Conservatives seek gov't solutions after oil spill

[pelathais]

Originally Posted by Jermyn Davidson

The GOP was the majority in Congress from 2000 -2006, the season where my fellow conservatives responded in fear and enacted at least two "laws" that invaded privacy and abused liberties.

Pel, this is the truth.


However, my point in all of this is this: by and large the federal government is needed and its finanial support IS ESSENTIAL to many aspects of our society.

This is a fact that many conservatives on the Gulf Coast realize. Not that they did not realize before, they do realize it now.

It is ironic-- a political party that beats horses dead about government intrusion and privacy is the party that has produced the most easily abused laws that would lead to civil liberty intrusions in recent American history.

Yet, it is the Democrats who are for, "Big Gub'ment"-- they just want all yer money!

It's a tired daitribe, but people buy into it over and over....

Originally Posted by Jermyn Davidson

Good night Pel.

Real lame JD. Just where does the Federal government get this magical money that everyone wants?

You're such a liberal and Lefty that you don't even know the answer to that question.

No offense Bro, but you have not shown the knowledge nor the human experience to even be engaged in these discussions. Your rants and frequent posts in this area are embarrassing. Get up to speed!

Where does the Federal government get its funding?

What would happen if the amount of that funding were reduced and local governments, businesses and individuals were allowed to wield this kind of power in their own lives?

There is a role for the Feds, but suckling at it's teats while it draws down your children's bank accounts isn't going to be a viable role for the long term.

[pelathais]

JD, I know that you haven't really been exposed to a lot of political talk and that you are in dire need of some resources. Consider this:

Read:

Capitalism and Freedom: Fortieth Anniversary Edition by Milton Friedman

Free to Choose: A Personal Statement by Milton Friedman and Rose Friedman

The Road to Serfdom: Text and Documents--The Definitive Edition (The Collected Works of F. A. Hayek) by F. A. Hayek and Bruce Caldwell

The Wealth of Nations by Adam Smith

On Liberty and Other Essays by John Stuart Mill

Tyranny of the Status Quo by Milton Friedman

[Sam]

Originally Posted by Ferd

GWB got hammered for waiting 2 days (as per FEMA regulations) before doing anything.

Its been a month and a half and all Barak Obama has done is walk a beach in pretty slacks.

Yet he is getting a pass.

its idiocy.

some political cartoons on the subject

[pelathais]

Texas State Rep. Arnold Gonzales inspects the oil washing up on the shore of Mustang Island northwest of Corpus Christi, TX, in 1979. Texas received no assistance and no compensation from the oil company responsible for the spill - PEMEX.



The same beaches almost three decades later in 2006.



For whatever reasons, no one demonized PEMEX for their irresponsibility and their failure to clean up their spill; but BP, who is working hard and spending billions to clean up are the subject of all sorts of ire in the media, from the Feds and even from the POTUS himself.

With a little wave action and bright sunlight this newer spill would be cleaned up naturally in about 30 years saving BP shareholders billions. Why doesn't BP take that approach? It's the way the rest of the world cleans up their oil spills.

[Jermyn Davidson]

Originally Posted by pelathais

Real lame JD. Just where does the Federal government get this magical money that everyone wants?

You're such a liberal and Lefty that you don't even know the answer to that question.

I don't think you are reading my posts correctly so let me be clearer.

My CRITICISM is directed at my fellow GOP'ers on the Gulf Coast that are calling for more Federal action, which means more Federal funds. These are the same people who not that long ago were balking at the idea publicly of taking money for their states to help with their budget situations for mainly political reasons.

The same folks that always talk about government spending, yet they want the Feds money now, right?


Criticizing the Feds is easy for conservatives and it shows their hypocrisy, once again. It's the proverbial carrot to wave in the face of unsatisfied constituents who want more money in their pockets so the GOP creates an "us against them" mentality all for political gain while knowing that they indeed are part of or will become part of that same system they criticize.

Hardly will one of them will admit that there is a need for the Federal government and its support in order for our country to function properly.


Are my communications clear to you?

See how my point ties into the title of this article and the overall context of the first article I referenced in this thread?

Originally Posted by pelathais

No offense Bro, but you have not shown the knowledge nor the human experience to even be engaged in these discussions. Your rants and frequent posts in this area are embarrassing. Get up to speed!

Every point I have made is backed up with support. Can you find any point I have made on this thread that is not supported? If so, show it to me and I will correct my errors.

You are just blindly criticizing-- for whatever reason.

Whatever I haven't responded to in your last post was not worth responding to.

[pelathais]

Originally Posted by Jermyn Davidson

I speak of what I know, what I have witnessed and what I have personally experienced first hand while:

* working at the Dept of Justice from 2006 - 2008;

* patrolling the American / Mexican Border in Arizona in 2006; and

* I AM currently employed by the VA, working in a section called Fee Basis. In Orlando, though there are literally THOUSANDS of veterans, there IS NOT a VA hospital here. So we often send our veterans to the private hospitals in the area for their surgeries, treatments and etc.

As far as the UNCOMPENSATED OVERTIME, there are many, many Federal employees who are not compensated for their overtime. It is agreed upon BEFORE the employee accepts the position.

I speak of what I know, what I have witnessed and what I have experienced first hand.

I speak of what I know, what I have witnessed and what I have experienced first hand.

How are the bills handled for the Vets going to private hospitals? They're covered, aren't they? I imagine there's all sorts of paper work and second guessing intended to avoid unnecessary surgeries and treatments, that sort of thing - but once they jump through the hoops, are the Vets saddled with hospital bills?

Originally Posted by Jermyn Davidson

I am sorry that your sister experienced this but I hope she is doing well today.

She's good - in fact she settled near a base and a VA hospital just for this reason - that and the cool, clean country air.

Originally Posted by Jermyn Davidson

It seems to me that the whole "government payroll" stuff is always thrown in when discussing the Dems. However, while the GOP dominated the House and Senate from 2000 - 2006, you could hardly get ANYONE to investigate how much money was being spent inefficiently by the government for the war effort.

No, as I recall that was pretty much right on the front burner the whole time.

Originally Posted by Jermyn Davidson

How much of your hard hard earned tax-dollars went to a fat cat employed by Halliburton?

Unknown. And as I've said before, both Bush admins were as reckless in spending as the Dems - that's why they floundered so much in the polls among conservatives. The Bushes were about as fiscally conservative as Nixon was. You're to young to remember Nixon's constant interference in the economy - wage freezes, price freezes, etc.

Just being a Republican doesn't make one a conservative.

Originally Posted by Jermyn Davidson

KBR? Blackwater? Though not the government, they made their millions at the expense of the GOP dominated Federal government-- with very little, if any, tracking at all.

I believe it can be tracked and that is why they have been the focus of so much criticism.

And to be fair (I guess), the Blackwater, KBR and other "contractors" risked their lives rebuilding Iraq's infrastructure. Many of them gave their lives as well. I can only imagine the "overtime" when they went under the wire to deliver goods and services to our troops and the Iraqi people.

Originally Posted by Jermyn Davidson

On this point, we agree that government spending is high, but people who make this argument the loudest seem to forget the BLATANT ABUSES of their own compadres.

BTW,
There are very few Americans I feel sorry for.

You're right - compared to a lot of the rest of the world, we're all "fat cats" over here. We can forget that all too easily.

And remember - the saddest legacy of the "Reagan Revolution" was the fact that so few of the Republican leaders took the lessons of Reaganism to heart and failed to be real "conservative comrades." 9/11 was pretty much the excuse that many Repubs needed to abandon the Reagan legacy altogether.

BTW: Thank you for your service.

[pelathais]

Originally Posted by Jermyn Davidson

I don't think you are reading my posts correctly so let me be clearer.

My CRITICISM is directed at my fellow GOP'ers on the Gulf Coast that are calling for more Federal action, which means more Federal funds. These are the same people who not that long ago were balking at the idea publicly of taking money for their states to help with their budget situations for mainly political reasons.

The same folks that always talk about government spending, yet they want the Feds money now, right?

Criticizing the Feds is easy for conservatives and it shows their hypocrisy, once again. It's the proverbial carrot to wave in the face of unsatisfied constituents who want more money in their pockets so the GOP creates an "us against them" mentality all for political gain while knowing that they indeed are part of or will become part of that same system they criticize.

Hardly will one of them will admit that there is a need for the Federal government and its support in order for our country to function properly.


Are my communications clear to you?

See how my point ties into the title of this article and the overall context of the first article I referenced in this thread?

Every point I have made is backed up with support. Can you find any point I have made on this thread that is not supported? If so, show it to me and I will correct my errors.

My unanswered questions concerning your "points" that were made without any support whatsoever.

Originally Posted by pelathais

...

1) How has the Federal Highway system advanced Freedom in America?

2) Where do those funds (Federal money that is returned to the states) come from? They come from the community receiving the funds in the first place. We send our money to Washington. Washington places restrictions and imposes mandates on how we can use those funds and then they return a very small portion back to our community.

How does that scheme represent "Freedom?"

3) What does a bankrupt rail company (Amtrak) which siphons billions of dollars from our pockets have to do with perpetuating our freedoms?

4) The US Department of Education collects revenue through the IRS and then places restrictions and mandates on the monies they have taken from our communities and doles out a small portion of the total collected with every string imaginable attached to it.

How is this "Freedom?"

5) The Federal government tells me what kind of car I can drive and how fast I can drive it. They tell me what features are permissible in my car and what features I can't have. As they pursue their extremist environmental agenda, they continue to turn the screws, demanding that I pay higher and higher fuel costs while the Environmental Elite get to tool around in air conditioned uparmored Chevy Suburbans and private jets.

Meanwhile, empty trains and empty buses run around my city going places that I have no desire nor any need to go AND I am being forced to pay for that scam with ever higher taxes.

How does this represent Freedom?

Originally Posted by Jermyn Davidson

You are just blindly criticizing-- for whatever reason.

You appear to have forgotten your own assertions. -

Originally Posted by Jermyn Davidson

...

Originally Posted by Jermyn Davidson

Whatever I haven't responded to in your last post was not worth responding to.

LOL. Thanks. You were having "fun" the other day scorning me contemptuously. I thought it was part of the game, part of your "schtick."

[Jermyn Davidson]

Originally Posted by pelathais

How are the bills handled for the Vets going to private hospitals? They're covered, aren't they? I imagine there's all sorts of paper work and second guessing intended to avoid unnecessary surgeries and treatments, that sort of thing - but once they jump through the hoops, are the Vets saddled with hospital bills?

....

BTW: Thank you for your service.

It all depends.

Honestly, there are Vets who og to the emergency room for non-emergency reasons-- like getting really drunk.

However, that Vets claim will be covered if he's vomitting because if he becomes dehydrated, he may die.

When this was explained to me, I was disgusted!

It was explained to me as another Vets medical claim was denied. This Vet was in an auto accident and he had the basic auto insurance.

He had serious injuries, requiring about two months of hospitilization and of course his insurance did not cover even a quarter of the costs.

We had to deny this case because the VA is NEVER a secondary payer. He was a Vet, but he wasn't sufferring from a military service connected injury and this auto accident had nothing to do with his previous military service at all.

If he did not have car insurance at all, there would have been a really good chance we would have covered him because it was an emergency. However in Florida like most places, it's against the law to drive without auto insurance.


It was a hard decision, but it wasn't much of a decision to be made because the laws and regulations are clear.


So our office deals with these kinds of situations as well as the stuff where Vets have cancer, copd, or whatever diseases & ailments. We do what we can to provide for them within the VA system, but most of that kind of stuff is handled by civilian hospitals and the VA reimburses the hospitals and practitioners.

The paper work is not to heavy of a load and as long as the Vets and the vendors communicate with us, it's just a matter of time before the vendors are reimbursed for their services.


I don't throw up my service just as a "trump" card to play when attacked.

However, you assaulted my knowledge and experiences so I felt the need to "defend myself".

You're welcome and I don't regret doing any of the things I've listed.

[Jermyn Davidson]

Originally Posted by pelathais

LOL. Thanks. You were having "fun" the other day scorning me contemptuously. I thought it was part of the game, part of your "schtick."

Oh yeah, I forgot about all of that!!!



I'll get back to your other points tomorrow. I do have to go.

[pelathais]

Originally Posted by Jermyn Davidson

Oh yeah, I forgot about all of that!!!



I'll get back to your other points tomorrow. I do have to go.

Have a great weekend.