Isaiah 3 and jewelry...

[SeekingOne]

Originally Posted by Godsdrummer

I Peter 3:2 While the world sees your good conduct coupled with fear.
3:3 Whose outward decoration is not based on the putting on of elaborate clothing like elaborated braiding of the hair, and wearing much gold and costly array.
3:3 But is instead comes from the hidden man of the heart, Those things that are not corruptible like a meek and quiet spirit, which is great in the sight of God.

Read it as you see fit. Jewelery has never been a sin the outlandish putting on of costly array and the attitude from which it stemms from is where the sin is.

The scripture is also NOT saying not to put on things, but focusing on the heart issues.

It just seems that some people need solid temporal "things" to attach to salvation so that they feel secure. They don't feel secure in what Christ did on the cross, so they are looking for outward things to help them prove who is going to heaven. The problem is, only God knows the heart so they need to give it up.

[Standards]

Originally Posted by SeekingOne

The scripture is also NOT saying not to put on things, but focusing on the heart issues.

It just seems that some people need solid temporal "things" to attach to salvation so that they feel secure. They don't feel secure in what Christ did on the cross, so they are looking for outward things to help them prove who is going to heaven. The problem is, only God knows the heart so they need to give it up.

You wear Jewlelry, you're lost. Plain and simple. Stop trying to confuse everyone with your bimbo ideas.

[rdp]

Originally Posted by Godsdrummer

1Pe 3:2 While they behold your chaste conversation coupled with fear.
1Pe 3:3 Whose adorning let it not be that outward adorning of plaiting the hair, and of wearing of gold, or of putting on of apparel;
1Pe 3:4 But let it be the hidden man of the heart, in that which is not corruptible, even the ornament of a meek and quiet spirit, which is in the sight of God of great price.

Its funny to me now after years of thinking I knew the word to find out that what I preached was false. To the point that I was just like RDP. So I know I cannot change his mind on this but for those of you with a searching heart, one that will love your brother regardless of his standards or lack there of, I offer this up.

I Peter 3:2 While the world sees your good conduct coupled with fear.
3:3 Whose outward decoration is not based on the putting on of elaborate clothing like elaborated braiding of the hair, and wearing much gold and costly array.
3:3 But is instead comes from the hidden man of the heart, Those things that are not corruptible like a meek and quiet spirit, which is great in the sight of God.

Read it as you see fit. Jewelery has never been a sin the outlandish putting on of costly array and the attitude from which it stemms from is where the sin is.

Contrare' Monfrare....Deut. 7:25 calls wearing of Gold & Silver an abomination to the Lord. If an abomination to the Lord isn't "sin," then pls. provide what is:__________?

Regarding the above translation, all you've done is appealled to a "Dynamic Equivalent" that takes its liberties w/ the Word. Why don't you interact w/ the "Formal/Literal Correspondance" translations such as the NKJV, NASB, etc.?

Hmmmm, I smell bias in the house!

[Jeffrey]

Originally Posted by rdp

Contrare' Monfrare....Deut. 7:25 calls wearing of Gold & Silver an abomination to the Lord. If an abomination to the Lord isn't "sin," then pls. provide what is:__________?

Regarding the above translation, all you've done is appealled to a "Dynamic Equivalent" that takes its liberties w/ the Word. Why don't you interact w/ the "Formal/Literal Correspondance" translations such as the NKJV, NASB, etc.?

Hmmmm, I smell bias in the house!

Are we not being honest with your proof-text in Deut here???? I mean, it's glaring! The subject is idolatry (the abomination), the issue is graven images.

Finally, in the context of the chapter, God is promising to take care of them, they won't win this battle on their own, he will bring it. Similar to the battles of Joshua, he's basically giving them strict orders about the spoils of this war.

The abomination was idolatry. Connected to that abomination were idols. In the OT they didn't even eat food that they even thought might be offered to idols (we see this in early 1st Century Judaism as well). The idols corrupted a good thing. Same was true for the gold and silver.

Nice try though.

[Jeffrey]

Originally Posted by Standards

You wear Jewlelry, you're lost. Plain and simple. Stop trying to confuse everyone with your bimbo ideas.

Wearing of jewelry is a salvific issue.

RDP do you agree? Other OP's on here. Do you agree?

[rdp]

Originally Posted by Jeffrey

Are we not being honest with your proof-text in Deut here???? I mean, it's glaring! The subject is idolatry (the abomination), the issue is graven images.

Finally, in the context of the chapter, God is promising to take care of them, they won't win this battle on their own, he will bring it. Similar to the battles of Joshua, he's basically giving them strict orders about the spoils of this war.

The abomination was idolatry. Connected to that abomination were idols. In the OT they didn't even eat food that they even thought might be offered to idols (we see this in early 1st Century Judaism as well). The idols corrupted a good thing. Same was true for the gold and silver.

Nice try though.

I do not have the text in front of me, but if memory serves me right, it says: "The graven images of THEIR gods, you shall burn with fire. You shall not desire the silver or gold that is on THEM, nor take it for yourself, lest you be snared therein, for it is an abomination to the LORD your God."

Grammatically, the pronoun "them" above relates back to "their" in the earlier portion of the text [which I have in caps above]. Of course the text was dealing w/ the idolatry of the surrounding nations...who manifest that idolatry w/ the wearing of jewelry! That's the whole point that I'm making! Then God says to His people in effect, "You do not mimic the practices & ornamenation of those who aren't in covenant relationship w/ me!"

Jewelry walks hand-in-hand w/ idolatry, & God called the wearing of it an "abomination" to Him! Is what's an "abomination" to Him in the OT still an "abomination" to Him in the NT??? Of course it is....try again Jeffrey.

[rdp]

Originally Posted by Jeffrey

Wearing of jewelry is a salvific issue.

RDP do you agree? Other OP's on here. Do you agree?

Well, I do not believe we can just willfully disregard, or attempt to explain away God-breathed Scripture & be okay w/ God...do you?

[Godsdrummer]

Originally Posted by rdp

Jewelry walks hand-in-hand w/ idolatry, & God called the wearing of it an "abomination" to Him! Is what's an "abomination" to Him in the OT still an "abomination" to Him in the NT??? Of course it is....try again Jeffrey.

It just never ceases to amaze me the lengths some people will go to try and back up a doctrine that is no where in the scripture.

Where in the world do you get the idea that Jewelry walks hand in hand with idolitry and the wearing of it is an abomination?

And as for an abomination OT being an abomination in the NT? I can think of several, eating of Pork for one did not God tell Peter to take and eat in the vision? Working on the Sabbath for two. Did not Jesus tell the religious leaders of his day that he was the Lord of the Sabbath also, when his diciples were shucking and eating corn on the Sabbath?

Heres the deal as far as I am concerned, if you have to be a bible scholor to find salvation or have someone that has been studied for years show you the way then one is making too much out of salvation.

God does not give his spirit to those he does not accept. So your preaching to the chour, that is like judging someone that eats meat when you think it is sin. Who are you to judge when God has already accepted them. God is thier master.
Rom 14:3 Let not him that eateth despise him that eateth not; and let not him which eateth not judge him that eateth: for God hath received him.
Rom 14:4 Who art thou that judgest another man's servant? to his own master he standeth or falleth. Yea, he shall be holden up: for God is able to make him stand.

Oh and as for my paraphras of the the scripture above I don't pick and choose one translation over the other. The same message can be found in all Gods word regarless of who translated them into the English. Do you realy think God would let his word be mis translated? Thats like saying God can't heal any more or God does'nt save any more or God is not in control.

We just did not want to use other translations because they did not make it easy to preach the doctrines we already preached. And we might have to admit we were wrong, and God forbid that. If God can admit he was wrong why can't you.

[Godsdrummer]

Check the Hebrew out on this:

Eze 16:9 Then washed I thee with water; yea, I throughly washed away thy blood from thee, and I anointed thee with oil.
Eze 16:10 I clothed thee also with broidered work, and shod thee with badgers' skin, and I girded thee about with fine linen, and I covered thee with silk.
Eze 16:11 I decked thee also with ornaments, and I put bracelets upon thy hands, and a chain on thy neck.
Eze 16:12 And I put a jewel on thy forehead, and earrings in thine ears, and a beautiful crown upon thine head.
Eze 16:13 Thus wast thou decked with gold and silver; and thy raiment was of fine linen, and silk, and broidered work; thou didst eat fine flour, and honey, and oil: and thou wast exceeding beautiful, and thou didst prosper into a kingdom.

Its funny how one can make Gold and silver into jewelry and then symbolize jewelry. Read on it was not the jewely God gave her that was her sin. It was what she did with it that became the sin. Or maybe good ole King James got it wrong with his translation here HMM.

[Godsdrummer]

If the previous post is not enough:

Eze 28:13 Thou hast been in Eden the garden of God; every precious stone was thy covering, the sardius, topaz, and the diamond, the beryl, the onyx, and the jasper, the sapphire, the emerald, and the carbuncle, and gold: the workmanship of thy tabrets and of thy pipes was prepared in thee in the day that thou wast created.
Eze 28:14 Thou art the anointed cherub that covereth; and I have set thee so: thou wast upon the holy mountain of God; thou hast walked up and down in the midst of the stones of fire.
Eze 28:15 Thou wast perfect in thy ways from the day that thou wast created, till iniquity was found in thee.

Again God was the one that made him this way with all the precious stones as his covering. And he was perfect, until iniquity was found in him.

All the beautiful things that God created him with were not his sin. His sin was because he became prideful because of his beauty.

Here's the problem "standards of holiness" has become the jewelry of some people and is just as wrong as the wearing of Jewelry is for some. This is what Peter and Paul are saying in the passages in question. I Timothy 2:9, I Peter 3:3. What the putting on of Gold and costly array were for them back then is the putting on of "holiness standards" today. "Let it not be the putting on of aparrel" but rather that which comes from the heart.

This is not a command to wear or not to wear, but rather that what we wear should be a reflection of the inner man of the heart.

"Let not your holiness be the putting on of aparrel but rather the hidden man of the heart" As this was how women of old adorned themselves being in subjection to their own husband."

Which brings up the point who are we subject to the pastor or the husband?