Time For Churches To Pay Taxes?

[Walks_in_islam]

"Allowing the government to start taxing the church eliminates funds that will go towards seeing souls saved. You may not agree, but finances are important to the spreading of the gospel."

This is hilarious when it gets placed beside what Jesus instructed His followers to do

[Praxeas]

Originally Posted by Walks_in_islam

"Allowing the government to start taxing the church eliminates funds that will go towards seeing souls saved. You may not agree, but finances are important to the spreading of the gospel."

This is hilarious when it gets placed beside what Jesus instructed His followers to do

He instructed them to spread the gospel...

[Praxeas]

Originally Posted by Aquila

What strings are attached?

It is my understanding that the freedom of speech is sacrificed, leaving the church on shaky ground when speaking about politics. And for what? To save money?

Oh, well. Each church body should decide what is best for them.

In the house churches I know, no gathering is licensed. The network isn't licensed. The elders aren't licensed. In fact, "government licensing" as it relates to house churches, elders, and/or our private associations isn't seen as something that is absolutely necessary. This is the Kingdom of God.

I believe that in this... we could learn a lot from the early Quakers.

I don't want some preacher telling me who to vote for or not vote for.

[Walks_in_islam]

Originally Posted by Praxeas

He instructed them to spread the gospel...

I agree but.......in addition to what to do, as above, He also sort of laid out the how to do it.

"finances are important to the spreading of the gospel" and "funds that will go towards seeing souls saved" really weren't in His instruction. Seems He told them to carry nothing, no funding. Implies that funding might not have anything to do with "seeing souls saved" but big nice buildings can make a group of people feel very proud.

Churches have become businesses and should pay their fair share, unless of course they pass their funding on to measurable, documented charity, which is tax free for everyone, equally, across the board.

Only a tiny percentage of modern church funding goes to charity to the community. Perhaps a shift in tax policy could "incentivize" this. An option would be to eliminate the tax deduction for individuals giving to the church, which would then, since the funds were already taxed, be a good justification to keep the church tax-free.

[aegsm76]

The US has been ranked 1st in charitable giving in 2013 & 2014.
Maybe you could help the Saudi's move up from 47 & 57.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/World_Giving_Index

[Praxeas]

Originally Posted by Walks_in_islam

I agree but.......in addition to what to do, as above, He also sort of laid out the how to do it.

"finances are important to the spreading of the gospel" and "funds that will go towards seeing souls saved" really weren't in His instruction. Seems He told them to carry nothing, no funding. Implies that funding might not have anything to do with "seeing souls saved" but big nice buildings can make a group of people feel very proud.

Churches have become businesses and should pay their fair share, unless of course they pass their funding on to measurable, documented charity, which is tax free for everyone, equally, across the board.

Only a tiny percentage of modern church funding goes to charity to the community. Perhaps a shift in tax policy could "incentivize" this. An option would be to eliminate the tax deduction for individuals giving to the church, which would then, since the funds were already taxed, be a good justification to keep the church tax-free.

His instructions were not specific. He just said to preach the gospel.

Most churches are not wealthy businesses. They are getting donations from members to pay property tax, utilities, general maintenance. After that there us very little left over, so why tax them? Those members who give already were taxed

You watch too much TV.

[Walks_in_islam]

G

Originally Posted by Praxeas

His instructions were not specific. He just said to preach the gospel.

Most churches are not wealthy businesses. They are getting donations from members to pay property tax, utilities, general maintenance. After that there us very little left over, so why tax them? Those members who give already were taxed

You watch too much TV.

Jesus did and he specifically instructed them not to carry anything. Read it again.

Church donations are tax deductible to the member. Tithes and all. You've been snooping around that religion of lies thread too much and its rubbing off on you. Has nothing to do with TV. Has to do with whats on the 1040 and whats in the tax code. When you write off donations that means its not taxed. Duh.

[good samaritan]

Originally Posted by Walks_in_islam

G

Jesus did and he specifically instructed them not to carry anything. Read it again.

Church donations are tax deductible to the member. Tithes and all. You've been snooping around that religion of lies thread too much and its rubbing off on you. Has nothing to do with TV. Has to do with whats on the 1040 and whats in the tax code. When you write off donations that means its not taxed. Duh.

First of all the the scripture you have brought up about taking no money was addressed was for a specific time and place (Jesus early disciples). He also told them not to carry a change of raiment. I guess you believe every christian should be wandering vagabonds.

Mark 6:7 And he called unto him the twelve, and began to send them forth by two and two; and gave them power over unclean spirits; 8 And commanded them that they should take nothing for their journey, save a staff only; no scrip, no bread, no money in their purse:9 But be shod with sandals; and not put on two coats.

Luke 22:35 And he said unto them, When I sent you without purse, and scrip, and shoes, lacked ye any thing? And they said, Nothing. 36 Then said he unto them, But now, he that hath a purse, let him take it, and likewise his scrip:and he that hath no sword, let him sell his garment, and buy one.

(Also speaking to the twelve...)

If you are living somewhere other than the U.S. I don't understand why you would post on this thread. As far as church giving being tax deductible, it is. Though most do not use it unless their contributions are very large. The standard deductions is mostly taken because unless you have given so much it wouldn't be worth itemizing. We go to a very modest church as far as the building is concerned and we get by. I just wonder how the government would work out the tax returns for church's. Based on our church's income we would probably get back more than we pay in.

Church's in this country base their income off charitable gifts. In your opinion I suppose the government should start taxing gifts that its citizens receive also. Church's for the most part do not earn money through labor and service like any other business, but is funded through charity. This type of thinking would apply to orphanages, animal rescues, the mustard seed, goodwill, etc....

People may hate the christian church, but they're not being logical. All the posts on this thread to tax churches is nothing, but hate. Sure the're are some abusers of the system out there. Would you come against an orphanage or the mustard seed because a couple of them had abused the system. What about islam? Would you want to be classified a terrorists because some in your faith have become terrorists.

Money that our churches take in do help to win souls. through the publishing of tracts and literature, advertisement of services, etc... If we churches were ever to lose tax exemption I would go on, but I see a snowball coming down the hill that will get bigger and bigger. Our federal government is not supposed to grow to the level it already has.

Many minority groups have sold their souls to the government for the cause of promoting their own personal agendas. This constant reliance on the federal government is a two edged sword. Yes, I am glad for civil rights. At the same time by us running to the federal government to fix things we are empowering the federal government with more authority than was intended at the beginning.

Reminds me of the boy who carried a snake in his pocket. America needs to come back to Jesus before it is too late

[Walks_in_islam]

Originally Posted by good samaritan

First of all the the scripture you have brought up about taking no money was addressed was for a specific time and place (Jesus early disciples). He also told them not to carry a change of raiment. I guess you believe every christian should be wandering vagabonds.



(Also speaking to the twelve...)

If you are living somewhere other than the U.S. I don't understand why you would post on this thread. As far as church giving being tax deductible, it is. Though most do not use it unless their contributions are very large. The standard deductions is mostly taken because unless you have given so much it wouldn't be worth itemizing. We go to a very modest church as far as the building is concerned and we get by. I just wonder how the government would work out the tax returns for church's. Based on our church's income we would probably get back more than we pay in.

Church's in this country base their income off charitable gifts. In your opinion I suppose the government should start taxing gifts that its citizens receive also. Church's for the most part do not earn money through labor and service like any other business, but is funded through charity. This type of thinking would apply to orphanages, animal rescues, the mustard seed, goodwill, etc....

People may hate the christian church, but they're not being logical. All the posts on this thread to tax churches is nothing, but hate. Sure the're are some abusers of the system out there. Would you come against an orphanage or the mustard seed because a couple of them had abused the system. What about islam? Would you want to be classified a terrorists because some in your faith have become terrorists.

Money that our churches take in do help to win souls. through the publishing of tracts and literature, advertisement of services, etc... If we churches were ever to lose tax exemption I would go on, but I see a snowball coming down the hill that will get bigger and bigger. Our federal government is not supposed to grow to the level it already has.

Many minority groups have sold their souls to the government for the cause of promoting their own personal agendas. This constant reliance on the federal government is a two edged sword. Yes, I am glad for civil rights. At the same time by us running to the federal government to fix things we are empowering the federal government with more authority than was intended at the beginning.

Reminds me of the boy who carried a snake in his pocket. America needs to come back to Jesus before it is too late

Churches have become businesses and should pay their fair share, unless of course they pass their funding on to measurable, documented charity, which is tax free for everyone, equally, across the board.

Is actually what I said. If it is charity, let it not be taxed. If is it business activity and expansion activity, let it be taxed. If it is not doing charitable service to the community then it is nothing but a hobby. Jesus' disciples weren't "printing tracts" and "buying advertisement" either.

My income tax bill is significant and I do not wish my significant payment of taxes to subsidize your hobbies and puppet shows. If every dime of your charitable giving to the church went to charity then as per above this would not even be a discussion because I do not believe that true charity (from anyone, anywhere) should be taxed. Call that hate or not. If it looks like a business and smells like a business then it's not a "charity" and donating money for expansion and advertisement is not "charitable giving".

[good samaritan]

If it is charity, let it not be taxed.

How would the government distinguish which is charity and which is business? You have broadbrushed that all should be taxed. The church is not a charity. It's finances are derived through charitable donations and you could call that gifts. From my understanding of things, gifts are not not taxed, only income derived through work or the selling of goods. How could the government legally tax any income that has been brought in through charitable giving. It doesn't matter whether or not you agree with what they do with the money. The point is not what they do with the money, but how the money is obtained. The church is a assembly and not a charity, but their resources are pooled through charitable giving. The resources are not just to give away to everyone who asks, like some think. The resources are to provide that assembly with a place to worship and other things that would help the assembly to be more productive christian's and to save the lost from going to hell.

If is it business activity and expansion activity, let it be taxed.

So you think that if you are in need of a new roof and someone gives you ten thousand dollars to replace your roof, then you should have to pay taxes on their gift? Gifts should not be considered taxable income. The giver paid taxes on the money before giving the gift. If you want to argue that donations given to the church should be none tax deductible for "the giver" then I could go along with that. I don't write off church contributions any way. Most of the people I know don't write off their church contributions either.

Jesus' disciples weren't "printing tracts" and "buying advertisement" either.

No they weren't, but it is ignorant to think that because they didn't do it then it is wrong for us to. They didn't drive cars either so by that philosophy we shouldn't either.

My income tax bill is significant and I do not wish my significant payment of taxes to subsidize your hobbies and puppet shows

I don't know how your taxes has in any way helped church's. Our church not paying tax should not have anything to do with your taxes. The reason people's taxes are high is because we have a government who can't balance their check book. When my family doesn't have the money for something then we go without. Church's have been exempt of paying taxes as long as this country has existed. Blame your tax problems on the governments poor management. If they taxed churches your taxes wouldn't be cheaper, but would continue to go up with inflation every year anyway. You may not be intentionally hating, but it is a spiritual battle the church is in. This world hates its existence. Tax us if you must be the Church is going to move forward!!!!