Last days

[Godsdrummer]

Originally Posted by OneAccord

I've always veiwed the "last days" as having begun at Pentecost when the Holy Spirit was poured out in Acts 2.

However, in light of Heb. 1:2, the "last days" may have begun when Jesus was born. I was reading in 1 Thess. 4 how Paul said "...WE which are alive and remain...." Notice the word "WE", which seems to suggest that those living at that time would witness the Lord's return. The Thessalonian Christians read this, and seems to have mistakenly concluded that the coming of the Lord would be in their lifetime. Hence the need for Pauls 2nd letter to clarify that certain events must take place before the Lord's return. (2 Thess. 2).

In Rev. 1:19, the Lord speaks to John and says this: "Write the things which thou hast seen, and the things which are, and the things will shall be hereafter." I'm not a student of prophecy, but, if I understand anything about prophecy, it seem to have more than one meaning and, sometimes, more than one fulfillment. I think it means different things. When Jesus was speaking in Matthew 24 about endtime events, it does seem that much of waht He said was fulfilled in 70 AD with the destruction of Jerusalem. That, I believe is what Jesus told John in Rev. 1:19- "the things which are". However, the prophecy is also about "....the things that shall be hereafter...". So, we can say Matt. 24 was partially fulfilled in 70 AD, but as long as there are false Christs and false prophets (Matt. 24:24), then I believe that prophecy had not been completely fulfilled.

Thank you for your input, I see just a couple of problems. You say Matt could not be completly fulfilled because we still have false prophets and false Christ. But Jesus was speaking of that generation
Mat 24:34 Verily I say unto you, This generation shall not pass, till all these things be fulfilled. We will always have false prophets and false christ, but Jesus put a time line on his words. THAT GENERATION SHALL NOT PASS.
As for the word herafter in Revelation 1:19 it would be better translated those things that follow after. Not future happening thousands of years later, but immedianty following. Hence it is all history. There is a reason Paul tells us to study to show ourselves approved.
Again thank you for your input for that is what I ask for. I plut these things out for the concideration of all.

[Godsdrummer]

As a side line or maybee not. I had a man, a pastor a man that claims he is a man God made. Well we are all made of God lol. Anyway I was speaking with him through email concerning a couple of subjects. He made the statement to me that I did not want to know the truth I was going to go with the teaching that made the best argument. I think that is the way he said it. In other words he was saying he had revelation from God and I should just accept that at face value instead of study and looking at all arguments on the subject. In my humble opinion that is why we have so many differant churches!!! Not because of so many so called inconsitancys in the bible. The message is plain and simple, it is when man and mans traditions get in the mix that we have problems. We have many Christians that study to prove their individual teachings wrestling the scripture to their own destruction and those that follow them. We may get a revelation or understanding in one area and say "well I have the truth" and we stop there when there is always more to learn. Apostolics claim to have the whole truth because we have the understanding of the Oneness of the Godhead and baptism in the name of Jesus. Yet we stop there. We don't have the whole truth any more that the AOG, if we teach one thing that is contrary to the word of God then we do not have the full truth!!!
I am going to stop now I feel my spirit riseing up in a negative way and that is not what I want. lol
Till next time God bless
Godsdrummer/laromans12

[Truthseeker]

Originally Posted by Godsdrummer

2Ti 3:1 But know this, that in the last days grievous times shall come.
2Ti 3:2 For men shall be lovers of self, lovers of money, boastful, haughty, railers, disobedient to parents, unthankful, unholy,
2Ti 3:3 without natural affection, implacable, slanderers, without self-control, fierce, no lovers of good,
2Ti 3:4 traitors, headstrong, puffed up, lovers of pleasure rather than lovers of God;
2Ti 3:5 holding a form of godliness, but having denied the power thereof: from these also turn away.
2Ti 3:6 For of these are they that creep into houses, and take captive silly women laden with sins, led away by divers lusts,
2Ti 3:7 ever learning, and never able to come to the knowledge of the truth.

My question. What last days are Paul speaking about in this verse? This description fits many periods of time in history inculding our own.

Last dsy of the age they were living in.

[Truthseeker]

Originally Posted by Falla39

Hebrews 1:1.2
1 God, who at sundry times and in divers manners spake in time past unto the fathers by the prophets,

2 Hath in these last days spoken unto us by his Son, whom he hath appointed heir of all things, by whom also he made the worlds;

This was written in approx. AD 64. Just a few short years before the
seige and destruction of Jerusalem, prophesied by Jesus in Matt. 24, Mark
13 and Luke 21.

If those were the last days of that age of Jewish lawkeeping and animal
sacrifices, what are we living in the last days of?

Just some thoughts!

The kingdon that could not be shakin with no end,

[Godsdrummer]

Originally Posted by Truthseeker

The kingdon that could not be shakin with no end,

Originally Posted by Truthseeker

Last dsy of the age they were living in.

Good points same way I see things.

[Falla39]

Originally Posted by Truthseeker

The kingdon that could not be shakin with no end,

Amen!

Heb.12:25-29

25 See that ye refuse not him that speaketh. For if they escaped not who refused him that spake on earth, much more shall not we escape, if we turn away from him that speaketh from heaven:

26 Whose voice then shook the earth: but now he hath promised, saying, Yet once more I shake not the earth only, but also heaven.

27 And this word, Yet once more, signifieth the removing of those things that are shaken, as of things that are made, that those things which cannot be shaken may remain.

28 Wherefore we receiving a kingdom which cannot be moved, let us have grace, whereby we may serve God acceptably with reverence and godly fear:
29 For our God is a consuming fire.

[trialedbyfire]

I ran across the "all things fulfilled" doctrine a while ago, when I started studying end times verses in the Bible, and I'm interested. I have a few question, comming from my vantage point since I'm what my pastor calls a "soul sleeper" and believe in the unconsious state of the dead until the "day of ressurection" which I've always taken to be the "gathering of the saints", or rapture. I'm a post-tribulation rapture believer. So all of this fit so well, in scripture, until I stumbled upon peterism, which I think is a respectable opinion. In that case "the day of ressurection" or "Gathering of the saints" (rapture) in Matthew 24 must have occured before 70 AD. If that is the case, and I've heard this from many. I'm confused as to when this happened and if there is any historical proof of this ever happening. God bless.

[mfblume]

Originally Posted by trialedbyfire

I ran across the "all things fulfilled" doctrine a while ago, when I started studying end times verses in the Bible, and I'm interested. I have a few question, comming from my vantage point since I'm what my pastor calls a "soul sleeper" and believe in the unconsious state of the dead until the "day of ressurection" which I've always taken to be the "gathering of the saints", or rapture. I'm a post-tribulation rapture believer. So all of this fit so well, in scripture, until I stumbled upon peterism, which I think is a respectable opinion. In that case "the day of ressurection" or "Gathering of the saints" (rapture) in Matthew 24 must have occured before 70 AD. If that is the case, and I've heard this from many. I'm confused as to when this happened and if there is any historical proof of this ever happening. God bless.

Ensure you distinguish preterism from partial preterism, as partial preterism denies any resurrection except those of Christ and the others who were visibly resurrected in Jerusalem the same day He arose. Partial preterism denies any other resurrection aside from that of salvation, which is spiritual and occurs as soon as one is saved, and physical which occurred on the day Christ arose and will occur just as Christ's occurred physically in the future in one general experience. That is my view. Some good folks believe otherwise.

[ApostolicTexas]

Originally Posted by Falla39

Hebrews 1:1.2
1 God, who at sundry times and in divers manners spake in time past unto the fathers by the prophets,

2 Hath in these last days spoken unto us by his Son, whom he hath appointed heir of all things, by whom also he made the worlds;

This was written in approx. AD 64. Just a few short years before the
seige and destruction of Jerusalem, prophesied by Jesus in Matt. 24, Mark
13 and Luke 21.

If those were the last days of that age of Jewish lawkeeping and animal
sacrifices, what are we living in the last days of?

Just some thoughts!

We are living in the Age that was to come!..and guess what Brother..It is here to stay..Eph 3:21..age without end..but this does not mean there is no Heaven to go to..This is where so many [apostolic,upc] people get confused..this life on earth is NOT Heaven..when my life is expired,I will receive my {2 Cor 5:2} body from Heaven not from the grave {uhh umm}and I will see Jesus as He is..

It is amazing about some of the things we do not pay attention to.One such is a popular Pentecostal song."I will fly away" ever pay attention to the words being sung?..Hallelujah WHEN I DIE..{not raptured} I will fly away..HELLO!!!!! somebody knew what they were writing..

[Falla39]

Originally Posted by ApostolicTexas

We are living in the Age that was to come!..and guess what Brother..It is here to stay..Eph 3:21..age without end..but this does not mean there is no Heaven to go to..This is where so many [apostolic,upc] people get confused..this life on earth is NOT Heaven..when my life is expired,I will receive my {2 Cor 5:2} body from Heaven not from the grave {uhh umm}and I will see Jesus as He is..

It is amazing about some of the things we do not pay attention to.One such is a popular Pentecostal song."I will fly away" ever pay attention to the words being sung?..Hallelujah WHEN I DIE..{not raptured} I will fly away..HELLO!!!!! somebody knew what they were writing..

Psalms 90:10 NIV
The length of our days is seventy years—
or eighty, if we have the strength; yet their span is but trouble and sorrow,
for they quickly pass, and we fly away.

Falla39