yea i was comprehending what scripture states that there is only on ressurection to life. and that I didnt interpret that but the bible did for me.
and seeing that you believe all sinners at some point time will be raised to life i was allowing the bible to show that there is only one ressurection of the saints
Well, I would agree to the elect being raise in the first resurrection, and the wicked dead in the second. However, just because someone is wicked dead does not mean that they cannot be refined by "...our God is a refiners fire...!!!
As I said we all apply our comprehension to scripture, even though you say you don't. Of, course you do.
__________________ For it is written, "As I live, says the Lord every knee shall bow to me, and every tongue shall give praise to God. (Romans 14:11- NASB)
Well, I would agree to the elect being raise in the first resurrection, and the wicked dead in the second. However, just because someone is wicked dead does not mean that they cannot be refined by "...our God is a refiners fire...!!!
As I said we all apply our comprehension to scripture, even though you say you don't. Of, course you do.
if i decided to break out calvinstic view of scripture, and bring to light all the scriptures that talk about those who are predestined. in view of what you believe all to be saved.
Your view would collide with what the bible declares. tho i dont view predestined as a calvinist does, however the wording is there that God Foreknew od those who would except His son.
The scripture also states in John 3:16 that who believes will not perish but have everlasting life.
so if a believer doesnt perish then those who dont believe will perish.
mark 16:16 those who believe will be saved those who dont will be condemed.
Sounds like you have your own bible. Jesus spent many days with parables talking about the wheat and the tares, the ten virgons. etc etc. to proove that those who do not believe will die in there sins and not have eternal life.
and i am not saying
Quote:
our God is a refiners fire...!!!
that God cant refine people with His fire even after their dead. Im just stating what the Bible states. That He wont. as shown in the scriptures above.
If we'd spend more time on what is practical.... lol
Who cares what is eternal or what eternal means? Talk about distracting. Let's do what we need to do and simply take the bible's warning that we do not want to go to hell. Phew! lol
__________________ ...MY THOUGHTS, ANYWAY.
"Many Christians do not try to understand what was written in a verse in the Bible. Instead they approach the passage to prove what they already believe."
I have made my kids suffer for a period of time with a belt, am I evil?
I do think you have a good question.
Yet they won't answer the question. What about God wiping out the world with a flood?
Or causing painful boils on the philistines? Or what about disease? All the emotive arguments I hear from the UR camp I've heard from atheists and pagans.
"If God is such a good God and he has all the power you say he does, why does He allow all the suffering? If I had the power I'd stop it all."
__________________ Let it be understood that Apostolic Friends Forum is an Apostolic Forum.
Apostolic is defined on AFF as:
There is One God. This one God reveals Himself distinctly as Father, Son and Holy Ghost.
The Son is God himself in a human form or "God manifested in the flesh" (1Tim 3:16)
Every sinner must repent of their sins.
That Jesus name baptism is the only biblical mode of water baptism.
That the Holy Ghost is for today and is received by faith with the initial evidence of speaking in tongues.
The saint will go on to strive to live a holy life, pleasing to God.
The concept that the lake of fire is a purifying fire comes from its name in Scripture. The lake is actually called, "the lake of fire and brimstone". Brimstone is "theon" in the Greek and was used as a divine insense to ritually purify vessels used in worship among the Greeks. You find references to kings using brimstone to purify their cups and utensiles in extra-biblical Greek literature.
Thus to the one embracing UR teaching the name, "lake of fire and brimstone", indicates a lake of judgment and purification.
That's where the notion comes from.
First of all It's the Lake of FIRE and Sulfer
Rev 20:10 and the devil who had deceived them was thrown into the lake of fire and sulfur where the beast and the false prophet were, and they will be tormented day and night forever and ever.
God destroyed Sodom with Fire and sulfer. He didn't purify those people. He purified the earth of their evil by destroying them completely
Fire and Brimestone in scriptures represents God's WRATH
Rev 14:10 he also will drink the wine of God's wrath, poured full strength into the cup of his anger, and he will be tormented with fire and sulfur in the presence of the holy angels and in the presence of the Lamb.
__________________ Let it be understood that Apostolic Friends Forum is an Apostolic Forum.
Apostolic is defined on AFF as:
There is One God. This one God reveals Himself distinctly as Father, Son and Holy Ghost.
The Son is God himself in a human form or "God manifested in the flesh" (1Tim 3:16)
Every sinner must repent of their sins.
That Jesus name baptism is the only biblical mode of water baptism.
That the Holy Ghost is for today and is received by faith with the initial evidence of speaking in tongues.
The saint will go on to strive to live a holy life, pleasing to God.
I believe enhanced interrogation of terrorist is not only not evil, but is the responsible thing to do to help protect the citizens of this country.
However, to punitively inflect pain without relief, yes is evil for any period of time!!
Your premise is still mistaken.
I think you have a contradiction. Torture is good. Making people suffer is good. Doing it for a long period of time is good, but doing it forever is evil?
Anyways, this goes to show how subjective the UR positions, being based on personal feelings. I have had the same sort of arguments with Atheists that insist a God that makes His creation suffer for any period of time can't be a good God.
Their value of what is good is based purely on their own feelings and not on what the bible says
__________________ Let it be understood that Apostolic Friends Forum is an Apostolic Forum.
Apostolic is defined on AFF as:
There is One God. This one God reveals Himself distinctly as Father, Son and Holy Ghost.
The Son is God himself in a human form or "God manifested in the flesh" (1Tim 3:16)
Every sinner must repent of their sins.
That Jesus name baptism is the only biblical mode of water baptism.
That the Holy Ghost is for today and is received by faith with the initial evidence of speaking in tongues.
The saint will go on to strive to live a holy life, pleasing to God.
If we'd spend more time on what is practical.... lol
Who cares what is eternal or what eternal means? Talk about distracting. Let's do what we need to do and simply take the bible's warning that we do not want to go to hell. Phew! lol
And let me add if even if there is no hell lets serve God with a pure heart.
__________________
Today pull up the little weeds,
The sinful thoughts subdue,
Or they will take the reins themselves
And someday master you. --Anon.
The most deadly sins do not leap upon us, they creep up on us.
I think you have a contradiction. Torture is good. Making people suffer is good. Doing it for a long period of time is good, but doing it forever is evil?
Anyways, this goes to show how subjective the UR positions, being based on personal feelings. I have had the same sort of arguments with Atheists that insist a God that makes His creation suffer for any period of time can't be a good God.
Their value of what is good is based purely on their own feelings and not on what the bible says
I never said that "torture" is good, so no contradiction.
Muslims believe in ET, I use the same arguments with them, so your argument with atheists doesn't establish anything.
__________________ For it is written, "As I live, says the Lord every knee shall bow to me, and every tongue shall give praise to God. (Romans 14:11- NASB)
If the wicked perish either by complete destruction or by being in a place of torment for all eternity,how can they be reconciled to Christ in a perishing state ?
__________________
People who are always looking for fault,can find it easily all they have to do,is look into their mirror.
There they can find plenty of fault.
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