Gods Sovereignty

[Neck]

Originally Posted by stmatthew

I often here it said here that "God is sovereign, and can do what he wants". While I understand the premise of what is being said, I disagree with the end result of the statement.


God has set certain boundaries, even upon his own hand, that though he could, he will not go beyond. At one time God destroyed the earth with water. After the water receded, and Noah exited the ark, God set a sign of covenant in the sky, stating that he would never again destroy the earth with water. This was a boundary that God set upon himself. Though he is sovereign, we can bank on the fact that he will never again destroy the earth with water.

So why is it that we are willing to use this "sovereignty thing" so much as a "loophole" when it comes to salvation. The bible is very plain that salvation only comes through Jesus Christ. I believe, as Apostolics, that we all believe a person must be born again to be saved. I understand that we have a diversity of views as to when all this takes place. But for those of us (water-spirit folks) that believe that tongues is the initial evidence of the Holy Ghost, how can we use the "sovereign" card and say there is a possibility that someone that has not spoken in tongues can be saved? Are we so unsure of what the bible says that we are must make exceptions just in case? I cannot see any exceptions for salvation outside of water-spirit with the initial evidence of tongues within this new testament era. If I saw any "loopholes" I would be forced to change my beliefs on the new birth message.

So let me ask you water-spirit folks..... do you believe that anyone that has not spoken in tongues in this new testament era will be saved should they meet God in that state?

Ya! Remember he can take any of of us out, whenever he wants!

Now that is Eternal Sovereignty....

[mizpeh]

Originally Posted by stmatthew

Dave, I am asking an honest question here. I have read here, and on NFCF where some have stated that there is no other way but Acts 2:38 for salvation, but then they state that "God is sovereign, and will judge". I see this as a loophole just as much as the light doctrine is a loophole. Either Act 2:38 is the only response acceptable that will bring salvation, or its not.

We're going to be judged by our deeds/works. Ro 2:6 God is a righteous judge and cannot lie and doesn't respect one person more than another. He will be fair and just and will judge us according to his word. Joh 12:48

I can't see Him arbitrarily going against His word on judgement day. All the mercy of God is while we are alive once we are dead then the record of our deeds will be what convicts us or vindicates us. If we obeyed the gospel by the grace of God, our sinful deeds/words/thoughts are forgiven and we will be found with the righteousness of Christ.

[RevDWW]

God in His sovernigty will deal justly with all who stand before His judgement seat.

We each have to deal with the knowledge we have or can gain by seeking God. Those who seek Him will find Him.

Rom 2:11 - 29 (KJV)
11For there is no respect of persons with God.
12For as many as have sinned without law shall also perish without law: and as many as have sinned in the law shall be judged by the law;
13(For not the hearers of the law are just before God, but the doers of the law shall be justified.
14For when the Gentiles, which have not the law, do by nature the things contained in the law, these, having not the law, are a law unto themselves:
15Which show the work of the law written in their hearts, their conscience also bearing witness, and their thoughts the mean while accusing or else excusing one another
16In the day when God shall judge the secrets of men by Jesus Christ according to my gospel.
17Behold, thou art called a Jew, and restest in the law, and makest thy boast of God,
18And knowest his will, and approvest the things that are more excellent, being instructed out of the law;
19And art confident that thou thyself art a guide of the blind, a light of them which are in darkness,
20An instructor of the foolish, a teacher of babes, which hast the form of knowledge and of the truth in the law.
21Thou therefore which teachest another, teachest thou not thyself? thou that preachest a man should not steal, dost thou steal?
22Thou that sayest a man should not commit adultery, dost thou commit adultery? thou that abhorrest idols, dost thou commit sacrilege?
23Thou that makest thy boast of the law, through breaking the law dishonourest thou God?
24For the name of God is blasphemed among the Gentiles through you, as it is written.
25For circumcision verily profiteth, if thou keep the law: but if thou be a breaker of the law, thy circumcision is made uncircumcision.
26Therefore if the uncircumcision keep the righteousness of the law, shall not his uncircumcision be counted for circumcision?
27And shall not uncircumcision which is by nature, if it fulfil the law, judge thee, who by the letter and circumcision dost transgress the law?
28For he is not a Jew, which is one outwardly; neither is that circumcision, which is outward in the flesh:
29But he is a Jew, which is one inwardly; and circumcision is that of the heart, in the spirit, and not in the letter; whose praise is not of men, but of God.