Rockets hitting Jerusalem

[Praxeas]

Originally Posted by Pressing-On

I don't know what it means either. Generally, the same people for generations live in the same area. If that is true, and it usually is, all of Ishmael's people are from Saudi Arabia. That makes them Arabs today and Muslim too boot.


I have no idea. I had always understood that Ishmael was an Arab. And so when I studied the genealogy, it proves to be true. I don't know how you can deny that. Ishmael died in the Arabian Peninsula. That is southern Saudi Arabia.

So, apparently, the people evolved into Muslims. Doesn't that mean that God was talking about them becoming a great nation if that is where Ishmael and his descendants lived and died?

You seem to be confusing two topics.

We are discussing the idea of muslims being spiritual decedents of Ishmael not who are the genetic decedents of Ishmael?

[Pressing-On]

Originally Posted by Praxeas

You seem to be confusing two topics.

We are discussing the idea of muslims being spiritual decedents of Ishmael not who are the genetic decedents of Ishmael?

No, I don't believe I am confused. I don't know where the "spiritual descendents" came up, but I was referring to this post in my replies:

Originally Posted by shazeep

He told Abraham this--that Ishmael's heirs would strive against Isaac's...i'm not on the right pc to search it, maybe someone can help here.

I posted some information as to where I believe the idea came from - that Ishmael would always strive against Isaac:

Originally Posted by Pressing-On

I think I may have found where the idea originated from.

I have a book entitled,"From Time Immemorial" which traces the origins of the Arab-Jewish Conflict over Palestine.

I was reading an excerpt quoted from Bernard Lewis, "The Palestinians and the PLO, a Historical Approach", Commentary, January 1975, p. 32-48.

"The first Arabian use of the word Arab occurs in the ancient southern Arabian inscriptions,...dating from the late pre-Christian and early Christian centuries. In these, Arab means Bedouin, often raider, and is applied to the nomadic as distinct from the sedentary population...For Muhammad and his contemporaries the Arabs were the Bedouin of the desert, and in the Qur'an the term is used exclusively in the sense and never of the townsfolk of Mecca, Medina and other cities."

Reading in Manners and Customs of Bible Lands, Fred H. Wight, pages 14-15, "The Bedouin's home is his tent, which is made of black goat's hair....If the Bedouin Arabs live together as a tribe or a clan, as they often do,...The Bible says that some of the sons of Ismael lived in tent villages or encampments (Genesis 25:16). I see other translations say villages and encampments. The Amplified defines "encampment" as a "sheepfold", i.e, identifying the people as Bedouins.

[Pressing-On]

AWESOME: Mark Levin interviews Son of Hamas founder Mosab Hassan Yousef who says Israel is fighting for the world


Mark Levin interviewed the son of the founder of Hamas, Mosab Hassan Yousef, tonight on his show to get more insight into the terrorist group that runs the Gaza Strip.

Yousef made it crystal clear that Hamas doesn’t just want to destroy the state of Israel, but wants a global caliphate on every inch of land around the world, and he said they will kill as many palestinians as they need to accomplish this goal.

Yousef said the fight that Israel is waging against Hamas isn’t just for their own existence, but for the entire world. He emphasizes that now is the time to support Israel in defeating this evil.

Part One and Two on link:

http://therightscoop.com/awesome-mar...for-the-world/

[Praxeas]

Originally Posted by Pressing-On

No, I don't believe I am confused. I don't know where the "spiritual descendents" came up, but I was referring to this post in my replies:



I posted some information as to where I believe the idea came from - that Ishmael would always strive against Isaac:

PO you were replying to me, not him.

[Praxeas]

Originally Posted by shazeep

? all i meant was that Muslims are at least the spiritual descendants of Ishmael. There was no "Islam" in his time. that's all i meant. the conspiracies that surely exist are really irrelevant, Prax.

Originally Posted by Praxeas

What makes you believe Muslims are the spiritual descendents of Ishmael?

Especially when there was no Islam at his time?

BTW I ask again, what is my "POV"? You've referenced my POV yet you haven't told me what my POV is

Originally Posted by Pressing-On

They didn't have to be Muslims at the time. They can evolve into a religion. That's exactly what happened with Mohammad. After he garnered enough support, he started strong arming the people to conform.

Originally Posted by Praxeas

That does not make them "Spiritual descendents" of Ishmael...does it?

Who authorized this view?

Originally Posted by Pressing-On

I don't know what it means either. Generally, the same people for generations live in the same area. If that is true, and it usually is, all of Ishmael's people are from Saudi Arabia. That makes them Arabs today and Muslim too boot.


I have no idea. I had always understood that Ishmael was an Arab. And so when I studied the genealogy, it proves to be true. I don't know how you can deny that. Ishmael died in the Arabian Peninsula. That is southern Saudi Arabia.

So, apparently, the people evolved into Muslims. Doesn't that mean that God was talking about them becoming a great nation if that is where Ishmael and his descendants lived and died?

See what I mean?

[Praxeas]

Originally Posted by Pressing-On

AWESOME: Mark Levin interviews Son of Hamas founder Mosab Hassan Yousef who says Israel is fighting for the world


Mark Levin interviewed the son of the founder of Hamas, Mosab Hassan Yousef, tonight on his show to get more insight into the terrorist group that runs the Gaza Strip.

Yousef made it crystal clear that Hamas doesn’t just want to destroy the state of Israel, but wants a global caliphate on every inch of land around the world, and he said they will kill as many palestinians as they need to accomplish this goal.

Yousef said the fight that Israel is waging against Hamas isn’t just for their own existence, but for the entire world. He emphasizes that now is the time to support Israel in defeating this evil.

Part One and Two on link:

http://therightscoop.com/awesome-mar...for-the-world/

wow

[aegsm76]

A very good interview.
Sadly, liberals won't listen to it.
I am always baffled at why libs love Islam.
My only conclusion is that they love anything that is contrary to Christianity.

[Pressing-On]

Originally Posted by Praxeas

PO you were replying to me, not him.

I realize that, Prax. You were the last to comment on the Palestinians being Ismael's descendents, so I replied to the last person commenting.
http://www.apostolicfriendsforum.com...&postcount=230

Originally Posted by Praxeas

See what I mean?

Sigh.....Yes, I continued to comment, because the issue is the same for me - Ishmael's people were the Arabian nations, the Hagarenes, Saracens, and Turks. The Jewish writings call the Turkish empire the "kingdom of Ishmael".

Regardless of whether or not the Romans started the whole Palestina thing, these nations and peoples evolved into the great nation of Islamic Muslims.

You keep saying there was no Islam at the time. I don't know why that makes a difference. Same people, Mohammand gains a following and BAM - you have Islam - it is the same people - evolved.

Isn't that the great nation God spoke about that would increase in numbers and He would make into a great nation? Genesis 17:20

If not, then who is God talking about?

[Pressing-On]

Originally Posted by aegsm76

A very good interview.
Sadly, liberals won't listen to it.
I am always baffled at why libs love Islam.
My only conclusion is that they love anything that is contrary to Christianity.

The Catholic Church started the "Christ killers" theme before the first Nicene Council. I heard Joan Rivers say, "We didn't kill Jesus, go after the Romans." LOL!

Anyway, Israel does need to repent for rejecting the Messiah, so I am not sure anything can be done about the anti-semitism.

CNN, MSNBC, et al, are the new Nazi Party. They appear to want Israel dead.

[shazeep]

Originally Posted by Praxeas

We weren't talking about Satan running the world....

well, but to a figurative 8 year old--me--you are. Rockets hitting Jeru is a...'bad' thing, that you feel compelled to side against, right? But no rocket hits Jeru w/o God's allowance. Ergo, there is a larger picture here, that may easily be obscured.