Social drinking?

[Sean]

Originally Posted by Aquila

You're woefully uninformed with the manner and custom concerning wine in NT times and Eastern cultures. They didn't go as overboard as we do in the West my friend. They pace themselves quiet well. In fact, throughout Italy and Greece today people drink wine on their lunch breaks at work. It's cultural. They don't drink to get wasted. In fact, when they sense that they have had too much, they typically start eating. This mitigates the onset of drunkenness. It's almost unheard of to consume wine without food in the East and the Mediterranean. This wedding was not only full of wine... but full of food!

Well, Gal 5 was written to them...They were to stop the gettin' high nonsense when they received the Holy Ghost, thats a fact. Just like it is for you and I today. Or do you also think its okay to smoke pot in moderation also?

[FlamingZword]

Originally Posted by Sean

So, do you think Jesus turning the water into wine, offered rotten, fermented juice to the guests? I wonder what percentage of alcohol it was Jesus made when he made his moonshine?...LOL

It was just good ol fresh grape juice, like delicious fruit punch at a Christian wedding these days.....Jesus would NEVER cause folks to be drunkards, it is against the very passages in the N.T. He and the Apostles spoke about incessantly.

The words of the ruler of the feast tells us a lot.

When the ruler of the feast had tasted the water that was made wine
"And said to him, Every man at the beginning does set forth good wine; and when men have well drunk, then that which is worse: but you have kept the good wine until now"

If the wine was grape juice, how could people tell the difference between good wine and the worse wine?

Grape juice does not make people drunk.

The words of the ruler clearly indicate that Jesus created the "good wine"
and also clearly indicate that this "good wine" made people drunk.

it is nonsense to say that it was grape juice for the context of the speech reveals what kind of wine Jesus made.
I have yet to see people get drunk on fruit punch.

[Aquila]

Originally Posted by Sean

Well, Gal 5 was written to them...They were to stop the gettin' high nonsense when they received the Holy Ghost, thats a fact. Just like it is for you and I today. Or do you also think its okay to smoke pot in moderation also?

Sean, you're flipping. lol

I do know that alcoholic wine was the norm. It was not only the safest to drink, but it was enjoyed at celebrations. It was also commonly diluted when people just wanted something tasty to drink. It also soothed the stomach and aids in digestion, as we know it does today.

Now... as for "pot"... lol

I don't know about pot. However, I do know that it was customary throughout the Middle East from the most ancient of times for men to gather after dinner to socialize and chew the leaves of a plant known as khat. They'd chew the leaves and often use them to clean their teeth. The men are typically very jovial and laughter abounds while gathered around a bowl of these leaves. Conversation often lasts for a couple hours at the very least. Chewing these leaves was nearly a universal practice. What we've discovered is that these leaves actually contain a amphetamine-like stimulant. lol Of course... the ancients didn't know this. They simply thought this was a joyful gathering with a very happy plant. lol

So... while I don't know what early Christians throughout the Middle East would have done regarding pot... odds are... they chewed khat.

[Aquila]

Originally Posted by FlamingZword

The words of the ruler of the feast tells us a lot.

When the ruler of the feast had tasted the water that was made wine
"And said to him, Every man at the beginning does set forth good wine; and when men have well drunk, then that which is worse: but you have kept the good wine until now"

If the wine was grape juice, how could people tell the difference between good wine and the worse wine?

Grape juice does not make people drunk.

The words of the ruler clearly indicate that Jesus created the "good wine"
and also clearly indicate that this "good wine" made people drunk.

it is nonsense to say that it was grape juice for the context of the speech reveals what kind of wine Jesus made.
I have yet to see people get drunk on fruit punch.

It's important to note that "drunkenness" was frowned upon by ancient society, especially at a wedding. Someone who became "drunk" would most likely be escorted out of the celebration. However, it was a wedding! They most likely continued to not only drink, but eat and eat and eat throughout the evening. It wasn't a drunken revelry. It was a customary Middle Eastern wedding party.

[Fionn mac Cumh]

Last night on the way to church I had a revelation about this. Isnt it all about winning people to Christ? IMHO, weather the Bible says its ok or not, most people assume any type of drinking as not something Christians do. So if we drink with people that we want to win to Christ, our testimony will be weak and wont win anyone. Thats just my two cents.

[Evang.Benincasa]

Originally Posted by FlamingZword

The words of the ruler of the feast tells us a lot.

When the ruler of the feast had tasted the water that was made wine
"And said to him, Every man at the beginning does set forth good wine; and when men have well drunk, then that which is worse: but you have kept the good wine until now"

If the wine was grape juice, how could people tell the difference between good wine and the worse wine?

Grape juice does not make people drunk.

The words of the ruler clearly indicate that Jesus created the "good wine"
and also clearly indicate that this "good wine" made people drunk.

it is nonsense to say that it was grape juice for the context of the speech reveals what kind of wine Jesus made.
I have yet to see people get drunk on fruit punch.

The three words "have well drunk" in your King James Bibles is translated from one Greek word μεθύω which literally means intoxicated.

Jesus first miracle was to create fermented wine from water.

So, for the last 2,000 years when anyone who knew the Greek came across μεθύω they immediately would understand what the writer was trying to say.

In the Latin Vulgate translates the Greek word μεθύω to the Latin word inebriati from where we get the English word "inebriate".

This debate is over.

[Evang.Benincasa]

Originally Posted by Fionn mac Cumh

Last night on the way to church I had a revelation about this. Isnt it all about winning people to Christ? IMHO, weather the Bible says its ok or not, most people assume any type of drinking as not something Christians do. So if we drink with people that we want to win to Christ, our testimony will be weak and wont win anyone. Thats just my two cents.

That doesn't sound like the words of a fine Fianna warrior off to battle!

I see the Christianity has tamed you a wee bit now Mr Fionn mac Cumh.

[Fionn mac Cumh]

Originally Posted by Evang.Benincasa

That doesn't sound like the words of a fine Fianna warrior off to battle!

I see the Christianity has tamed you a wee bit now Mr Fionn mac Cumh.

First off, the fact that you know what a Fianna warrior is, makes you the coolest person on here. Second, I thank GOD I am not what I used to be :-)

[Evang.Benincasa]

Originally Posted by Fionn mac Cumh

First off, the fact that you know what a Fianna warrior is, makes you the coolest person on here. Second, I thank GOD I am not what I used to be :-)

The coolest person on here is you because you are happy you are not what you used to be!

Praise Jesus!

[Aquila]

Originally Posted by Fionn mac Cumh

Last night on the way to church I had a revelation about this. Isnt it all about winning people to Christ? IMHO, weather the Bible says its ok or not, most people assume any type of drinking as not something Christians do. So if we drink with people that we want to win to Christ, our testimony will be weak and wont win anyone. Thats just my two cents.

I've never found that to be the case. Most folks become real interested in talking about God and what I believe about Jesus if they see me open a Guinness at a BBQ. They like to see a Christian who actually enjoys living life and openly enjoys some of life's blessings. You'd be amazed at what they really think of "teetotaler" Christians when they realize that you aren't one. It's even evolved into a full scale Bible study over a couple beers. Nobody getting "drunk"... I don't even think we drank them fast enough for a serious buzz. Of course, there were burgers and hot dogs. So no doubt the food balanced it all out.

Regardless of what people think... the issue is... WHAT DOES THE BIBLE SAY?

If something isn't a sin... it's not a sin. Sure, be wise as to when you partake. But there is no need to condemn anyone who does partake.