Tithing! We sometimes forget just who God is and that this is His church. If he so chooses He can move no matter what the message title is.

P.S. I am no longer a lawyer; I came to my senses. [/QUOTE]

[RandyWayne]

Originally Posted by deadeye

I know that this is an old thread, but I seldom get on here so I thought I would address some of the things on here.

1. In my book Rob Bibb is pretty liberal....especially according to most of the Arizona District direction.
2. CC1 ...you are full of bologna...Az is one of the most beautiful and Diverse states in the Union, canyons, rivers, mountains, forest you name it we have got it...well except for oceanfront property.
3. Wilkins, Franks, Myers, are independent, conservative GOOD men who would treat anyone right, I would recomend thier churches without reservation. (Greg are you reading this...give me a call)
4. Chaotic Resolve...have you ever considered Bro Hudsons church?...a very loving and intimate atmosphere.

Thats why we will be living somewhere in the East valley in a few short months! In fact, we will be there the first weekend of Jan to do some serious house hunting. Coming from Wisconsin, we think it is beautiful there! ESPECIALLY the desert!