Modesty as described by the General Youth Division

[rgcraig]

Originally Posted by dizzyde

I have to say Renda, I have not heard this very much. Certainly not in my home church, and I don't remember hearing it much at district events. (disclaimer, I tend to not go to those much, and I might have blocked it out if I had...)

I don't think it is quite across the board as I am seeing projected here, but I do not deny that it is becoming a issue.

I am going to a district Ladies Conference in a few weeks, I will be listening to hear how or if this is presented there.

Originally Posted by Pressing-On

I agree, Dizzy. I think they may focus on dressing modestly with no jewelry and in dresses, but not specifically focusing on the need to have an Apostolic Identity. I've not seen or heard that.

I have one coming up as well. I'll report whether that is the main message being propagated. But I won't be posting pictures making fun of people. LOL!

Well, there are two focuses on AI that we've been discussing on the forum the past few days.

DKB mentioned it in his talk with Bro. Coon and the session on AI that was offered at YC. Wasn't called dressing modestly - it was called Apostolic Identity.

[noeticknight]

Originally Posted by Pressing-On

LOL! Well, if you don't understand that, then I can't help you.

Uh, carnal vs. spiritual. It's not that hard. Think about it a little bit.

I decided to make it easy for you. If someone asked you what decision you think they should make, would you say, "Whatever you decide on will be fine" OR do you say, "I'll pray about it with you." That's the difference between carnal and spiritual.

"Reasoning" being the operative word here, I would think praying with someone doesn't quite qualify. Colleges offer many courses which train students to think critically, and help to "carnally" reason the finer points of logical discourse, but I've never seen one yet, not even in Divinity School, labeled "Spiritual Reasoning 101."

I don't think it necessary to exclude our brain from the equation, even when it comes to "spiritual" matters. Offering up advice grounded in good sense and wisdom doesn't lose it's value just because it isn't accompanied by the pouring on of anointing oil.

[Pressing-On]

Originally Posted by noeticknight

"Reasoning" being the operative word here, I would think praying with someone doesn't quite qualify. Colleges offer many courses which train students to think critically, and help to "carnally" reason the finer points of logical discourse, but I've never seen one yet, not even in Divinity School, labeled "Spiritual Reasoning 101."

I don't think it necessary to exclude our brain from the equation, even when it comes to "spiritual" matters. Offering up advice grounded in good sense and wisdom doesn't lose it's value just because it isn't accompanied by the pouring on of anointing oil.

Oh, I see. So, if we pray for direction we are excluding our brain from the equation. But, if we use critical thinking before passing that by God, we are college level intelligent?

"Seek ye FIRST the kingdom of God and His righteousness and all these things will be added unto you."

Thank you, but I think I will pray before I make decisions. My critical thinking never leaves, I just get more secure and concise direction after I pray.

[noeticknight]

Originally Posted by Pressing-On

Oh, I see. So, if we pray for direction we are excluding our brain from the equation. But, if we use critical thinking before passing that by God, we are college level intelligent?

"Seek ye FIRST the kingdom of God and His righteousness and all these things will be added unto you."

Thank you, but I think I will pray before I make decisions. My critical thinking never leaves, I just get more secure and concise direction after I pray.

They last time I checked, the Book of Proverbs didn't give us "The Lord's Prayer," but it sure did drive home the point about "getting understanding and wisdom," the principle things in life. And yes, Proverbs 26:3 is just as much Bible as 1 Thessalonians 5:17.

Hope you're not forcing a dichotomy between thinking and praying?

[Pressing-On]

Originally Posted by noeticknight

They last time I checked, the Book of Proverbs didn't give us "The Lord's Prayer," but it sure did drive home the point about "getting understanding and wisdom," the principle things in life. And yes, Proverbs 26:3 is just as much Bible as 1 Thessalonians 5:17.

Hope you're not forcing a dichotomy between thinking and praying?

I hope you aren't thinking you gain understanding and wisdom without praying. Praying gives you direction wherein enabling you to utilize your understanding and wisdom. You skipping time on your knees, noeticknight?

[MissBrattified]

Originally Posted by noeticknight

They last time I checked, the Book of Proverbs didn't give us "The Lord's Prayer," but it sure did drive home the point about "getting understanding and wisdom," the principle things in life. And yes, Proverbs 26:3 is just as much Bible as 1 Thessalonians 5:17.

Hope you're not forcing a dichotomy between thinking and praying?

"Getting understanding and wisdom" is definitely encouraged, but one should know where to look.

I Kings 3:9 Give therefore thy servant an understanding heart to judge thy people, that I may discern between good and bad: for who is able to judge this thy so great a people?
I Kings 3:10 And the speech pleased the Lord, that Solomon had asked this thing.
I Kings 3:11 And God said unto him, Because thou hast asked this thing, and hast not asked for thyself long life; neither hast asked riches for thyself, nor hast asked the life of thine enemies; but hast asked for thyself understanding to discern judgment;
I Kings 3:12 Behold, I have done according to thy words: lo, I have given thee a wise and an understanding heart; so that there was none like thee before thee, neither after thee shall any arise like unto thee.


I Kings 4:29 And God gave Solomon wisdom and understanding exceeding much, and largeness of heart, even as the sand that is on the sea shore.

James 1:5 If any of you lack wisdom, let him ask of God, that giveth to all men liberally, and upbraideth not; and it shall be given him.

*Ahem* So...

Solomon's wisdom was a direct result of His prayer.

However, beyond that, it could be noted that Solomon then possessed wisdom and understanding, and he probably didn't need to ask God AGAIN everytime a new situation arose.

[DAII]

I have to think that the wisest man I ever encountered in my life would attribute it to his tireless alone time with the Master.

I would interrupt him all the time for five bucks to go hang out with my friends.

That being said there is a difference between wisdom and knowledge.

[MissBrattified]

Originally Posted by DAII

I have to think that the wisest man I ever encountered in my life would attribute it to his tireless alone time with the Master.

I would interrupt him all the time for five bucks to go hang out with my friends.

That being said there is a difference between wisdom and knowledge.

[noeticknight]

Originally Posted by Pressing-On

I hope you aren't thinking you gain understanding and wisdom without praying. Praying gives you direction wherein enabling you to utilize your understanding and wisdom. You skipping time on your knees, noeticknight?

I'm certainly not forcing a decision between the two, if that's what you mean. I've seen it both ways, people too "learned" to pick up the Good Book, and people too "spiritual" to pick up "Two Treatises of Government." I find the latter more hypocritical though. They go to the hospital, but usually don't inquire about the good doc's faith before receiving service. They down talk psychiatrists, but don't consider that modern Christian counseling is built upon the foundation of secular research. They benefit from "worldly wisdom," including the latest technology that human engineering can afford, but fail to attribute credit deserved where credit is due. Of course, all glory belongs to God, but I have to believe even he must find it amusing that some deny the gifts he has given us.


Prayer is vital, but "listening" to His Word is just as important. As someone once said, "...sometimes you just have to shut up and let God talk back to you."

[noeticknight]

Originally Posted by MissBrattified

*Ahem* So...

Solomon's wisdom was a direct result of His prayer.

However, beyond that, it could be noted that Solomon then possessed wisdom and understanding, and he probably didn't need to ask God AGAIN everytime a new situation arose.

Solomon was an anomaly, however, you are correct. His relationship with God enabled him to possess great wisdom and understanding. This of course, was predicated on his "heart position" with God. God saw his humility, and honored him with majesty.

With that said, Every human body is essentially wired the same. Physically, the heart pumps the blood, and the brain handles the cognitive duties. Some of us operate in reverse spiritually. They think with their heart, and the mental faculties are just a means to keep them functioning after the fact. I think that is the point I was getting at, I think...