Stunning Sermon On The Great Tribulation

[Michael The Disciple]

Can you imagine how shocked these prets will be (and pre tribs) when the mighty judgment of Elohim begins to hit the Earth? When millions upon millions are being slain of the Lord? When he is driving the worlds kingdoms from the face of the Earth?

Actually we will all need more grace to live in the tribulation. Those of us who do.

Some reading this thread may be called to lay down their lives for the glorious Bridegroom. Its now in this time we need to settle the issues about loyalty to Christ. We need to embrace the first and great commandment.

Love the Lord your God with all your heart, soul, mind, and strength.

Nothing this life has to offer compares with him. Let us be glad he he warned us of these things ahead of time.

[seekerman]

Originally Posted by Michael The Disciple

And so in the same chapter when Jesus said:

29 Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened , and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken : 30 And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn , and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory. 31 And he shall send his angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other. Matt. 24:29-31

Has THIS already occured in your opinion?

I don't mind answering the question at all, but the question is taking us off on a tangent. The question, relating to Matt 24, is who was Matt 24 written to, all Christians who's lived for the past 2000 years, reading it personally, or to a specific group of people for a specific time.

Matt 24 begins with Jesus speaking to His disciples concerning specific events, the destruction of the temple and tells them that certain things would occur which they personally would experience and see leading up to the destruction of the temple.

Do you believe Matt 24:29-31 was written to specific group of people at a specific time in history or was it written to everyone for the past 2000 years?

[Michael The Disciple]

Originally Posted by seekerman

I don't mind answering the question at all, but the question is taking us off on a tangent. The question, relating to Matt 24, is who was Matt 24 written to, all Christians who's lived for the past 2000 years, reading it personally, or to a specific group of people for a specific time.

Matt 24 begins with Jesus speaking to His disciples concerning specific events, the destruction of the temple and tells them that certain things would occur which they personally would experience and see leading up to the destruction of the temple.

Do you believe Matt 24:29-31 was written to specific group of people at a specific time in history or was it written to everyone for the past 2000 years?

You are right I dont want this thread to be taken over by Prets. So if you believe the coming of Jesus happened 2000 years ago to you this sermon meant nothing.

But if Jesus came 2000 years ago WHO ARE WE AND WHAT RELEVANCE DOES THE BIBLE HAVE FOR US?

[Michael The Disciple]

Do you believe Matt 24:29-31 was written to specific group of people at a specific time in history or was it written to everyone for the past 2000 years?

Do you believe the book of Corinthians was written to a specific group of people at a specific time in history? How about Ephesians? Was it written to a certain group of people in a certain time of history? Was the book of Timothy written to a certain man in history who lived 20 centuries ago?

See where this leads? It leads to making the Bible irrelevant. I dont go there. The destruction of Jerusalem was a preview of Christs prophetic teaching. If Jesus came and gathered the saints together and established his kingdom in 70 ad then prets are right.

[seekerman]

Originally Posted by Michael The Disciple

You are right I dont want this thread to be taken over by Prets. So if you believe the coming of Jesus happened 2000 years ago to you this sermon meant nothing.

But if Jesus came 2000 years ago WHO ARE WE AND WHAT RELEVANCE DOES THE BIBLE HAVE FOR US?

The bible is essential to kingdom living every day of our life.

Simply because Jesus was speaking to His disciples, telling them events that were about to happen to them, doesn't negate the blood, the covenant, the promises, the principles, the kingship of Jesus.

My argument is that when Jesus said to His disciples that they were going to experience certain things, certain events such as the destruction of the temple was going to happen, they happened in that particular period of time.

[TGBTG]

Originally Posted by seekerman

The bible is essential to kingdom living every day of our life.

Simply because Jesus was speaking to His disciples, telling them events that were about to happen to them, doesn't negate the blood, the covenant, the promises, the principles, the kingship of Jesus.

My argument is that when Jesus said to His disciples that they were going to experience certain things, certain events such as the destruction of the temple was going to happen, they happened in that particular period of time.

Seekerman,

Yes, the temple was destroyed in 70AD, but did the rest of the prophecy also occur then?

Matt 24
29 Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken:
30 And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.

[seekerman]

Originally Posted by Michael The Disciple

Do you believe the book of Corinthians was written to a specific group of people at a specific time in history? How about Ephesians? Was it written to a certain group of people in a certain time of history? Was the book of Timothy written to a certain man in history who lived 20 centuries ago?

See where this leads? It leads to making the Bible irrelevant. I dont go there. The destruction of Jerusalem was a preview of Christs prophetic teaching. If Jesus came and gathered the saints together and established his kingdom in 70 ad then prets are right.

I disagree. For example, look at the first chapter of Ephesians.

Eph 1:1 Paul, an apostle of Christ Jesus by the will of God, To the saints who are at Ephesus and who are faithful in Christ Jesus: 2 Grace to you and peace from God our Father and the Lord Jesus Christ. 3 Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, who has blessed us with every spiritual blessing in the heavenly places in Christ, 4 just as He chose us in Him before the foundation of the world, that we would be holy and blameless before Him. In love 5 He predestined us to adoption as sons through Jesus Christ to Himself, according to the kind intention of His will, 6 to the praise of the glory of His grace, which He freely bestowed on us in the Beloved. 7 In Him we have redemption through His blood, the forgiveness of our trespasses, according to the riches of His grace.

Those truths are for every believer, not just those in the church in Ephesus. It's to those who are the chosen in Him (Christ Jesus), including those who have lived in the New Covenant for the past 2000 years.

But Jesus was speaking of certain events, the destruction of the temple, in Matt 24. That's a one time event to occur during a specific period of time.

[seekerman]

Originally Posted by TGBTG

Seekerman,

Yes, the temple was destroyed in 70AD, but did the rest of the prophecy also occur then?

Matt 24
29 Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken:
30 And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.

Actually, I was starting at the beginning of Matt 24, proposing that Jesus was speaking of a specific event that is particular to a certain period of time. When Jesus said to the disciples, you will see this and that, things are going to happen to you, He was speaking to a certain group of people, not generally.

[TGBTG]

Matt 24
26 Wherefore if they shall say unto you, Behold, he is in the desert; go not forth: behold, he is in the secret chambers; believe it not.
27 For as the lightning cometh out of the east, and shineth even unto the west; so shall also the coming of the Son of man be.

Jesus' coming AFTER the tribulation will not be a secret event. The fact that we're even discussing whether Jesus came or not 2000 years ago is TESTIMONY to the fact that he has NOT come. IT WILL NOT BE A SECRET EVENT when he comes AFTER the tribulation.

If he has come, surely, even secular history would have recorded it...lol

EVERY eye shall SEE him (Rev 1:7)

[seekerman]

Originally Posted by TGBTG

Matt 24
26 Wherefore if they shall say unto you, Behold, he is in the desert; go not forth: behold, he is in the secret chambers; believe it not.
27 For as the lightning cometh out of the east, and shineth even unto the west; so shall also the coming of the Son of man be.

Jesus' coming AFTER the tribulation will not be a secret event. The fact that we're even discussing whether Jesus came or not 2000 years ago is TESTIMONY to the fact that he has NOT come. IT WILL NOT BE A SECRET EVENT when he comes AFTER the tribulation.

If he has come, surely, even secular history would have recorded it...lol

EVERY eye shall SEE him (Rev 1:7)

Starting at the beginning of Matt 24, is it your view that Jesus was speaking of the future destruction of the temple he was showing His disciples?

Mat 24:1 Jesus came out from the temple and was going away when His disciples came up to point out the temple buildings to Him. 2 And He said to them, "Do you not see all these things? Truly I say to you, not one stone here will be left upon another, which will not be torn down."