They have no shame

[shazeep]

i don't know...i thought he held up his end pretty well!

[obriencp]

After reading this thread I'm more convinced than ever that tithing has NO place in the new testament church. There is no scriptural basis for NT tithing, period.

A few instances of pre-law, common practice (for the time), tithing does not set a precedent of a God given commandment.

Tithing under the law was very specific and supported the widows, orphans, travelers, and a priesthood. That was done away with through Jesus. It's unfortunate that the "church" we're all familiar with has empraced a neo-priesthood temple system that depends on the tithes of members to survive. I don't believe God ever intended for us to have large church mortgages, utility bills, paid staff, etc that eat up the majority of what comes in. What a shame that most of what comes into a church doesn't go to help the community as Jesus in the NT had commanded/intended.

A few verses about living off of the Gospel, does not justify reinstating a tithe system. People that minister full time will be blessed by God as well as people giving as their lead by the Holy Ghost to do so. Those verses have nothing to do with tithing, but rather enjoying the blessings of being involved in the ministry and letting people bless you as they see fit.

And then, when the standard defenses don't work, the pro-tithers resort to stories of how God blesses those that tithe. It is not the act of giving 10% that God is blessing, he's blessing based on the attitude of the giver. Some give because the Spirit lead them to and some because they are being obedient to their leadership and the system they know.

If I knew of a family in need and I decide to help them financially instead of cutting a check to the local church, would the local pastor be upset? Probably.

[shazeep]

well then his premises are revealed, and everything is working as it should, imo.

[Rudy]

Fort Wayne Here if you don't have a church home.

[Rudy]

An interesting point is that Paul preach the gospel free of charge. He would not have the authority to go against God's command to refuse a tithe. Just as the Levite could not tell the people to stop tithing or refuse their tithe.

This shows another gap in that belief.

[Sean]

Originally Posted by KeptByTheWord

I jumped off the "10% mandatory tithing" cliff a long time ago... and .... I'm still here, I survived!

Yes, it was terrifying at first, but lo and behold, the Lord blessed me even MORE!!!

[Sean]

Originally Posted by FlamingZword

Sure you were not referring to Abraham, how could I misunderstand your statement since you clearly mentioned who was the thief, how dumb of me.

I am sorry I am creating a distraction from your high and mighty justification of a true doctrine, how could I do that, there is now no forgivingness for me, I am dooooooooomed, dooooomed, dooooooomed.

Now that is the first time I heard you teach a little truth!

[Sean]

Originally Posted by obriencp

After reading this thread I'm more convinced than ever that tithing has NO place in the new testament church. There is no scriptural basis for NT tithing, period.

A few instances of pre-law, common practice (for the time), tithing does not set a precedent of a God given commandment.

Tithing under the law was very specific and supported the widows, orphans, travelers, and a priesthood. That was done away with through Jesus. It's unfortunate that the "church" we're all familiar with has empraced a neo-priesthood temple system that depends on the tithes of members to survive. I don't believe God ever intended for us to have large church mortgages, utility bills, paid staff, etc that eat up the majority of what comes in. What a shame that most of what comes into a church doesn't go to help the community as Jesus in the NT had commanded/intended.

A few verses about living off of the Gospel, does not justify reinstating a tithe system. People that minister full time will be blessed by God as well as people giving as their lead by the Holy Ghost to do so. Those verses have nothing to do with tithing, but rather enjoying the blessings of being involved in the ministry and letting people bless you as they see fit.

And then, when the standard defenses don't work, the pro-tithers resort to stories of how God blesses those that tithe. It is not the act of giving 10% that God is blessing, he's blessing based on the attitude of the giver. Some give because the Spirit lead them to and some because they are being obedient to their leadership and the system they know.

If I knew of a family in need and I decide to help them financially instead of cutting a check to the local church, would the local pastor be upset? Probably.

[Sean]

Originally Posted by Rudy

An interesting point is that Paul preach the gospel free of charge. He would not have the authority to go against God's command to refuse a tithe. Just as the Levite could not tell the people to stop tithing or refuse their tithe.

This shows another gap in that belief.

The only "Pauls'" in ministry these days are the VOLUNTEERS!

[Esaias]

Originally Posted by Rudy

An interesting point is that Paul preach the gospel free of charge. He would not have the authority to go against God's command to refuse a tithe. Just as the Levite could not tell the people to stop tithing or refuse their tithe.

This shows another gap in that belief.

Ah, good point. If tithing is commanded, and failure to tithe is a sinful robbing of God, then Paul the apostle sinned and caused others to sin by refusing any kind of payment for preaching...