Who's Your Next President?

[1Corinth2v4]

Originally Posted by Praxeas

According to the medical community if the brain is still functioning but the heart is stopped then only until you have exhausted efforts to REVIVE the heart then and only then can a pronouncement of death be made.

They don't. They work to get the heart going again and ONLY when they can not make it work again and the brain has gone too long with out oxygen do they make that declaration

Praxeas,


According to you and the medical community, if you can't restart the heart after it has stopped, only then you're declared dead.

Here's your quote:

only until you have exhausted efforts to REVIVE the heart then and only then can a pronouncement of death be made

So here are two simple questions.

1) If one has a "DO NOT RESUSCITATE" sticker on their driver's license or in their medical file, when are they declared dead?

Remember, you can't implement any effort to restart these people's heart. So efforts to restart the heart can't be exhausted, and according to you, only after you have exhausted efforts to revive the heart, then they're declared dead.


2) If one has a "DO NOT RESUSCITATE" order on their driver's license or medical file, are they committing suicide?

According to you and the medical community they are, due to the fact they can have procedures implemented to restart their heart and they refuse to.

[1Corinth2v4]

Originally Posted by Praxeas

BTW at what point does the spirit go to be with God and see the pearl gates? The moment the heart stops and he is clinically dead?

The bible reads Jesus yielded up the ghost and died. So from what I understand, it's after the heart stops when the transfer takes place.

Originally Posted by Ferd

Ron Paul voter?

Yep.

[1Corinth2v4]

~~Bump For Praxeas~~

[TRFrance]

Originally Posted by 1Corinth2v4

Abortion should only be optional to females that have been raped, and become pregnant from this act.

That's the big loophole that would be created in that situation you're recommending...

If abortion was only allowable in cases of rape, any woman who thinks she might be pregnant could simply go to the police station and file a [false] police report claiming she was raped.

Then if it turns out she really is indeed pregnant, she would just use the police report as her "proof", then get her abortion. How would you get around that? I don't think you could.

[Praxeas]

Originally Posted by 1Corinth2v4

Praxeas,


According to you and the medical community, if you can't restart the heart after it has stopped, only then you're declared dead.

Here's your quote:


So here are two simple questions.

1) If one has a "DO NOT RESUSCITATE" sticker on their driver's license or in their medical file, when are they declared dead?

Remember, you can't implement any effort to restart these people's heart. So efforts to restart the heart can't be exhausted, and according to you, only after you have exhausted efforts to revive the heart, then they're declared dead.


2) If one has a "DO NOT RESUSCITATE" order on their driver's license or medical file, are they committing suicide?

According to you and the medical community they are, due to the fact they can have procedures implemented to restart their heart and they refuse to.

you are missing the point. There comes a time when a person is not able to be revived. Doctors and ETs put all their efforts into it, use all the techniques and medications and have exhausted ALL efforts. The point is a person that is "clinically dead" is now considered beyond resuscitation. They are dead and lifeless.

[Praxeas]

Originally Posted by 1Corinth2v4

The bible reads Jesus yielded up the ghost and died. So from what I understand, it's after the heart stops when the transfer takes place.

It says Jesus gave the ghost. He died. He was at that point beyond resuscitation. It does not say his heart merely stopped beating and went into what we call "clinical death"...he was not clinically dead, he was dead...gone...finality is there unless a miracle happens.

In the case of B Stoneking, he never reached finality. He was dying, but not dead only clinically dead.

When a person is dying they reach a point beyond resuscitation. The body is unable to contain life any longer.

When my mom had a heart attack last year they did all they could but she was never going to be stabilized. All they could do is continue to bring her heart back every time she coded. She was coding about every 30 minutes. Being the only child I had to authorize them not to act the next time she coded. I held her hand and talked with her until she coded and she passed from this life into the arms of Jesus.

Sometimes you do all you can do and then you have to let go.

[Praxeas]

Originally Posted by TRFrance

That's the big loophole that would be created in that situation you're recommending...

If abortion was only allowable in cases of rape, any woman who thinks she might be pregnant could simply go to the police station and file a [false] police report claiming she was raped.

Then if it turns out she really is indeed pregnant, she would just use the police report as her "proof", then get her abortion. How would you get around that? I don't think you could.

The moral problem though is this suggests that if she is raped then what was an unborn human being (assuming 1cor is right and it is at the stage where the heart is beating) then being raped somehow makes that unborn human being NOT a human being. Or otherwise one has to admit it is ok to murder an unborn human being if they were raped. It's still murder

[Praxeas]

Originally Posted by Grasshopper

When my mom had a heart attack last year they did all they could but she was never going to be stabilized. All they could do is continue to bring her heart back every time she coded. She was coding about every 30 minutes. Being the only child I had to authorize them not to act the next time she coded. I held her hand and talked with her until she coded and she passed from this life into the arms of Jesus.

Sometimes you do all you can do and then you have to let go.

exactly.

In the movies someone can be shot and they depict that person being instantly dead, but the reality is that they can remain alive for a while while they bleed to death. Or they can lose conciousness and though the heart is not beating their life force (the soul) is still there.