I would like to speak with new tongues

[Zog Has-fallen]

Originally Posted by Evang.Benincasa

ZOG we are way ahead of you.

Originally Posted by Evang.Benincasa

Dude, we didn't even know all this until you just brought it out.

Truth is simple. There's no reason to be conflicted.

[Zog Has-fallen]

Originally Posted by Esaias

He is a dissident SDA

Would a dissident SDA reply to a recent bitchute video with the following remarks?

"I gave you a thumbs up and subscribed to your channel because I strongly agree with your understanding that OT law was primarily a prophecy of the coming Redeemer. However, being a former Seventh-day Adventist, I must point out that you've misrepresented SDA eschatology. The issue was never about prohibiting worshiping God on Sunday. The endtime crisis for SDAs is their fear that Sabbath-keepers will be ostracized and condemned when a Church-State alliance will be exalting Sunday sacredness, which will lead to their persecution. I don't fear what they fear. I agree that Ellen White's prediction sounds ridiculous. A far more likely scenario, according to irreversible trends that are unfolding now, is a Church-State alliance that will persecute Christ-loving opponents of Zionism."

[jediwill83]

Originally Posted by Zog Has-fallen

Would a dissident SDA reply to a recent bitchute video with the following remarks?

"I gave you a thumbs up and subscribed to your channel because I strongly agree with your understanding that OT law was primarily a prophecy of the coming Redeemer. However, being a former Seventh-day Adventist, I must point out that you've misrepresented SDA eschatology. The issue was never about prohibiting worshiping God on Sunday. The endtime crisis for SDAs is their fear that Sabbath-keepers will be ostracized and condemned when a Church-State alliance will be exalting Sunday sacredness, which will lead to their persecution. I don't fear what they fear. I agree that Ellen White's prediction sounds ridiculous. A far more likely scenario, according to irreversible trends that are unfolding now, is a Church-State alliance that will persecute Christ-loving opponents of Zionism."

Why are you fearing what Christ has already said would happen and what He has already overcome and also tells you "fear not" because He already overcame it?


We are going to be persecuted thats true...He stated a whole list of things that would happen but at the end He says ,"Fear not for I have overcome the world"
So its either disobedience due to your fear and creating a doctrine trying to avoid what Christ said would happen OR you don't believe He has indeed overcome.

[Esaias]

Originally Posted by jediwill83

Why are you fearing what Christ has already said would happen and what He has already overcome and also tells you "fear not" because He already overcame it?


We are going to be persecuted thats true...He stated a whole list of things that would happen but at the end He says ,"Fear not for I have overcome the world"
So its either disobedience due to your fear and creating a doctrine trying to avoid what Christ said would happen OR you don't believe He has indeed overcome.

He didn't claim to fear anything, to be honest. "I don't fear what they fear." He didnt then say "But I do fear XYZ."

[Esaias]

Originally Posted by Zog Has-fallen

Would a dissident SDA reply to a recent bitchute video with the following remarks?

"I gave you a thumbs up and subscribed to your channel because I strongly agree with your understanding that OT law was primarily a prophecy of the coming Redeemer. However, being a former Seventh-day Adventist, I must point out that you've misrepresented SDA eschatology. The issue was never about prohibiting worshiping God on Sunday. The endtime crisis for SDAs is their fear that Sabbath-keepers will be ostracized and condemned when a Church-State alliance will be exalting Sunday sacredness, which will lead to their persecution. I don't fear what they fear. I agree that Ellen White's prediction sounds ridiculous. A far more likely scenario, according to irreversible trends that are unfolding now, is a Church-State alliance that will persecute Christ-loving opponents of Zionism."

Your writings seemed to focus on calling the SDA organisation to reform its teachings and ways. I guess then you have left the org and no longer support its general, overall mission?

Hey, did you know the SDA church has a lot of Masonic imagery, especially surrounding EGW and her associates?

[Esaias]

ZOGHF, can you explain your take on the doctrine of the investigative judgment?

Also, can you give a brief synopsis of your understanding of the three angels' message(s) and how it differs from official SDA doctrine?

[Zog Has-fallen]

Originally Posted by Esaias

Your writings seemed to focus on calling the SDA organisation to reform its teachings and ways. I guess then you have left the org and no longer support its general, overall mission?

There is only one truly apostolic faith at the end of time and that true remnant will be known for preaching the three angels' messages (Revelation 14:6-12). To a large degree, the Seventh-day Adventist Church strongly repudiates the true meaning of those messages.

Originally Posted by Esaias

Hey, did you know the SDA church has a lot of Masonic imagery, especially surrounding EGW and her associates?

Is there any chance that you could be encouraged to read https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hand-in-waistcoat and to reconsider your claim?

Originally Posted by Esaias

ZOGHF, can you explain your take on the doctrine of the investigative judgment?

The Investigative Judgment doctrine in Adventism originated before Ellen White had any visions about it. Nevertheless, Sister White's subsequent visions regarding the IJ were Biblical in the sense that God is sometimes represented in the Old Testament as coming down to earth to investigate certain situations before taking action (Genesis 3:8-11, 11:5). Sister White's highly anthropomorphic, typologically rich sanctuary interpretation of the pre-Advent judgment is too complicated for mortals to explain from Scripture alone. More important and far more instructive is the grand endtime judgment scene of a Roman Antichrist, judged from God's throne room in heaven, with numerous witnesses and open books, which brings about the end of this world and vindicates the saints (Daniel 7). For the most authoritative and up-to-date understanding of the pre-Advent judgment, I prefer The Great, Final, Awesome Settling of Destiny as taught by Jesus Christ.

Originally Posted by Esaias

Also, can you give a brief synopsis of your understanding of the three angels' message(s) and how it differs from official SDA doctrine?

I'm not aware of SDAs ever having a church-approved exposition of the three angels' messages. The best brief summary is just reading The Three Angels’ Messages Versus The Three Demons’ Messages, skipping all the videos and links, but reading all the link titles. Here's the current overview:

In order to be a perfect sacrifice, to complete the atonement and defeat Satan, Jesus Christ had to withstand Satan's greatest temptations. Satan selected the three greatest temptations that beset all mankind for the contest recorded in Matthew 4:1-11. These are the lust of the flesh and the lust of the eyes and the boastful pride of life (1 John 2:16). That's the order of the three temptations listed in Luke 4:1-13. The three angels' messages of Revelation 14:6-12 parallel Christ's response to Satan's three temptations in Matthew 4:1-11, which also parallels and rebuffs, in order, the primary characteristics of the dragon, beast and false prophet in Revelation 12 and 13.

Originally Posted by jediwill83

Why are you fearing what Christ has already said would happen?

Feel free to compare me to the greatest living prophet in your denomination. Who do you believe is the most courageous, currently living prophet in your denomination that is speaking boldly against Zionist atrocities and against the harlotry of "Christian Zionism"?

[Esaias]

Originally Posted by Zog Has-fallen

Is there any chance that you could be encouraged to read https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hand-in-waistcoat and to reconsider your claim?

I think the evidence is pretty solid, without regard to hand in waistcoat poses for portraits. I wasn't even thinking about that particular claimed evidence, in fact.

The Investigative Judgment doctrine in Adventism originated before Ellen White had any visions about it. Nevertheless, Sister White's subsequent visions regarding the IJ were Biblical in the sense that God is sometimes represented in the Old Testament as coming down to earth to investigate certain situations before taking action (Genesis 3:8-11, 11:5). Sister White's highly anthropomorphic, typologically rich sanctuary interpretation of the pre-Advent judgment is too complicated for mortals to explain from Scripture alone. More important and far more instructive is the grand endtime judgment scene of a Roman Antichrist, judged from God's throne room in heaven, with numerous witnesses and open books, which brings about the end of this world and vindicates the saints (Daniel 7). For the most authoritative and up-to-date understanding of the pre-Advent judgment, I prefer The Great, Final, Awesome Settling of Destiny as taught by Jesus Christ.

Interesting read, but your linked article seemed a bit more like a really general overview. Do you have anything more specific?

Also, regarding Daniel 7, I invite you to read the results of a study I did concerning that called The Son of Man - http://www.apostolicfriendsforum.com...ad.php?t=52564

I'm not aware of SDAs ever having a church-approved exposition of the three angels' messages. The best brief summary is just reading The Three Angels’ Messages Versus The Three Demons’ Messages, skipping all the videos and links, but reading all the link titles. Here's the current overview:

In order to be a perfect sacrifice, to complete the atonement and defeat Satan, Jesus Christ had to withstand Satan's greatest temptations. Satan selected the three greatest temptations that beset all mankind for the contest recorded in Matthew 4:1-11. These are the lust of the flesh and the lust of the eyes and the boastful pride of life (1 John 2:16). That's the order of the three temptations listed in Luke 4:1-13. The three angels' messages of Revelation 14:6-12 parallel Christ's response to Satan's three temptations in Matthew 4:1-11, which also parallels and rebuffs, in order, the primary characteristics of the dragon, beast and false prophet in Revelation 12 and 13.

But is that not the same basic message that has gone forth since John Baptist, if not earlier?

[Zog Has-fallen]

Originally Posted by Esaias

Interesting read, but your linked article seemed a bit more like a really general overview. Do you have anything more specific?

The Great, Final, Awesome Settling of Destiny is extraordinarily specific in the context of The Seventh-day Millerite Interpretation of the Book of Revelation.

Originally Posted by Esaias

Also, regarding Daniel 7, I invite you to read the results of a study I did concerning that called The Son of Man - http://www.apostolicfriendsforum.com...ad.php?t=52564

Isn't your identification of the Son of man just a rehash of Jesuit theology?

Originally Posted by Esaias

But is that not the same basic message that has gone forth since John Baptist, if not earlier?

What did John the Baptist know about the most distinguishing characteristics of the dragon, beast and false prophet in the book of Revelation being parallel to Satan's three temptations in Matthew 4?

[Esaias]

Originally Posted by Zog Has-fallen

The Great, Final, Awesome Settling of Destiny is extraordinarily specific in the context of The Seventh-day Millerite Interpretation of the Book of Revelation.

I'll check it out, thanks.

Isn't your identification of the Son of man just a rehash of Jesuit theology?

Did you read the thread? I do not know what Jesuit theology says about Daniel 7

What did John the Baptist know about the most distinguishing characteristics of the dragon, beast and false prophet in the book of Revelation being parallel to Satan's three temptations in Matthew 4?

You misunderstood me. The lust of the flesh, the lust of the eyes, and the pride of life are and always have been universal constants characterising the kosmos (world order), and preaching designed to warn against such things has been, in one way or another, a basic staple of God's message to mankind.