I was addressing a mindset, not a specific youth group or church. So, I can give you the benefit of the doubt and say you just read my post through your defensiveness. If that isn't what happened, then I daresay either conviction came your way, or you are just too self focused to see principle in discussion.
Now, shall we discuss the carnal mindset that says that we must have a church and/or youth group that is centered around people rather than Jesus?
You were addressing Heavenly One's comments which were specifically in regard to my youth group in my church.
I don't need your patronizing "benefit of the doubt". I've seen you post here often enough to know your style and I'm calling you on it.
You weren't discussing "principle" but rather you made personal accusations specific to what Heavenly One posted. Specific to myself, my youth group, my pastor and my church as a whole.
Anyone that is worth their salt, including YOU (I've seen you in action), will defend themselves, their ministry, their church, their pastor, etc. when blatant false accusations start flying.
Once again, I'm calling you on your accusations, not your personal convictions (and they are purely PERSONAL) regarding steppin' or sticks or other such things.
Once again, I quote your accusations in response to Heavenly One's post regarding my youth group, myself, my pastor, my church... QUOTE: "Since those young people are no longer taught what it is to have a personal relationship with Jesus that comes through prayer and personal devotion, we MUST keep them entertained with the newest and latest 'stuff' so that they will park their carcasses on the pews."
And then you went further and compared the stick drama team that Heavenly One spoke of to your mother-in-law, though a sinner, who provided drugs and alchohol in her home to "keep them from going to party". Lastly you stated that our line of reasoning, since it was the same as your mother-in-laws, was carnal. Heres your words quoted below.
QUOTE: "My mother-in-law was of the same frame of mind, though a sinner, in that she made sure to provide her boys (my husband and his little brother) with drugs and alcohol at home to 'keep them from going out to party'. It is the same line of carnal reasoning,..."
If you are going to make such accusations regarding ministers and ministries that you know NOTHING about, you best be able to take the heat when you are called on them. Instead, you resorted to yet MORE false, personal accusations as quoted below.
QUOTE: "I daresay either conviction came your way, or you are just too self focused..."
Answer the questions, Sis. Murphy, or knock off the accusations and find someone without an ounce of a backbone to pick on. Its your choice.
I repeat the questions...
[U]Who do you think you are to say that this youth pastor (that being ME) as well as my pastor,
QUOTE:
"no longer teach what it is to have a personal relationship with Jesus that comes through prayer and personal devotion..."
Have you been to my church? Have you heard me preach and teach? Have you heard my pastor preach and teach?
__________________
"The only thing worse than murder in the desert is to know where the water is and not tell it!"
The attitude that comes across? See, that attitude is generally reflected not by the poster, but by the viewer. Haven't we all been misread by others at some point here? I know that I have, and I have done a lot of misreading as well.
I have read the same post that others have read and responded to, but I didn't 'hear' what they heard, and would have responded quite differently than others did. I'm sure you have done the same.
As for bias, well, we all have that....LOL!
Sure.
Attitudes do "come across" -- both sweet and sour. But you're right that we've all misunderstood and been misunderstood.
God bless!
__________________ Smiles & Blessings.... ~Felicity Welsh~ (surname courtesy of Jim Yohe)
Now, please explain how you know my heart and thus judge that I was 'deliberately being hurtful'. This is absolutely untrue. If you knew me, which you don't, you would know that I speak from a heart that is burdened for what I see as a generation that is growing up, like the generation after Joshua, not knowing God for themselves. They have the form, but no relationship. And I despise the mentality that says that the key to 'keeping young people in the church' is entertaining them. Whether you like it or not, it is the same mentality that caused my mother-in-law to raise her sons like she did.
Oh now this is too funny.
You personally judge and falsely accuse ministers and ministries that you personally know NOTHING about. You also judge and falsely accuse the same as having a "mentality" which you compare to your sinner mother-in-law.
Yet you dare to ask someone to explain how they "know your heart" since they don't know YOU?
You don't know me either sister. And since you have been so bold, I won't hesitate to do likewise...
I speak from a heart that was and is God-called to minister specifically to youth. The call and the burden is very strong and at age 44 it has not diminished since I first received the call at age 22. Thus your judgemental false accusations fly in my face because you don't know me nor my heart nor my ministry. Surely you can share your opinions and beliefs without putting on your judges robes.
__________________
"The only thing worse than murder in the desert is to know where the water is and not tell it!"
I agree with SISTER Murphy's zeal in promoting relationship with Jesus Christ over the things that may distract us from the important goal.
Where I still take issue with her, however, is in her tone and with her name calling and other destructive forum behaviors. If she is truly involved in a ministry with young people, and if this is how she pursues it - I feel very badly for those kids.
Come visit me sometime SISTER Murphy and I'll take you for a walk through a couple of graveyards. We've got young people there and there's plenty of room for even more. Those who aren't physically dead, but are spiritually burnt out got to be that way because of the angry and forceful way in which their elders crammed religious traditions down their throats.
I say it's about time someone in the Apostolic ranks stood up to the bullies that have been killing us. Look at our numbers and our history. You guys are literally killing us.
Excellent post!
I too agree with Sister Murphy's zeal in promoting a relationship with Jesus Christ over things that may distract us from this ultimate goal.
Obviously this must be stressed first and foremost.
Having said this, let me say that personally I will try just about anything that the Word of God does not forbid, either specifically or in principle, in order to help my young people attain this ultimate goal of having a personal relationship with Jesus Christ.
__________________
"The only thing worse than murder in the desert is to know where the water is and not tell it!"
I too agree with Sister Murphy's zeal in promoting a relationship with Jesus Christ over things that may distract us from this ultimate goal.
Obviously this must be stressed first and foremost.
Having said this, let me say that personally I will try just about anything that the Word of God does not forbid, either specifically or in principle, in order to help my young people attain this ultimate goal of having a personal relationship with Jesus Christ.
go girl, go girl, good heart, and good spirit, you got em, dt
__________________
A product of a pentecostal raisin, I am a hard man, just ask my children
I too agree with Sister Murphy's zeal in promoting a relationship with Jesus Christ over things that may distract us from this ultimate goal.
Obviously this must be stressed first and foremost.
Having said this, let me say that personally I will try just about anything that the Word of God does not forbid, either specifically or in principle, in order to help my young people attain this ultimate goal of having a personal relationship with Jesus Christ.
And let me add that no matter what this woman does with the youth, it always centers around Jesus and a relationship with him.
__________________
I've gone and done it now! I'm on Facebook!!!
I too agree with Sister Murphy's zeal in promoting a relationship with Jesus Christ over things that may distract us from this ultimate goal.
Obviously this must be stressed first and foremost.
Having said this, let me say that personally I will try just about anything that the Word of God does not forbid, either specifically or in principle, in order to help my young people attain this ultimate goal of having a personal relationship with Jesus Christ.
I agree! When you are praying He leads you and puts those tools in your hand!
I too agree with Sister Murphy's zeal in promoting a relationship with Jesus Christ over things that may distract us from this ultimate goal.
Obviously this must be stressed first and foremost.
Having said this, let me say that personally I will try just about anything that the Word of God does not forbid, either specifically or in principle, in order to help my young people attain this ultimate goal of having a personal relationship with Jesus Christ.
Good post. And you're right. Anything can be used for evil or for good. An act itself may not be sinful, but the intention behind the act can be. (Obviously this is not a case with every act) There is too much ado about nothing worrying about who is going where, who is wearing what, who is watching this and who is listening to that. No amount of control is ever going to change someone. That has to come from God. But you can certainly do whatever you can to help young people find him. I am NOT saying we should not instruct our kids and I am NOT saying we should just let them do anything. I just want to clear that up before I get jumped on. Again, I say, not just because you are my friend, but because I truly see it, you are an excellent youth leader. Your youth, compared to others in this area, are down to earth, HAPPY, polite and fun loving. Oh, and normal. LOL. I heard you preach, and your delivery was so practical and made so much sense. There was not an ounce of judgment in your message. It was a message to help people get back on track, yes, but it was not a message of judgment but one of encouragement. By the way, I forgot to tell you guys that HO's son talked to me in the parking lot. What a pleasant young man.
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