State of the Forum Address

[OneAccord]

Originally Posted by RandyWayne

This also brings up another interesting story. This past year my wife worked a number of "blocks" at different locations as a student intern for pharmacy. One of the blocks she worked was at Madison's Hospice center. It was a hard job, but also one of the most rewarding she has done. There were Catholic nuns which were simply radiant with Gods love.
(There is also a very touching story of an older woman who was staying there with less then a week to live. Her husband visited her and they both went onto a patio that backs up to every room. A half an hour later an attendant found both of them sitting at the table outside, holding hands, and dead. She died, and he died minutes later.)

That is an amazing story. The people who work for hospice, whether they be nuns or whatever, are very special people. I have a deeper respect and admiration for those who work in the medical profession. Sure, there are some who are they for a paycheck, but, by and large, medical personel are as close to saints without actually being saints. And, IMO, many are. Thanks, Bro. for sharing that story. It has left an indelible image in my mind.

[rgcraig]

I was unable to be on much yesterday, but after just reading this....Bravo!

I think this needs to be a sticky for a bit so that others do not miss it.

Originally Posted by RandyWayne

I don't know if we all consider Acts 2:38 as a "foundation" to our religion. As an example, OUR church baptizes in Jesus name by immersion yet we don't consider ourself an "Acts 2:38 Church". In fact, we consider it a very MINOR part of the Christian life.

Does the human species center their entire existence around "cutting the umbilical cord" or the "crowning" of the head during birth? How much MORE important is college and marriage then some action that took mere seconds? The entire epistles are centered around the importance of love, selflessness, and forgiveness. Yet those are the FIRST things that are ignored in the endless quest and fight for HOLINESS STANDARDS, and the all important "Acts 2:38!!!" experience.

1. Essential---Biblical New Birth, John 3:5. Acts 2:38 is the way.
2. Essential---A Crucified Life, Luke 14:27. Romans through Jude is the way.
3. Essential---Holiness, Hebrews 12:14. Biblical New Birth and A Crucified Life are the way.

Acts 2:38 is the 'door' to salvation. We MUST continue on to know the Lord. (John 8:31-32, Acts 14:22, Romans 11:20-22, Colossians 1:22-23, I Timothy 4:6,16, II Timothy 3:10-16, Hebrews 13:1, I John 3:24)

I am sorry that your experience has been so lacking in Christianity. You will be part of my prayers today.

BTW, without birth there is no need for college, marriage, etc. Without Biblical New Birth, there is no need for living the Christian life because at the end one will be lost. Those 'mere seconds' are essential.

Originally Posted by OneAccord

I am actually in agreement with you to a degree. Water baptism is, as the writer of Hebrews points out, but one of the "principles of the doctrines of Christ". While I wouldn't consider it a "minor" principle, it is, nonetheless, but one of those principles. It has been, at least in the view of the majority, the very cornerstone of the Apostolic Faith. And while that may be true, it isn't the cornerstone of the Christian Faith. Jesus stands, not only as the Cornerstone upon which His Church is built, but as the very Head of the Church of Jesus Christ. He should always be the very central mesaage of the Apostolic Movement. Not a doctrine about Him, but HE must always be our central message.

When I speak of foundation, I mean it in the sense that this is the doctrine that gives this Forum its common ground. We vary on many things, but Acts 2:38 is our common experience. I agree that its has been "pedastalized" above love, selflessness and forgiveness. I agree that those aspects of God you mentioned comprise the message we should be taking to the world. No one is saved by standards, and Acts 2:38. In my view, these are "internal messages" to establish new born Christians. Jesus and His attributes that you listed, is the saving message to the lost. That message of repentance brings sinners to the altars. Holiness standards, however we veiw them, have become "litmus" tests to determine ones spirituality. This is unfortunate. For, as we have seen time and time again, standards are raised or lowered based on who's speaking at the time. The same can be said for "doctrines". Fellowship is often based on the level of ones standards or doctrine. It should not be so. Our fellowship should be based on one thing:

Act 4:13 Now when they saw the boldness of Peter and John, and perceived that they were unlearned and ignorant men, they marvelled; and they took knowledge of them, that they had been with Jesus.

The fellowship I extend to my brother isn't necessarily based on his standards or even on his doctrine. I acknowledge a person as a brother and sister in the Lord when I percieve by their "stedfastness" (boldness) in Christ "...that they had been with Jesus". It is by their testimony they overcome, and it is by their testimony that I can tell they are in Christ. That, and that alone, tells me they are following Christ. Their label, whether it be Con or Lib, Apostolic or Pentecostal, not even Trinitarian or Oneness means nothing. It is the word of their testimony that determines that they have been with Jesus.

Romans 16:17-18, II Corinthians 4:3-4, II Corinthians 11:13-15. You seem to 'judge' peoples Christianity without scriptural basis. John 3:5 MUST happen and the ONLY examples are Acts 2:4,38, 8:14-17, 10:44-48, 19:1-7.

Without a grasp of Biblical New Birth, you will never see standards as Holiness.

I have met Buddhist and Muslims that exhibited a very Christ-like spirit. Are you saying that they are saved? If I knew your name I would pray for you specifically. You seem suspicious when you hide your identity and then imply that people are ready to meet the Lord without Biblical New Birth.

[Raven]

OneAccord
Once again your writing gift comes shining through. Excellent post! To be remembered as a "uniter" rather than a divider is the "label" I will always give you. Take it and wear it gracefully for you have earned it as one of the great posters on this Forum.
Raven

[OneAccord]

Originally Posted by R.D. Foster

Romans 16:17-18, II Corinthians 4:3-4, II Corinthians 11:13-15. You seem to 'judge' peoples Christianity without scriptural basis. John 3:5 MUST happen and the ONLY examples are Acts 2:4,38, 8:14-17, 10:44-48, 19:1-7.

Without a grasp of Biblical New Birth, you will never see standards as Holiness.

I have met Buddhist and Muslims that exhibited a very Christ-like spirit. Are you saying that they are saved? If I knew your name I would pray for you specifically. You seem suspicious when you hide your identity and then imply that people are ready to meet the Lord without Biblical New Birth.

1. With all due respect, Brother, I don't judges anyones Chritianity at all. On any basis. I am told by the Lord to refrain from the practice of judging others. A persons Chritianity is between them and God. That is one point I was attempting to make in my original post... that it isn't up to me, or you, or anyone else to decide who is, and who is not saved based on their belief system or their lifestyle. I KNOW what it takes for me to saved, which includes the New Birth of John 3. What it takes for someone else, I think I'd do best to leave that between them and God.

2. There is nothing in my post that indicates I don't have a grasp on "standards" of Holiness, or the New Birth for that matter. As stated, I know what is required of me to be saved, and I am well versed in Biblical standards ( one of which is to refrain from judging). And I'm also well versed in the myraid of Pentecostal standards that have no basis in the Word of God.
Those that are good, and aids Christian growth and spiritual unity, I accept. Those that bring bondage and division I reject outright.

3. Again, I cannot and will not judge someone else's salvation. I know of a church in Ga that is named Piney Grove Methodist Church. All the members have the Holy Ghost (Acts 2:4) and have been baptized in Jesus' Name. But they call themselves Methodist. Why? I don't know... none of my business. I know some that call themselves Apostolic who claim the same experience but are meaner than snakes. Since you seem to think its okay to judge, you tell me. Which is saved? I don't know if one who calls himself a Buddist is saved or not anymore than I can tell if you are saved. Thats God's call, not mine.

4. I am sorry you find my choice to protect my privacy suspicious. When it was necessary I posted my name here. But, because I desire your prayers, I will post it now. My name is Rick. And, I appreciate your prayers. And I will reciprocate by asking God to deal with your spirit about judgementalism and legalism. God bless you.

[Sherri]

Rick, I don't know what you do exactly, but you would make an awesome pastor!!! Your wisdom in these posts is some of the best I've ever seen on AFF. Your spirit shines through as well. I think the original post on this thread is one of the best I've ever read on here.

[My Own Eyes]

Originally Posted by Sherri

Rick, I don't know what you do exactly, but you would make an awesome pastor!!! Your wisdom in these posts is some of the best I've ever seen on AFF. Your spirit shines through as well. I think the original post on this thread is one of the best I've ever read on here.

Everyone try not to fall over in shock.....

But I agree.

I know little about what makes a good pastor, and way more than I would like to about what makes a bad one.

But Bro. Rick has been more kind and more encouraging to me than just about anyone in my experience.

[Sherri]

Originally Posted by My Own Eyes

Everyone try not to fall over in shock.....

But I agree.

I know little about what makes a good pastor, and way more than I would like to about what makes a bad one.

But Bro. Rick has been more kind and more encouraging to me than just about anyone in my experience.

[My Own Eyes]

Originally Posted by Sherri

Keep 'em guessing, that's my motto!