Tiger Woods Update Thread

[ManOfWord]

Originally Posted by MissBrattified

Good post.

My guess is that more women will agree with my post than men. Hmmmmmm....I wonder what that means.

[Jeffrey]

Originally Posted by ManOfWord

I pray as well that the Sovereign Lord will hear Tiger's cries and prayers and heal his marriage and draw him to Him who is able to restore. That does not negate the facts of what I have stated.....fair and balanced!

You thought he was something he wasn't? You measured his Christian character as a golf fan? Did you forget he was a human and is not the first to get stuck in secret sin?

[Jeffrey]

Perhaps because us men know how close of a temptation and struggle this is. And likely all the more for a man like Tiger, who is not filled with the Spirit, and who knows where is spiritual relationship with Jesus is. All the more reason for me, as a Christian, to root him on toward healing, hoping the best for his children and family -- and Tiger himself. In the shoes of the wife, I can understand her anger and feelings. I'm not the wife, I'm an outsider praying the best for their family and that's it.

We have so much fun with this poor guy's life...

[notofworks]

Originally Posted by ManOfWord

Scammed is right. I along with many others thought he was something that he wasn't. If it were just a mistake, that's one thing. But it, apparently was a repeated lifestyle behavior.

You thought Tiger was a great golfer. He is, in fact, a great golfer. I don't see how you were scammed.

I didn't say there were MANY women. Don't appreciate you putting words in my mouth. I said more than one. Over the course of 25+ yrs of pastoring that is probably not abnormal. I'm not holier than others and certainly not holier than Tiger. Your gift of prophecy must be working well. You're right.....I have made mistakes...I am not perfect. However, I DO know what is important and he should have as well. Faithfulness to one's spouse should not be something abnormal. No excuse for what he did no matter what you say. A single indiscretion is completely different from what he has done. It is what it is and he CAN be forgiven and restored as I have said. I pray for that to happen.

"Many"....."More than one"....I'll let you parse the words. It's all relative. Some would believe "more than one" to be "Many." Since you've made mistakes, committed sins, and had lapses in judgment, as has Tiger, why don't you leave it at that and only pray for him, rather than announcing what he deserves. Again, Lamentations 3:22.

I have no intention of piling on the stones on some web site solely for the purpose of destruction. I'm not yelling at him AND I don't use vulgarities. That is not what this thread is about either. I am expressing my opinion. I am simply looking at both sides of the equation. If it were me, I'd say the same thing. No candy coating. No smoke and mirrors. Sin, especially THIS sin is ugly and unfortunately, in the face of everyone. It speaks to the very core of man's character....faithfulness to the one you have chosen to spend the rest of your life with. This man practices day in and day out to put the little white ball in the little cup. He says "NO" to so many things which vie for his attention away from that. Don't tell me with a straight face that he didn't have the constitution to remain faithful to Elin. He chose where his victories were and one of the things which REALLY matter, he chose not to. It is forgivable, but unacceptable.

Yes, he failed. He could have avoided it, but he didn't. You, as well, could have avoided every sin you've ever committed. But you didn't. You and Tiger are the same in that respect. You've probably behaved better than he. Good for you. But you both need God's grace. For all have sinned (past tense) and come short (present tense) of the glory of God.

I pray as well that the Sovereign Lord will hear Tiger's cries and prayers and heal his marriage and draw him to Him who is able to restore. That does not negate the facts of what I have stated.....fair and balanced!

To be fair and balanced, it should be made clear that your depravity, without God's grace, is just like Tiger's.

I hope you still like it when "Iron sharpens iron", although you may not considered me to be "iron"!

[notofworks]

Originally Posted by Jeffrey

We have so much fun with this poor guy's life...

Isn't THAT the truth! Imagine if every Follower of Christ just prayed for the guy's life.

[ManOfWord]

Originally Posted by notofworks

To be fair and balanced, it should be made clear that your depravity, without God's grace, is just like Tiger's.

I hope you still like it when "Iron sharpens iron", although you may not considered me to be "iron"!

No, I didn't' think Tiger was a great golfer. Everyone knew that he was. Most of us thought he was a "good guy" when it came to his family. I would never expect perfection. I WOULD expect faithfulness to Elin, as did she, as did most, and I assume YOU as well.

I also have no problem whatsoever stating in clarity that my depravity, without God's grace deserves an horrible pit. But He, through His blood has promised me a heavenly place. However, because of his larger than life, life and his apparent, good family man personna, we all expected more and that expectation is not unreasonable. It is expected of ALL leaders. There are certain things you can't get away with when it comes to leadership. Those who fail to realize that, IMO, are in danger of repeating them.

A leader can make many mistakes which will not ruin his leadership. He can have a slip of the tongue; file taxes late; make a less than stellar decision, misjudge a situation; loose his temper etc. But when a leader makes such an egregious error in judgment, which goes to the very core of his ability to lead, that is keeping his word, that "Titanic" is going down. That is not a criticism of the man. That is simply the way leadership works.

You continually fail to mention the GOOD things I have stated regarding this situation. I didn't stop at the good things because of the reality. No fear in stating truth. I have not judged him. I have only said what I would say if I were in his shoes. Accepting responsibility is what big boys do. Generals well understand that as do presidents and kings etc.

Pro. 6:32 But a man who commits adultery lacks judgment; whoever does so destroys himself. 33 Blows and disgrace are his lot, and his shame will never be wiped away;

The balance is this: Jn. 6:37 All that the Father gives Me will come to Me, and the one who comes to Me I will by no means cast out.

[Jeffrey]

Tiger is neither a leader nor a Christian leader. Perhaps we may infer his exposure qualifies, but that's not exactly something he signed up for. He just played golf quite well.

[ManOfWord]

Originally Posted by Jeffrey

Tiger is neither a leader nor a Christian leader. Perhaps we may infer his exposure qualifies, but that's not exactly something he signed up for. He just played golf quite well.

Ah...you greatly err! Tiger IS a leader. Maybe not a Christian leader, but a leader nonetheless. He played golf not only "quite well" but better than anyone else. THAT qualifies him as a leader. The guy out front is ALWAYS the leader.

The world is always looking for heroes. Not perfect people, but heroes nonetheless. A hero is not one w/o faults, mistakes etc. People are desperately looking for people with integrity. Those who keep their word and their important covenants.

I really do get great joy from someone who is at the top of their game and who excels above the others. I love to say, "Bravo" at a great accomplishment even if it is not perfect. But there is nothing greater than keeping one's commitment to their spouse, especially in the face of difficult situations. I know it takes two and I'm not being idyllic. But THAT is an accomplishment worthy of note above all others. That is also a biblical principle. One which our society has watered down and made archaic. I applaud anyone in the public eye who at least has victory in that area. I could admire a wacky WWF wrestler who stays married to his first wife and stays faithful as well. THAT deserves a standing "O!" IMO

[Jeffrey]

Originally Posted by ManOfWord

Ah...you greatly err! Tiger IS a leader. Maybe not a Christian leader, but a leader nonetheless. He played golf not only "quite well" but better than anyone else. THAT qualifies him as a leader. The guy out front is ALWAYS the leader.

The world is always looking for heroes. Not perfect people, but heroes nonetheless. A hero is not one w/o faults, mistakes etc. People are desperately looking for people with integrity. Those who keep their word and their important covenants.

I really do get great joy from someone who is at the top of their game and who excels above the others. I love to say, "Bravo" at a great accomplishment even if it is not perfect. But there is nothing greater than keeping one's commitment to their spouse, especially in the face of difficult situations. I know it takes two and I'm not being idyllic. But THAT is an accomplishment worthy of note above all others. That is also a biblical principle. One which our society has watered down and made archaic. I applaud anyone in the public eye who at least has victory in that area. I could admire a wacky WWF wrestler who stays married to his first wife and stays faithful as well. THAT deserves a standing "O!" IMO

Those who follow him seeking leadership need a reality check.

I get your statement, and it's one I teach my children, but in a technical sense, Tiger Woods is not leading anyone. I think a football player would better qualify. He's a one-man show and sports phenom.

Anyway, point being, he's not a Christian nor an actual leader, though some perceive him to be so because of sheer exposure. I agree that keeping commitment is not only noble but expected. For me, this isn't about my thoughts on adultery. Most of us made our statements condemning the behavior from Day 1. This is Day 20, time to move on and pray for Tiger personally.

[notofworks]

Originally Posted by ManOfWord

No, I didn't' think Tiger was a great golfer. Everyone knew that he was. Most of us thought he was a "good guy" when it came to his family. I would never expect perfection. I WOULD expect faithfulness to Elin, as did she, as did most, and I assume YOU as well.

I'll admit, I'm surprised at what has taken place. And because I have a son that has, from the time he was small, prayed for Tiger to come to faith in Christ, we are both heartbroken at what has occurred, and hopeful that this will allow him to realize he needs something more than his own strength, talent, and discipline.

Yes, I would have hoped that he would be faithful, but I also know that rock stars, actors, and athletes face sexual temptations to extents that you and I will never comprehend. I'd like to think I would pass the test. But honestly, none of us could know for sure until we were in that place. I hope by God's grace, I would. But I also hope that if I blew it, even repeatedly as Tiger did, that there would be a place of shelter and safety for me.

I also have no problem whatsoever stating in clarity that my depravity, without God's grace deserves an horrible pit. But He, through His blood has promised me a heavenly place. However, because of his larger than life, life and his apparent, good family man personna, we all expected more and that expectation is not unreasonable. It is expected of ALL leaders. There are certain things you can't get away with when it comes to leadership. Those who fail to realize that, IMO, are in danger of repeating them.

I don't see Tiger as a leader of anything besides tournament leader boards and PGA Tour money lists. Your remarks concerning leaders would seem to apply to everyone.

A leader can make many mistakes which will not ruin his leadership. He can have a slip of the tongue; file taxes late; make a less than stellar decision, misjudge a situation; loose his temper etc. But when a leader makes such an egregious error in judgment, which goes to the very core of his ability to lead, that is keeping his word, that "Titanic" is going down. That is not a criticism of the man. That is simply the way leadership works.

Again, what you're saying about leaders applies to everyone.

Tiger himself said, "I may not be able to repair the damage I've done." He knows how bad this is and he knows it MUCH better than any of us who are on the internet typing gibberish. It's theory to us, but it's real for him and his family. I think it's notable that he has not hired a PR crisis management firm to help. He's going with his heart and I think that's a great start.

You continually fail to mention the GOOD things I have stated regarding this situation. I didn't stop at the good things because of the reality. No fear in stating truth. I have not judged him. I have only said what I would say if I were in his shoes. Accepting responsibility is what big boys do. Generals well understand that as do presidents and kings etc.

The good things you say are always followed by, "But....". Like I said when this all started, "If you'd just stopped after the first paragraph."

I don't understand why we all need to point pout the obvious. Galatians 5 says, "The works of the flesh are evident" or "obvious." We all know what he did wrong and we all know how terrible it is. So does Tiger. Why do we feel the need to come here and throw our hat into the ring of announcing his wrongs? What more is there to say than, "Oh God!! Help him! Please!"? Is there really anything else to say?

Pro. 6:32 But a man who commits adultery lacks judgment; whoever does so destroys himself. 33 Blows and disgrace are his lot, and his shame will never be wiped away;

"He forgave all your sin. He canceled the record that contained the charges against us. He took it and destroyed it by nailing it to Christ's cross." Colossians 2:14-15.

Jesus bore not only our sin but our shame as well.

The balance is this: Jn. 6:37 All that the Father gives Me will come to Me, and the one who comes to Me I will by no means cast out.

I and my family are praying that he will come to the Father. And in the midst of the prayers, there seems to be nothing else to say.