In fact, even if we do something wonderful, though not quite perfect, do we get any credit? No! See, everything we do that's any good at all is really God working through us. We're not capable of doing anything good, of our own volition. But when we mess up? Do something way, way short of perfect? Something bad? That's us.
I once heard a comedian talking about how some sports stars will thank Jesus for helping them to win the superbowl, but he said that you never hear the losers say "Yeah, we were doing really good, until Jesus made me fumble."
I once heard a comedian talking about how some sports stars will thank Jesus for helping them to win the superbowl, but he said that you never hear the losers say "Yeah, we were doing really good, until Jesus made me fumble."
In an interview after the BCS Championship game this year (UT vs Alabama), in which the star QB for UT was injured and left the game very early, Colt McCoy gave his testimony. Said God was in control. Gave all the glory to God. Yes. Apparently he blamed God for the injury, and was happy about it. (He didn't seem happy, but I'm sure there was joy on the inside.)
You seem to be tying the Bible's clarity with the Bible's accuracy. It's true, therefore it is clear. Is that what you are saying?
If the existence of disagreements is not proof that it is unclear, what explains the disagreements? Take an issue about which there is a dispute. If there are, say, two versions of a doctrine (most have way more than two, I think!), and if the truth is clear, what does that say about the side who holds to the wrong view? Are they dishonest? Some have said as much, here on AFF. They say if you are honest in your search, the Holy Spirit will lead you to the truth.
Note bolded: Yes! Absolutely! Either the Bible is completely accurate or its not...... it really is that simple. I believe it to be accurate.
The existence of disagreements among man regarding any of its contents does not make the Bible "unclear," only that men disagree concerning the things which it asserts as truth. You and I could dispute just about everything that the Bible asserts as truth, but does that make the Bible wrong? Of course not! It simply means that either you or I have mis-interpreted that which it asserts as truth.
Yes, it is possible for one to be "sincere" in the things which they have accepted and embraced as truth, but by the same token this does not imply that their "sincerity" establishes the truth about a particular matter. For instance, I completely disagree with the things which the Jehovah Witnesses come to my door and endeavor to have me accept as truth, but this does not mean that I entertain doubts regarding their "sincerity" of what causes them to believe as they do. It simply means that we are in "disagreement," and not that the Bible is either unclear or in error.
I would like to explore this idea more. Unfortunately, Lafon has marked me. But does anyone else have thoughts on the matter?
I reread his post a couple of times, and I still can't make heads or tails of it. I suspect he may have misunderstood what I proposed (the bolded part above) as his position, which he said was correct, but nothing following that in his post supported it. Some of it could have been written by me or anyone else who was actually supporting the opposite! Namely, that the Bible is not clear.
I can separate the two ideas: 1) the Bible is (or isn't) clear and 2) the Bible is (or isn't) true. It seems that Lafon has trouble doing that. I think he thinks "clear" and "true" are synonyms, or something.
Anyway, what are your thoughts? If the Bible is true, would it necessarily be clear in its presentation of the truth?
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Hebrews 13:23 Know ye that our brother Timothy is set at liberty
Anyway, what are your thoughts? If the Bible is true, would it necessarily be clear in its presentation of the truth?
I hope to write this so that it is understood....I might get real dirty from all the tomatoes and garbage that will get thrown at me. LOL
I believe the Bible is true. I believe many things are not clear, but I believe what was written was clear to those that read what was written to THEM back then.
God knows all, so I believe God knew one day a bunch of men would get together and bind a book and call it the Bible. Yes, He knew what they would decide was His "Word" and what wasn't. But....HE did NOT put the Bible together and HE did not have all the "letters" and writings written just for little old us. THAT is what I think the problem is with all the debates "Christians" have. Somehow they think God put the Bible together.
All the above will cause some to believe maybe I don't believe the Bible or that I am not a Christian. Nope, not so. I just don't fool myself into believing that a bunch of men just happened to get all the exact writings, and only those writings, that are inspired by God in one bound book. There are even some "letters" that are sort of missing, because there are instructions to read things that are not in the Bible.
All that to answer you question. In my opinion, of course there are things that are not clear in the Bible, because none of the Bible was personally written to me. The writers did not know that some day what they wrote would be bound in a book for people to read thousands of years later.
I think it is highly improbable that any two individuals believe the exact same thing in all matters of faith even those who proclaim the same faith. Overall I think we have more in common than we do not have in common in all faiths, but we choose to see the differences and only gravitate to those that resemble our faith. It's like looking in a mirror and being attracted to the image of yourself, it's only natural. The challenge is breaking free from that and accepting others for who they are and the fruit they produce instead of their doctrine. Remember when Jesus rebuked his disciples, " 38And John answered him, saying, Master, we saw one casting out devils in thy name, and he followeth not us: and we forbad him, because he followeth not us.
39But Jesus said, Forbid him not: for there is no man which shall do a miracle in my name, that can lightly speak evil of me.
40For he that is not against us is on our part. Point being they are doing work in his name and we should not be critical of those who doing good in the name of Jesus.
I think it is highly improbable that any two individuals believe the exact same thing in all matters of faith even those who proclaim the same faith. Overall I think we have more in common than we do not have in common in all faiths, but we choose to see the differences and only gravitate to those that resemble our faith. It's like looking in a mirror and being attracted to the image of yourself, it's only natural. The challenge is breaking free from that and accepting others for who they are and the fruit they produce instead of their doctrine. Remember when Jesus rebuked his disciples, " 38And John answered him, saying, Master, we saw one casting out devils in thy name, and he followeth not us: and we forbad him, because he followeth not us.
39But Jesus said, Forbid him not: for there is no man which shall do a miracle in my name, that can lightly speak evil of me.
40For he that is not against us is on our part. Point being they are doing work in his name and we should not be critical of those who doing good in the name of Jesus.
Good thoughts. Well, except maybe:
"It's like looking in a mirror and being attracted to the image of yourself, it's only natural."
Speak for yourself!
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Hebrews 13:23 Know ye that our brother Timothy is set at liberty
.....While we have concluded that it is only meaningful to seek a cause for physical reality rather than all reality (since there cannot be a cause outside all reality), what about seeking the purpose for physical reality? As stated previously, to discover the purpose for why the universe exists presupposes the existence of a personal agent who created the universe. Unless we have access to that agent’s mind, it would be difficult to ascertain the purpose it had for creating. The only sure way to know the agent’s purpose for the universe is if that agent reveals his purpose to us in some fashion. As a Christian, I would argue that the agent has done so in Scripture. God created everything for His good pleasure, to display His power, and so that we might enjoy Him forever. Such purposes, however, are not discoverable by pure reason or through empirical investigation. So while I think question three can be answered, it cannot be answered philosophically or scientifically.
In summary, the reason there is something rather than nothing is because existence is metaphysically necessary. Something must exist. Nothingness is logically/metaphysically impossible. At least one existent within the whole of reality is a necessary being who has always existed, who carries in himself the sufficient reason for his own existence, and is the source of being for every other existing thing.....
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His banner over me is LOVE.... My soul followeth hard after thee....Love one another with a pure heart fervently. Jesus saith unto her, Said I not unto thee, that, if thou wouldest believe, thou shouldest see the glory of God?
To be a servant of God, it will cost us our total commitment to God, and God alone. His burden must be our burden... Sis Alvear
Don't you love hindsight? It's so much easier than, say, foresight. I bet Adam and Eve wished they could go back and rethink the fateful decision to eat that fruit! But how were they supposed to know that when God said "in the day that thou eatest thereof thou shalt surely die" that He really meant "...you will bring the curse of death upon yourselves and all your descendants throughout eternity".
Adam must have said "Sure wish I had a time machine."
Of course, the original warning should have been enough, even it if was a bit understated. (A bit?!) I mean seriously, who'd want to die the very same day you eat something? Again, a time machine would have been nice. Actually, it probably wouldn't help. Tell Eve not to believe the serpent, fill her in on the full details of the consequences of eating the fruit, and, well, now she has three conflicting stories to think about, instead of just two.
See, the real problem was a lack of knowledge of good and evil. She and Adam had no idea what a lie was, so were unprepared to deal with it, or to figure out who was lying. So, in order to know how to make the right choice, they'd have to eat that fruit. Talk about a Catch 22!
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Hebrews 13:23 Know ye that our brother Timothy is set at liberty
In my opinion, of course there are things that are not clear in the Bible, because none of the Bible was personally written to me. The writers did not know that some day what they wrote would be bound in a book for people to read thousands of years later.
My soul followeth hard after thee....Love one another with a pure heart fervently. 
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