Maybe NotofWorks is referring to the clear statements against television and video being called an instrument of Satan in this position paper in the manual?:
The prohibition of Hollywood and television content of video receivers (NetFlix included) found in this position paper is directed to all of the constituency surely reflects an intended ban, not just mere disapproval - does it not?
Shall we also take the statement "we admonish all our people to refrain from all these practices" in the Holiness article to mean "we just think it's a good idea" for women to not cut your hair, not wear makeup and dress modestly, also, and not prohibitions - just organizational opinions and brainstorming but not fiat?
Just opinions? Never was a rule or standard of fellowship? Apostolic Identity is merely an ideal?
Thanks for the help, Tommy! Finally, someone besides me that gets it! Yes, that's exactly what I'm referring to and I've copied it and pasted it several times. Television is an "Instrument of Satan" and UPC ministers swear an oath that they will practice, preach, and teach against it, knowing in their heart they're lyin' like a dog.
And the denomination says, "We disapprove of OUR PEOPLE owning this instrument of satan." I'm about 99.999999999999999% sure that the UPC denomination would consider Prax one of "Their people."
You know....I remember back in the UPC days when we would see someone who was obviously a UPCer and my dad would say, "There's some of OUR PEOPLE."
So, why don't all you UPCers ask your pastors why he isn't strongly opposed to you having a TV or watching movies when he signed a paper saying he would be strongly opposed to them so that he could get membership to an org that says they oppose God's people (that's you) watching movies and videos for entertainment purposes? Why don't you ask him that?
I'm never in favor of revolt against a pastor, BUT......it's a darn good question. I lost just about everything I owned because I refused to sign a line that was a lie. What's wrong with phony's who continue to sign? Afraid to lose your income? Afraid your family will forsake you? Afraid of how the machinery of the system will chew you up and spit you out? Do the right thing....either get rid of your TV, unplug it in the hotel, or do the honest thing and turn in your card.
The UPC pastors I know are not nearly as legalistic as the code-thumpers in this tread.
Who cares what someone found in an obscure code that hasn't been enforced in 35 years?
A current drivers license only allows the licensee to operate within the legal limits of the law. Yet I don't expect anyone to surrender their license or their citizenship because they broke the speed limit.
Well then, THEY SHOULD BE!!! They sign a sworn oath on their souls that they'll follow the code. Your driver's license example doesn't wash. None of us have to sign a sworn oath that we'll never break the speed limit and have that signature as a condition of getting the license. Bad example. Try again.
I'm not gonna say too much, here, but anyone who was involved at the time knows what I'm talking about. It was ugly, dishonest, and cowardly.
When word got out about the number of people that could potentially leave the UPC by not signing the initial oath, word was put out that we didn't actually have to follow everything in the resolution/oath and if we simply accompanied our SIGNED resolution/oath, with a letter of explanation, we'd be covered.
The question was asked to an authority figure, "So this resolution doesn't really change anything? Is that what you're saying?" Answer: "That's exactly what I'm saying, nothing changes at all."
.......well, except you're swearing an oath to do things you'll never do.
I'm never in favor of revolt against a pastor, BUT......it's a darn good question. I lost just about everything I owned because I refused to sign a line that was a lie. What's wrong with phony's who continue to sign? Afraid to lose your income? Afraid your family will forsake you? Afraid of how the machinery of the system will chew you up and spit you out? Do the right thing....either get rid of your TV, unplug it in the hotel, or do the honest thing and turn in your card.
I know a couple that couldn't sign the AS because it made them a liar (they said) and now they can't find a church that suits the way they view things. Unable to moor their boat. What was their point in that? To lose everything for nothing? How can God be in that?
I know a couple that couldn't sign the AS because it made them a liar (they said) and now they can't find a church that suits the way they view things. Unable to moor their boat. What was their point in that? To lose everything for nothing? How can God be in that?
__________________
Hebrews 13:23 Know ye that our brother Timothy is set at liberty
In all seriousness, UP10, (and I'll admit to amplified hyperbole here to create a bit of a fuss), I think it's wrong. It's wrong for someone to sign an absolute oath on their personal word of honesty and integrity knowing full well they have zero intention of obeying what they SWORE to do. I am far from perfect and am highly flawed, but I just can't sign a sworn statement knowing I'll never do what I'm swearing to do. Barry Bonds is currently facing serious prison time for doing exactly that.
I'm going to post one thing there.
These pastors who sign this statement, if they get up in the pulpit and say that they disapprove of people having a TV in their home, but he doesn't enforce them to get rid of it; he is fulfilling the oath he signed. The pastor I'm currently under disapproves of cable tv and makes allowance for G movies that are family or inspirational. He doesn't enforce it but has made it known he disapproves.
So in order for someone to call him a liar, (which the Bible treats seriously) he would have to have never made it known such.
__________________ To be able to unite in difference carries more weight than all the opinions the universe can hold
I'm not gonna say too much, here, but anyone who was involved at the time knows what I'm talking about. It was ugly, dishonest, and cowardly.
When word got out about the number of people that could potentially leave the UPC by not signing the initial oath, word was put out that we didn't actually have to follow everything in the resolution/oath and if we simply accompanied our SIGNED resolution/oath, with a letter of explanation, we'd be covered.
The question was asked to an authority figure, "So this resolution doesn't really change anything? Is that what you're saying?" Answer: "That's exactly what I'm saying, nothing changes at all."
.......well, except you're swearing an oath to do things you'll never do.
Exactly and if the pastor does not do what he signed he would do, its a lie. I agree. I don't think I've sat under many though who haven't at least made it known their disapproval for TV or Hollywood movies and in fact preached that we shouldn't watch those. Thats as far as the statement goes. If a pastor doesn't do that, then in NOW's opinion and mine also, he has not been completely honest.
__________________ To be able to unite in difference carries more weight than all the opinions the universe can hold
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