Is The Serpent Seed Doctrine A "Damnable Heresy"?

[TRFrance]

Originally Posted by MrsMcD

Since Mary the Mother of Jesus has been talked about in this thread, I have always wondered why Jesus called his mother "woman"? Any thoughts?

From what I've read on that, it's simply a cultural thing.

In our culture it would be considered rude for a man to refer to his mother as "woman" , but in that culturat setting , it was not disrepectul at all.
Pretty simple.

Originally Posted by Steve Epley

He was addressing her to John in the passage for John to take care of her. This is NOT some great revelation.

Bro Epley, I think she's referring to the context of John 2:4, not John 19:26.

TRFanc.. pure conjecture and you know that... we can all say this was culture or that was and yet none of us know that for fact... he said

Who is my mother
he called her woman

I also believed he did this because he knew the Catholic Church would try to make her "the mother of God" when she was not

[MrsMcD]

Originally Posted by TRFrance

From what I've read on that, it's simply a cultural thing.

In our culture it would be considered rude for a man to refer to his mother as "woman" , but in that culturat setting , it was not disrepectul at all.
Pretty simple.


Bro Epley, I think she's referring to the context of John 2:4, not John 19:26.

I was referring to John 2:4.

[SDG]

Originally Posted by Dr. Vaughn

TRFanc.. pure conjecture and you know that... we can all say this was culture or that was and yet none of us know that for fact... he said

Who is my mother
he called her woman

I also believed he did this because he knew the Catholic Church would try to make her "the mother of God" when she was not

He did this out of respect ... the term gune is Greek ... which means more like the classic use of the the word "Lady" ... not in the cold, generic sense but of revererence and high status.

We're reading way too much into his use of the word gune. We're doing it again and again.

It's more of that creative exegesis.

[pelathais]

Originally Posted by Dr. Vaughn

MrsMcD - your getting hot... he also said "who is my mother"

Do you think He was confused and didn't know?

In the passage that you allude to (Matthew 12:46-50) He was making a point about relationships within the Kingdom versus relationships in the world. Obviously, all of the members of the Kingdom would have earthly progenitors, Jesus Himself included.

But the more important relationships are those that are kingdom related.

Taking what appears to be your intentionally ambiguous approach literally we would have to believe that Peter, John and the others were His literal "birth mothers." That's even more ridiculous than the idea that God had a vial of human blood that He kept around for a few thousand years before injecting it into Peter so that Peter could give birth to the Messiah in Bethlehem... I mean Mary.

[bkstokes]

Originally Posted by Daniel Alicea

He did this out of respect ... the term gune is Greek ... which means more like the classic use of the the word "Lady" ... not in the cold, generic sense but of revererence and high status.

We're reading way too much into his use of the word gune. We're doing it again and again.

It's more of that creative exegesis.

So Dan

I read earlier that your wife was younger than you. Are you a craddle robber?

[pelathais]

Originally Posted by Dr. Vaughn

TRFanc.. pure conjecture and you know that... we can all say this was culture or that was and yet none of us know that for fact... he said

Who is my mother
he called her woman

I also believed he did this because he knew the Catholic Church would try to make her "the mother of God" when she was not

That last line of yours is "pure conjecture."

TRFrance's references to the ancient culture of the Near East isn't something he just pulled out of the air. We have massive amount of literature and writings from this time period that help us to understand the culture and language usage of the people then. It's really more of a science, and not conjecture.

Originally Posted by pelathais

That last line of yours is "pure conjecture."

TRFrance's references to the ancient culture of the Near East isn't something he just pulled out of the air. We have massive amount of literature and writings from this time period that help us to understand the culture and language usage of the people then. It's really more of a science, and not conjecture.

Why dont you post some credible references to these facts

[pelathais]

Originally Posted by MrsMcD

I was referring to John 2:4.

He was being intentionally dismissive of her initial request. As He stated, "My time is not yet come..."

But she forced His hand by telling the household servants to "do whatever He tells you to do..."

People try to read a lot into this, as DV does with his anti-Catholic statement. I'm no Catholic but they're been arguing their points for centuries and are hardly the push-overs that we sometimes make them out to be.

If Jesus was so concerned with heading off potential false doctrines He could have started with having John reword John 1. And why does Paul throw out the idea of "baptism for the dead..." without any explanation? Fact of the matter is, we have to live with a number of uncertainties and the precise meanings of some of these passages are just the tip of the iceberg.

Originally Posted by pelathais

He was being intentionally dismissive of her initial request. As He stated, "My time is not yet come..."

But she forced His hand by telling the household servants to "do whatever He tells you to do..."

People try to read a lot into this, as DV does with his anti-Catholic statement. I'm no Catholic but they're been arguing their points for centuries and are hardly the push-overs that we sometimes make them out to be.

If Jesus was so concerned with heading off potential false doctrines He could have started with having John reword John 1. And why does Paul throw out the idea of "baptism for the dead..." without any explanation? Fact of the matter is, we have to live with a number of uncertainties and the precise meanings of some of these passages are just the tip of the iceberg.

I find common ground here... I believe the last paragraph completely