"were The Disciples Saved Before Pentecost?"

Originally Posted by big-larry

What say Ye?..........

This depends upon how you define 'Saved.' If you define it as speaking in tongues and water baptism then obviously nobody could be saved according to such a theology until after pentecost! If you define saved as the application of Christ's blood to a sinner, remitting his or her sin and also imputing Christ's righteousness, then this would imply salvation from the moment of the resurrection. It all depends upon the clear and exact definition of terms, otherwise people would just be giving their own subjective feelings.

[Sam]

Originally Posted by Iron_Bladder

This depends upon how you define 'Saved.' If you define it as speaking in tongues and water baptism then obviously nobody could be saved according to such a theology until after pentecost! If you define saved as the application of Christ's blood to a sinner, remitting his or her sin and also imputing Christ's righteousness, then this would imply salvation from the moment of the resurrection. It all depends upon the clear and exact definition of terms, otherwise people would just be giving their own subjective feelings.

Were folks in the Old Testament saved?

[Bro-Larry]

Originally Posted by Iron_Bladder

Larry, the hebrew at Isaiah 53:1 doesn't have tenses and is written in what is called the prophetic perfect. All prophecy in the OT Hebrew is prophetic perfect, which simply means that God writes as if his promises were already accomplished. Possibly you'd be kind enough to explain your point at Isaiah 53:1, how does that somehow refute what I said? What's your point?

thanks

I'm not refuting what you said. I closely agree with you, except for the "as if".
God calls things that are not, as though they were. Jesus was the Lamb slain before the foundation of the world, and God is not locked into the present tense, as we are, therefore when He declared it done, way back then, I believe it was done.

Salvation and healing and provision were all available, in Isaiah's day, although few took advantage of those promises. Jesus mentioned this fact in Nazareth, (Lk 4:25-27) The many widows and lepers in Israel, did not receive, because of their unbelief.

I believe you are exactly right about the righteous dead of OT. They went to Abraham's Bosom, or Paradise, until Jesus finished his work, then they went to his Father's house. (Jn 14:2) I think it is entirely possible that, this event occurred at Jesus' death, because some of them came by the Jerusalem Cemetery, and picked up their bodies. (Matt 27:52-53).

[crakjak]

Originally Posted by big-larry

I'm not refuting what you said. I closely agree with you, except for the "as if".
God calls things that are not, as though they were. Jesus was the Lamb slain before the foundation of the world, and God is not locked into the present tense, as we are, therefore when He declared it done, way back then, I believe it was done.

Salvation and healing and provision were all available, in Isaiah's day, although few took advantage of those promises. Jesus mentioned this fact in Nazareth, (Lk 4:25-27) The many widows and lepers in Israel, did not receive, because of their unbelief.

I believe you are exactly right about the righteous dead of OT. They went to Abraham's Bosom, or Paradise, until Jesus finished his work, then they went to his Father's house. (Jn 14:2) I think it is entirely possible that, this event occurred at Jesus' death, because some of them came by the Jerusalem Cemetery, and picked up their bodies. (Matt 27:52-53).

Hello, Big Lad how goes it?

Picked up their bodies?

[Bro-Larry]

Originally Posted by crakjak

Hello, Big Lad how goes it?

Picked up their bodies?

Every day that I wake up I am blessed.

Yeah they picked up their bodies! Read the verses!

[crakjak]

Originally Posted by big-larry

Every day that I wake up I am blessed.

Yeah they picked up their bodies! Read the verses!

Matthew 27:52-53 (New International Version)

"...the tombs broke open and the bodies of many holy people who had died were raised to life.

they came out of the tombs, and after Jesus' resurrection they went into the holy city and appeared to many people."

OK, what you are saying is that they picked their own bodies up. Proponents of soul sleep believe that they were simply awaken from their sleep.