Bro. Tim, I appreciate your spirit in this discusssion. You are right that things are often misunderstood.
I have not been to a WPF church lately. One of the founders is a former pastor of mine...though I respect him highly, I feel the new org is a HUGE mistake.
But as you said, "time will tell."
I pray I am wrong in my feelings regarding this...
One thing for sure Sis. All things are working together for the good.
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There is a conspiracy of silence in the land.
Bro. Tim,
There has been several times that I would read your post and be nodding in agreement and be touched by your sincerity...then just run into a land mine out of nowhere. I can't personally speak for all of the UPC, but my church is certainly not going backwards. The foreign fields that I am closely associated with are not going backwards. Every camp or conference that I, a family member, or my pastor has attended recently has been some of the best-attended and most powerful services in some time. Most of the reports from other camps and conferences that I've heard reflect the same.
On an unrelated note...how many WPF churches are there?
The UPCI Churches in my area are all going backward. (Maybe our definitions of "backwards" are different). And I don't really want to get into that.
And I have no idea how many WPF churches there are. 50 pastors are on the general concil. I wouldn't even want to guess. Tulsa would probably give the info. to you.
Sorry for land mines. Trust me, a lot of self discpline and wisdom is used in these posts. The slightest sense of blood (or a chink in your armour) and the spiritual sharks are all over it. I just trust that I am not confusing wisdom with compromise. God bless.
TR
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There is a conspiracy of silence in the land.
The UPCI Churches in my area are all going backward. (Maybe our definitions of "backwards" are different). And I don't really want to get into that.
TR
I appreciate you not wishing to get into it, but I am from your state (north east).
All I can say is, I am surprised to hear you say this. As you said, your idea of backwards and mine may be different, nonetheless, I am surprised that you feel this way.
I appreciate you not wishing to get into it, but I am from your state (north east).
All I can say is, I am surprised to hear you say this. As you said, your idea of backwards and mine may be different, nonetheless, I am surprised that you feel this way.
Barb, that is kind of what I was talking about when I said unexpected land mines in the posts. I will be reading a sincere post from a sincere person when suddenly I read something that seems to be the result of what's been hammered into them. It seems to be a recurring theme in the posts, that part of this whole WPF situation has been a consistent hammering that the UPCI is going down and heading backwards. And it seems to bleed through in most of the conversations. I personally am not experiencing that though.
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There are no weapons of mass destruction in Iraq, Chuck Norris lives in Houston.
Either the United States will destroy ignorance, or ignorance will destroy the United States. – W.E.B. DuBois
I belong to neither have friends in both...I hate that things happened like they did however sometimes differences draw us closer to God...I am not the judge.
I would never belong to the UPC because I do not feel I would make them a good missionary however I think very highly of what the UPC has done in fields all over this world...and many that have left the UPC would not have been saved if it had not been for the UPC...so even in differences I think they should be kind and remember the good things...
I think it is far to early to judge the WPF...time will tell if they made the right move...time is a just judge...
I remember when the first formed AMF said hard things about the UPC but in time some went back in the UPC others faded off the picture and others became independent churches...the AMF is quite small today...
I do not think we can judge a body by sections we must get an over all veiw...
Has the UPC done wrong? Yes, in some cases I consider they did very wrong...Have I ever done wrong? Probably a million times...so....that makes us all humans, full of mistakes...and many times full of self!
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I belong to neither have friends in both...I hate that things happened like they did however sometimes differences draw us closer to God...I am not the judge.
I would never belong to the UPC because I do not feel I would make them a good missionary however I think very highly of what the UPC has done in fields all over this world...and many that have left the UPC would not have been saved if it had not been for the UPC...so even in differences I think they should be kind and remember the good things...
I think it is far to early to judge the WPF...time will tell if they made the right move...time is a just judge...
I remember when the first formed AMF said hard things about the UPC but in time some went back in the UPC others faded off the picture and others became independent churches...the AMF is quite small today...
I do not think we can judge a body by sections we must get an over all veiw...
Has the UPC done wrong? Yes, in some cases I consider they did very wrong...Have I ever done wrong? Probably a million times...so....that makes us all humans, full of mistakes...and many times full of self!
Wisdom at work here...thank you, Mother A...
My feelings regarding the WPF are based on personal experience, and as I said, I pray I am wrong.
By the same token, I do not condone some things with the UPCI. You said it best, "so....that makes us all humans, full of mistakes...and many times full of self!"
I appreciate you not wishing to get into it, but I am from your state (north east).
All I can say is, I am surprised to hear you say this. As you said, your idea of backwards and mine may be different, nonetheless, I am surprised that you feel this way.
Your ok, with smoke machines, crazy strobe lights and less then desirable music?? (And much more). I understand trying to reach the youth. But we do not need the tactics of rock concerts in our sanctuary (house of prayer). As Sister Alvear said... time will tell. I'm just afraid to many people have already been desensitized. I am content to follow the leadership God has placed in my life. You probably know who my Pastor is.. and you know he is not a contentious man. Anyways... here I go again. I don't want to stir up a hornets nest. Long live Elder Haney!! Have you heard the song he wrote.. I'm a Pentecostal?
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There is a conspiracy of silence in the land.
Re: Have You Been to WWPF Lately?
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