Performance Or Faith Based ?

[Scott Hutchinson]

My trust is in Christ alone,yet I want to please Him and be fruitful and bear good fruit because of my appreciation of the redemption that I enjoy in Jesus Christ.

[houston]

Ouch!

[Scott Hutchinson]

Houston that scripture for your signature explains it all.

[Charnock]

Originally Posted by Amanah

My experience matches up with Romans 7

I want to obey God and try to do it by my will, but fail, then I ask God to help me and trust him by faith to change me.

We can't do it by ourselves, but if we have the desire to change our behavior to be pleasing to God, and ask God to help us make the desired changes he does.

romans 7

[15] For that which I do I allow not: for what I would, that do I not; but what I hate, that do I.
[16] If then I do that which I would not, I consent unto the law that it is good.
[17] Now then it is no more I that do it, but sin that dwelleth in me.
[18] For I know that in me (that is, in my flesh,) dwelleth no good thing: for to will is present with me; but how to perform that which is good I find not.[19] For the good that I would I do not: but the evil which I would not, that I do.
[20] Now if I do that I would not, it is no more I that do it, but sin that dwelleth in me.
[21] I find then a law, that, when I would do good, evil is present with me.
[22] For I delight in the law of God after the inward man:
[23] But I see another law in my members, warring against the law of my mind, and bringing me into captivity to the law of sin which is in my members.
[24] O wretched man that I am! who shall deliver me from the body of this death?
[25] I thank God through Jesus Christ our Lord. So then with the mind I myself serve the law of God; but with the flesh the law of sin.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Originally Posted by Charnock

Um, no, that's not how it works, bro.

You are trapped in legalism and performance-based religion.

The difference between you and me is that I realize that I cannot save myself, and don't even try. I trust in Christ alone to save me

You, on the other hand, exhaust yourself trying to prove you're worthy of love and salvation, but end up failing time after time. It's depressing. You eventually realize you just can't be good enough so you trust in Jesus to make up the difference.

Both of us end up realizing only Jesus can save us, but you waste a life figuring it out.

Romans 3 NLT

27 Can we boast, then, that we have done anything to be accepted by God? No, because our acquittal is not based on obeying the law. It is based on faith. 28 So we are made right with God through faith and not by obeying the law.

[mizpeh]

Originally Posted by Charnock

Romans 3 NLT

27 Can we boast, then, that we have done anything to be accepted by God? No, because our acquittal is not based on obeying the law. It is based on faith. 28 So we are made right with God through faith and not by obeying the law.

Charnock, where does human responsibility come into the picture? Obedience to Christ' s commandments? And how does that relate to being led by the Spirit, overcoming by the Spirit and grace of God, and crucifying the flesh with the aid of the Spirit (Rom 8)? Are you completely monergistic in regards to salvation and synergistic in regards to sanctification?

[Michael The Disciple]

We are saved by grace through faith. Grace is Gods favor whereby he reveals himself to a person causing them to believe in him. Then they are to on the basis of that faith walk in a relationship with him.

2:12 So then, my beloved, even as you have always obeyed, not only in my presence, but now much more in my absence, work out your own salvation with fear and trembling. 2:13 For it is God who works in you both to will and to work, for his good pleasure. Phil. 2:12-13

If grace is present that means God is giving manifestation of himself to keep faith alive. God expects that as in verse 12 we will always obey him.

In the end our faith will be judged by our works.

[Michael The Disciple]

To "perform" is the same as to "do". It is true we must "do" the will of God if we want to enter the kingdom. It is also true that we "do" or "perform" his will by faith.

[Amanah]

Originally Posted by Charnock

Um, no, that's not how it works, bro.

You are trapped in legalism and performance-based religion.

The difference between you and me is that I realize that I cannot save myself, and don't even try. I trust in Christ alone to save me

You, on the other hand, exhaust yourself trying to prove you're worthy of love and salvation, but end up failing time after time. It's depressing. You eventually realize you just can't be good enough so you trust in Jesus to make up the difference.

Both of us end up realizing only Jesus can save us, but you waste a life figuring it out.

But without love we are nothing, your post does not express the love of Christ or the fruit of the Spirit, there is nothing edifying or encouraging in it, but maybe it made you feel superior to slam me?

[Scott Hutchinson]

The Grace Of God certainly teaches us to behave in a responsible fashion,while we don't earn salvation by human goodness,we can fail the grace of God if we choose to live in sin,and we can fall from grace.

[Jay]

I think that we have something that we can agree on in general. The specifics are where we will part company I fear.