Pastor's problems - Page 3

Kutless · #21 03-31-2008, 01:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Book 'em Dano

I think I heard some guy do it once in Hawaii. Me and Steve were after this murderer and it turned out to be Rich Little.....

Rich Little??????? Man you must be old!

gloryseeker · #22 03-31-2008, 06:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Baron1710

Just curious as to why you think the office of pastor has greater authority in the kingdom than other callings within the body?

Well I guess because, using your words, it's a "kingdom" and not a democracy. There is a structure of authority and according to Ephesians 4 those who in what has been termed the "five-fold" have been given to the saints to "perfect them" for the work of the ministry.

If you reduce it to simple terms, the instructor always has more authority than the student.

Quote:

Also why does a pastor get to blame the saints for not praying for him when he falls? That seems a little odd to me.

No "blame" place in my post just an understanding of responsibility within the Kingdom

A Pastor has FAR more responsibility than those who they are responsible for. BUT, what many Christians don't realize is that they have a responsibility to pray for the person with whom they are under authority.

Heb 13:17-18
17 Obey them that have the rule over you, and submit yourselves: for they watch for your souls, as they that must give account, that they may do it with joy, and not with grief: for that is unprofitable for you.
18 Pray for us: for we trust we have a good conscience, in all things willing to live honestly. (KJV)

Quote:

Are you equating pastors with dignitaries?

You have a way of inserting words that were never used. Do you have an issue with authority?

Mark 10:44
44 And whosoever of you will be the chiefest, shall be servant of all.
(KJV)

Those who truly rise to higher levels of authority become more of a servant.

Jack Shephard · #23 03-31-2008, 07:34 PM

It really comes down to the intergity of a man/women. It has already been said that this is not just a pastor thing. I have seen it tons over the years. However, I have seen a pastor preach on sexual sin for several weeks, not because he was caught up in, but because the spirit led him and there were people in the congregation that were caught up in it. This is a tool of the devil. I honestly believe that buy getting good men and women to trip up and sin on this types of issues is his way to try and discredit God and all of us. Look at the secular or at least synical world when something bad like this happend. The cut the person to shreds for being hypocritical. While they are people always like to point out problems. I firmly believe it is the devil using these things to try and discredit the Kingdom of God to the unbelievers.

jaxfam6 · #24 03-31-2008, 09:47 PM

I think we can all agree that this type of thing is at work with people in general, it is not just a pastor/preacher thing. We also can pretty much all agree that the church members should pray for the ministry.
I do not think the ministry has more authority with God than the average attendee. What gives each of us authority is our RELATIONSHIP with God. Those with less of a relationship are going to have less authority. I do not think authority with God has anything to do with positions.
I do believe that respect is something that is earned. When a pastor/preacher abuses his/her position they cause themselves to lose respect with people.
When a pastor harps on a subject I consider it more than a two or three week thing or even a couple month thing. When there is a problem and God is trying to work on it I think He will lay the subject on the heart of pastors and ministers but if it goes on very long I also think He is going to step it up and take it more one on one. When they harp on a subject it is all the time and pops up in nearly every message.
I know a minister who all he harps on is authority and how HE is the pastor and He deserves respect. His church just keeps getting smaller in size and less people call on him to preach for them. Except those that seem to have the same issues. I have seen him and heard him very little over the last 15 years but every time I do he is on the same subject. When I have asked others about him they all say that it seems to be all he can preach on. The man is obsessed with being in authority and leadership and how because of his position he is entitled to respect. Sorry but no he isn't. When you treat people like they are beneath you and you are better than they are you are not in authority nor are you a leader nor do you deserve respect.
Yes the ministry does deserve to be respected but true men and women of God actually follow the examples of Jesus.
We are all to be servents of God. We are to serve Him as well our fellow man. A servent does not go around with an attitude that they are better than everyone else. Servents are humble.

ogatt · #25 04-01-2008, 01:35 AM

This is the most bunch of nonsense i ever read!!
I preach again hair curlers and i dont curl my hair...mostly cause i dont have any
i preach again short skirts and i aint ever been tempted to play the bagpipes
i preach against church growth and that aint ever changed me
i preach against fishin on sunday and i never have been tempted to fish on sunday cause i got to many heatherns to line out for tv's dime novels, golf, short sleeves, unauthorized vacations and joinin other orginizations besides mine!
i also preach against being rich and being good looking.

jaxfam6 · #26 04-01-2008, 08:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ogatt

This is the most bunch of nonsense i ever read!!
I preach again hair curlers and i dont curl my hair...mostly cause i dont have any
i preach again short skirts and i aint ever been tempted to play the bagpipes
i preach against church growth and that aint ever changed me
i preach against fishin on sunday and i never have been tempted to fish on sunday cause i got to many heatherns to line out for tv's dime novels, golf, short sleeves, unauthorized vacations and joinin other orginizations besides mine!
i also preach against being rich and being good looking.

There are also the opposites to this particular rule. They preach against nothing that they have a problem with. So looks like your issues are audltery/fornication, gambling, homosexuality, makeup,,,,

Kutless · #27 04-01-2008, 08:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gloryseeker

Well I guess because, using your words, it's a "kingdom" and not a democracy. There is a structure of authority and according to Ephesians 4 those who in what has been termed the "five-fold" have been given to the saints to "perfect them" for the work of the ministry.

If you reduce it to simple terms, the instructor always has more authority than the student.

No "blame" place in my post just an understanding of responsibility within the Kingdom

A Pastor has FAR more responsibility than those who they are responsible for. BUT, what many Christians don't realize is that they have a responsibility to pray for the person with whom they are under authority.

Heb 13:17-18
17 Obey them that have the rule over you, and submit yourselves: for they watch for your souls, as they that must give account, that they may do it with joy, and not with grief: for that is unprofitable for you.
18 Pray for us: for we trust we have a good conscience, in all things willing to live honestly. (KJV)

You have a way of inserting words that were never used. Do you have an issue with authority?

Mark 10:44
44 And whosoever of you will be the chiefest, shall be servant of all.
(KJV)

Those who truly rise to higher levels of authority become more of a servant.

I think we nee to be extremely cautious here when placing the role of a pastor to such a lofty position. Unfortunately I think this is what we do in many cases.

Even after only being mentioned once in the Bible it is tauted as the highest position in the church. When in scripture we see its just one of the 5-fold ministry (another unbiblical term).

MissBrattified · #28 04-01-2008, 08:32 AM

jaxfam, I have noticed that.

However, we should be careful about drawing conclusions, because I have also seen pastors get up and address things over and over--because it was a very real problem among the saints.

This is a conclusion better drawn in hindsight, IMO.

ogatt · #29 04-01-2008, 10:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jaxfam6

There are also the opposites to this particular rule. They preach against nothing that they have a problem with. So looks like your issues are audltery/fornication, gambling, homosexuality, makeup,,,,

thats the problem with the heatherns in the church today EDUCATION. The done learned enough book learnin that they want to analize the preacher. when i preach against TV(every service) even tho no one has one It aint because i spent 30 minutes in the electronics department at Wal Mart I

But you do have a point. I preach against meaness and bad spirits. I also preach against marbles.
read it John 3-7 Gotta stay in the word. Especially the part about vipers and hippocrits

RandyWayne · #30 04-01-2008, 10:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kutless

I think we nee to be extremely cautious here when placing the role of a pastor to such a lofty position. Unfortunately I think this is what we do in many cases.

Even after only being mentioned once in the Bible it is tauted as the highest position in the church. When in scripture we see its just one of the 5-fold ministry (another unbiblical term).

Often the position is (mistakenly) compared to that of the prophets and Kings of ancient Israel. This is where the "touch not my anointed" is always taken so horribly out of context.