WPF church back on the offensive?

[NewWine]

I will preface this posting by stating: This is not meant to be an attack against Bro. Wilson; he is a man of God and I respect him as such. This is only addressing the statement that he made.

I just watched the video and overall I found it to be quite political and self-serving. For what was stated I would have expected to feel more conviction/passion. I didn't feel the spirit of the Lord in what he was saying. I particularly didn't like the following statement:

" A lot of the things that you and I have been taught since our early childhood or since you came into the church are being questioned".

What I didn't like about this statement is that it insinuated that what one is taught cannot or should be questioned. I know he went on to talk about "Pentecostal Bluebloods"; but I still found that to be disturbing. I have been taught many things, yet, I have questioned those things. If one doesn't question and just accepts teachings at face value, how then can one find their salvation with fear and trembling?

[NewWine]

Originally Posted by notofworks

Someone PMed me and asked me if I'd seen this video. So I couldn't help but watch. This isn't an anti-Wilson post but can someone tell me what he does at 3:25? Couldn't he have re-filmed it???

I think you are talking about the nose thing.

[notofworks]

Originally Posted by NewWine

I think you are talking about the nose thing.

The nose thing. Yep, that would be it.

[Sam]

Originally Posted by notofworks

The nose thing. Yep, that would be it.

the nose thing?

what nose thing?

was he picking his nose while preaching?

was he wearing a nose ring?

was his nose running while he was on camera?

did he have a nose bleed?

did he blow his nose while preaching?

did he wipe his nose on his sleeve or on a curtain?

[Jeffrey]

So the man did a pseudo-nose pick. Let's not get distracted here.

[MissBrattified]

Originally Posted by Jeffrey

So the man did a pseudo-nose pick. Let's not get distracted here.

I've seen President Bush do much worse.

[MissBrattified]

Originally Posted by Sam

the nose thing?

what nose thing?

was he picking his nose while preaching?

was he wearing a nose ring?

was his nose running while he was on camera?

did he have a nose bleed?

did he blow his nose while preaching?

did he wipe his nose on his sleeve or on a curtain?

I see men do it all the time...he could have re-recorded it, but since the cameraman was also probably a man, it probably didn't occur to either of them.

He pulled on his nose, then kind of took a swipe at one nostril. He didn't actually "pick" anything that I could see. A bit gross, but typical male--sorry to be such a female chauvinist.

[Jeffrey]

Originally Posted by Socialite

review of day 1 blog. some observations.

quotes:

"let's face it, the apostolic movement is in trouble."

the problem is "pentecostal 'blue bloods'," or those who are offspring of well-known leader

"people are backsliding under the guise of 'enlightenment' "

on the subject of holiness, he asks "isn't your salvation important enough?"

then the lesson opens up with a very cheesy up-close shot of the face of the speaker. his points follow:

1. god wants to reveal himself to the world, through the church

2. god is revealed by jesus coming in flesh, the church, and he never got to a third point, assuming there was one.

(interesting to note that the physical person of christ was not given much attention, but his deeds and creeds were given plenty)

he then quotes a scripture from ephesians 2:9-11 (i believe he meant chapter 3)
this scripture is an opening benediction from paul to the ephesian churches, exhorting them that the plan of god is executed in christ, and the church is part of that extraordinary plan of god, and that this great plan of god is now being talked about even among the angels. the church is given the privilege of carrying this out. again, this is not a theological point, or even paul's focus to ephesians, but rather an opening benediction encouraging them of their great role in the church. the speaker here emphasizes the "visible" part of this (likely to try and tie somehow this visible quality into outward appearances and standards). the fact is, it's not really the context of the verse in the least. but let's just assume it was. the world can visibly see the church. what does that mean?

he then references 1 cor 10 and says we "are his body" (hopefully not accepting that this was a literal description instead of a metaphor - and one that was common in roman times)

then the popular 1 peter 2:9. i was hoping he would not pull out the "peculiar" people thing, and fortunately he made known commentary on that. but worse, he read "show forth the praises" and interpreted that as a visible quality. outside the middle english translation, virtually all translations use the word "shew" to mean "proclaim" having nothing to do with visual qualities. again, let's just assume it does for the sake of following along.

the clip ended likely to continue throughout the week.

this is going to be the "must see" for all who call themselves apostolics. pull up a chair.

I must admit that I wasn't catching is introduction. It's clear the intro purpose was to show that God cares about not just having a bride, but literally, physically presenting a bride for the world to look at - and this is where Nate would say the Text means outward appearance.

Nevermind that the whole idea of the poetic phrases, metaphors and descriptions about the church are all about making Him known, not us known. We aren't presenting ourselves, we are presenting Jesus. How much commentary of the Gospels tell us what Jesus wore everyday? How much tells us what he did and what he said everyday? To make a connection that God's "revealing of Himself" in the church is about t-shirts and make-up is very near-sighted to say the least.

The terms like we are his "body," for example, is clearly a metaphor (popular in Rome at the time), and in no ways is making a case about the body being something people pull up a chair and describe physically.

The one time Jesus speaks directly about distinction, he says that people will know you follow me because of love. That's pretty plain to me. Love undergirds every idea concerning separation.

My preliminary conclusions so far.

[*AQuietPlace*]

Originally Posted by Jeffrey

I must admit that I wasn't catching is introduction. It's clear the intro purpose was to show that God cares about not just having a bride, but literally, physically presenting a bride for the world to look at - and this is where Nate would say the Text means outward appearance.

Nevermind that the whole idea of the poetic phrases, metaphors and descriptions about the church are all about making Him known, not us known. We aren't presenting ourselves, we are presenting Jesus. How much commentary of the Gospels tell us what Jesus wore everyday? How much tells us what he did and what he said everyday? To make a connection that God's "revealing of Himself" in the church is about t-shirts and make-up is very near-sighted to say the least.

The terms like we are his "body," for example, is clearly a metaphor (popular in Rome at the time), and in no ways is making a case about the body being something people pull up a chair and describe physically.

The one time Jesus speaks directly about distinction, he says that people will know you follow me because of love. That's pretty plain to me. Love undergirds every idea concerning separation.

My preliminary conclusions so far.

Good points.

[OneAccord]

Originally Posted by Raven

Whether the "Apostolic movement" is in trouble or not shouldn't be of great concern. Organizations, fellowships, and religious orders may come and go but this I know: The Church remains triumphant! For all those fearful Chicken Littles out there, God's not worried. Everything is on time and going according to His Grand and Glorious Plan.

What is disturbing is the negative fear mongering that goes on in various venues on a regular basis. Not getting enough attention? Got a problem with identity? Need a following? ......... Create an "enemy" or "crisis" and then rally those who are gullible to your cause. It's an old method tried and true in its effect.

The Church is in beautiful shape! Its victory is guaranteed. Now your "little kingdom" may be in trouble but God's church ......NEVER!!!
Matt 16:18
18 And I say also unto thee, That thou art Peter, and upon this rock I will build my church; and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it.

Eph 1:3-12
3 Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, who hath blessed us with all spiritual blessings in heavenly places in Christ:
4 According as he hath chosen us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before him in love:
5 Having predestinated us unto the adoption of children by Jesus Christ to himself, according to the good pleasure of his will,
6 To the praise of the glory of his grace, wherein he hath made us accepted in the beloved.
7 In whom we have redemption through his blood, the forgiveness of sins, according to the riches of his grace;
8 Wherein he hath abounded toward us in all wisdom and prudence;
9 Having made known unto us the mystery of his will, according to his good pleasure which he hath purposed in himself:
10 That in the dispensation of the fulness of times he might gather together in one all things in Christ, both which are in heaven, and which are on earth; even in him:
11 In whom also we have obtained an inheritance, being predestinated according to the purpose of him who worketh all things after the counsel of his own will:
12 That we should be to the praise of his glory, who first trusted in Christ.

Raven

Amen, Brother. Organizations come and go. But the Church of Jesus Christ stands in victory!