Don't Press the "Like" Button in Saudi Arabia

[shazeep]

"2.a I get it. These muslims in SA should just go to hell, right? I mean, the few who dare try to convert from islam should simply accept their fate. After all, Paul said "to die is gain." Amiright?! Besides, it bums me out thinking about people in other countries being oppressed. I'm depressed enough reading local and national news, simply eliminating thought of what's happening internationally would alleviate a bit of that."

well wadr see that it is your opinion that anyone anywhere is going to hell, and really is not your business. As evidence i suggest that if you go and tell someone, a Muslim, that you have decided they are going to hell, and you are here to "help" them, you already know the reaction you would get. Understand the extreme hypocrisy in this view, which comes from the best of intentions. If any wish to convert from Islam, they merely need to commit themselves, and put them feet to work.

As for the rest, the obvious answer, to me, is to stop consuming local/national news, and follow the awesome advice in your last thought there--"simply eliminating thought of what's happening internationally." viola.

This also takes care of all of 3. All of these answers are simple Scripture, even if they sound harsh. We have plenty of our own problems, i'm sure you agree--well, you already just did--and so see how this reflects as take the beam from your own eye first

i mean, KSA is a kingdom--meaning that the king there can rightfully kill the guy, if he wants. It is naive to superimpose our (already failed?) ideas of "democracy" upon the situation. Don't we have a thread here about Texans meeting peacefully and getting mobbed by cops and feds, taking their fingerprints etc, and tramping all over their rights? So, please

[Walks_in_islam]

Originally Posted by n david

In this day and age, if one wants to be heard, they will be. Silence is approval.


"Morality of the point?" Let's revisit the comment:

"The real "good grief" here is the blindness and hypocrisy, wadr. Anyone here going to KSA anytime soon? Know anyone there, any relatives? Doesn't your own religion prohibit TV for pretty much what you are now abusing the web for?"

2.a - I'm not sure what the point was. Are you trying to say that if we're not going to KSA, don't know anyone or have relatives from there, we shouldn't talk about the religious persecution or human rights abuses happening there? Also, I haven't been in the UPC for over a decade now, but last I checked, the UPCI didn't sentence people to be flogged or put to death for owning or watching a TV!


Okay, we have figurative daughters working at whorehouses all around the US, so let's talk about it. What do you want to say about it?

They only flog their children for watching TV.

You aren't going anywhere. You don't have a passport.

I like many things on my facebook page. Im still here. That kid blogger publicly challenged the government and that was why he was arrested. Not for facebook likes, not for any personal beliefs he held, and not for anything he did privately. People who challenge the government here are considered security risks and everything he ever did was investigated.

Whether you agree or not there are laws here and if we want to live here we respect these laws. They are not secret laws. One of them is that you can work for change, and many do, but publicly stirring up sentiment against the government or working to destabilize the government is not the way to do it.

The punishment was excessive and the fact that the kid got one lashing then they were pended indefinitely is a quiet admission of that. This is smoke. The kid has some jail time then he will go free.

[Walks_in_islam]

Originally Posted by Fionn mac Cumh

What a joke. The stain of Islam must be cleansed from the earth or they need to get into this century.

Hitler also spoke of stains to be removed. Nice company you keep.

[Walks_in_islam]

Originally Posted by Pressing-On

The Lord warned me in a dream, a few years ago, that Facebook would be used by Muslims as a vehicle to tract down and kill Christians. That certainly is playing out to be true.

Victoria Jackson, conservative activist, was targeted after some remarks she made were taken out of context. Her address was published publicly.

It is beyond me why any person would put up their profile on social media thinking that anything is private. Not just for the above reason, but generally.

Good grief.

[n david]

Originally Posted by shazeep

i mean, KSA is a kingdom--meaning that the king there can rightfully kill the guy, if he wants. It is naive to superimpose our (already failed?) ideas of "democracy" upon the situation.

Ironic how you claim it's okay for the SA king to kill anyone he wants. Oh, right, we're not living there, nor do we have relatives living there, so we should just pretend human rights abuses aren't happening there.

Man, did we win the lottery by not being born in the Middle East!

Again, I get it. You and WIi claim that since SA has "laws" that people should just accept them and ignore the abuses there. North Korea has laws as well. Doesn't mean they're right. Doesn't mean they're just.

And no, I don't expect American democracy to work in the Middle East. I never thought it would work when Bush tried imposing it in Iraq and Afghanistan. The problem is the people, and muslims specifically. They are why democracy will never work.

Originally Posted by shazeep

Don't we have a thread here about Texans meeting peacefully and getting mobbed by cops and feds, taking their fingerprints etc, and tramping all over their rights? So, please

That was wrong. I stated such. Also, unlike SA, this is rare and not the norm. And quite likely, the group will file a lawsuit for civil rights violations....again, something which they would never be able to do in SA. We have amendments which guarantee rights, unlike SA. So I'm not sure what your comment here was trying to prove.

[shazeep]

Originally Posted by n david

Ironic how you claim it's okay for the SA king to kill anyone he wants.

i made no such claim; that it is "okay," or would be right. understand that i feel the same way you do about the OP, but also am not surprised that there was more to the story.

Originally Posted by n david

Oh, right, we're not living there, nor do we have relatives living there, so we should just pretend human rights abuses aren't happening there.

well, please understand that it might be viewed that you are essentially "pretending" to do something about it, while in fact just helping to fan flames. Another way to put this is, if you were to go out into the immediate area surrounding your domain, to your immediate neighbor, who is, say, a farmer, or has some other actual business that he is attending to, and put this story to him, imagine the look you might get. So, it is all in one's pov.

i'll repeat that you are perfectly free to support this law-breaker any way you deem advisable. Your pov is no less valid than mine. But grasp that there are consequences for actions, and we judge others by their words.

Originally Posted by n david

Man, did we win the lottery by not being born in the Middle East!

perhaps, and perhaps not. This ignores thAT WE SURELY GET A DISTORTED PICTURE oops of a place, any place, if our view comes from the news. It is judging the entire country by a snippet of factoid that has been deemed "newsworthy," which is by definition "sensational." It also denies, imo, that the people there have the same power that we do, and our forefathers did...that a nation of people anywhere, throughout history have not had, to rise up and throw off oppression.

i cannot comment specifically on KSA, as i have not been there--but i can report that virtually all of our "news" of the rest of the mideast paints a completely warped image; it is a very nice place. They eat real food. They are warm-hearted, and mind their own business.

Originally Posted by n david

Again, I get it. You and WIi claim that since SA has "laws" that people should just accept them and ignore the abuses there. North Korea has laws as well. Doesn't mean they're right. Doesn't mean they're just.

absolutely, i agree. it does, however, mean that they are none of your business. Complaining never helps anything. I would support anyone from...anywhere, really, who asked my help--offer them a place to sleep, if i had it, etc., but my best help would be to advise them to stop whining, and either change it, live with it, or leave. I diverge from WII here, and applaud the guy for his bravery; i am all for "destabilizing" oppressive governments, which i believe are rotten to the core; satan rules them, after all. There is no "fixing" fascism from within. A kingdom might be different, tho, don't know--but there is plenty of precedent, Scriptural precedent, for regime change in a kingdom--kill the king. Better yet, divorce yourself from the world, and thus the oppression.

Originally Posted by n david

And no, I don't expect American democracy to work in the Middle East. I never thought it would work when Bush tried imposing it in Iraq and Afghanistan. The problem is the people, and muslims specifically. They are why democracy will never work.

well, i disagree, and find that the problem is this ersatz democracy we live under. so strange to me, how people in the mideast seem to be so much more democratic than us--it shows up in their problem-solving, etc. Democracy ends up just being the latest, most diabolical way to rob a nation of their human rights. Masons invented democratic rebublics; that should tell you all you need to know. The problem is the people, all right--but which people? The ones who do not respect fences.

Originally Posted by n david

That (edit: the "Texas" thing) was wrong. I stated such. Also, unlike SA, this is rare and not the norm. And quite likely, the group will file a lawsuit for civil rights violations....again, something which they would never be able to do in SA. We have amendments which guarantee rights, unlike SA. So I'm not sure what your comment here was trying to prove.

well, i'm not trying to prove anything; but this is much more cogent, for us, more meaningful. You say "rare, not the norm," but it is becoming the norm as we speak. I suspect a false flag here, specifically to incite a court battle, in front of some paid-for judge, to trample on a few more of your guaranteed rights--which i'm pretty sure many would argue are non-existent. I guess we'll see.

[Walks_in_islam]

Originally Posted by n david

Ironic how you claim it's okay for the SA king to kill anyone he wants. Oh, right, we're not living there, nor do we have relatives living there, so we should just pretend human rights abuses aren't happening there.

Man, did we win the lottery by not being born in the Middle East!

Again, I get it. You and WIi claim that since SA has "laws" that people should just accept them and ignore the abuses there. North Korea has laws as well. Doesn't mean they're right. Doesn't mean they're just.

And no, I don't expect American democracy to work in the Middle East. I never thought it would work when Bush tried imposing it in Iraq and Afghanistan. The problem is the people, and muslims specifically. They are why democracy will never work.


That was wrong. I stated such. Also, unlike SA, this is rare and not the norm. And quite likely, the group will file a lawsuit for civil rights violations....again, something which they would never be able to do in SA. We have amendments which guarantee rights, unlike SA. So I'm not sure what your comment here was trying to prove.

Not nearly as ironic as your worship and devotion to people who shoot kids for throwing rocks and bulldoze or shoot unarmed American citizens whose only crimes are protesting throwing families out of their homes or bringing food and medical aid to people who are locked in large concentration camps behind barbed wire. No outrage at all there. Declare these actions wrong or take your hypocracy somewhere else.

Even in Saudi Arabia they dont give the death penalty for throwing rocks so when the Israeli prime minister comes snivilling to congress for money your silence means you support trial of teenagers by sniper. Put up or shut up.

[shazeep]

no kidding. Claiming that Apartheid Israhell is anything like what God intended in Scripture is just heresy. Many of its citizens agree, for what it's worth.

[n david]

Originally Posted by Walks_in_islam

Not nearly as ironic as your worship and devotion to people who shoot kids for throwing rocks and bulldoze or shoot unarmed American citizens whose only crimes are protesting throwing families out of their homes or bringing food and medical aid to people who are locked in large concentration camps behind barbed wire. No outrage at all there. Declare these actions wrong or take your hypocracy somewhere else.

Even in Saudi Arabia they dont give the death penalty for throwing rocks so when the Israeli prime minister comes snivilling to congress for money your silence means you support trial of teenagers by sniper. Put up or shut up.

Oh look, a muslim who hates Israel.

BTW, he wasn't here "snivilling" for money. He was here to make sure Congress knows obama is negotiating with people who will not keep their word, who cannot be trusted.

Go take your antisemitism somewhere else.

[n david]

Originally Posted by shazeep

i cannot comment specifically on KSA, as i have not been there--

so strange to me, how people in the mideast seem to be so much more democratic than us--it shows up in their problem-solving, etc.

Yeah, blowing themselves, and others up. Beheading people. Beating and killing women (aka "honor" killing). Ruling with an iron fist, threatening death to anyone who dare oppose.

Cause you know.... culture and laws.