Holiness or Hell thread

[BuckeyeBukaroo]

Originally Posted by consapente89

I think the attitude most detrimental to holiness is not an angry or frustrated attitude, but rather the “I don’t care” attitude. The casual nonchalant attitude that creeps into saints and churches will kill the spirit of holiness.

[Amanah]

One area that I find confusing is bloodshed

• self defense vs turn the other cheek
• defending our country vs conscientious objectors
• capital punishment vs abstaining from bloodshed

Is there a difference on how we deal with the above between the OT and NT?

[votivesoul]

Holiness will always be a heaven or hell issue. The Father is holy, and His holy will is done in a holy heaven, and that holy will is supposed to be prayed be accomplished here on earth, to enlarge the holiness of God to also cover the world, and not just heaven. Furthermore, there isn't anything unclean that can pass the gates, so only that which is holy can enter in. Everything else has a lake that burns with fire waiting for it.

That's the fundamental focus. After that is the specific details and definitions of holiness that causes issues. But they need not. Honest men and women, full of the Holy Spirit, and integrity, ought to be able to have sincere, important dialogue about the Bible and what it actually says, and come away with some very solid, timeless conclusions about what holiness is and how it's achieved or experienced, then maintained.

And interestingly enough, whenever such discussions break down and fail, it usually means someone participating in them is not as separated unto God as he or she or others think.

[Amanah]

Clothesline standards can be taught but not legislated. The end goal of holiness is fruit of the spirit not hypocrisy

Galatians 5:22-23King James Version (KJV). But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, longsuffering, gentleness, goodness, faith, Meekness, temperance: against such there is no law.

1 Corinthians 13
1 Though I speak with the tongues of men and of angels, but have not love, I have become sounding brass or a clanging cymbal. 2 And though I have the gift of prophecy, and understand all mysteries and all knowledge, and though I have all faith, so that I could remove mountains, but have not love, I am nothing. 3 And though I bestow all my goods to feed the poor, and though I give my body [a]to be burned, but have not love, it profits me nothing.

Holiness is obeying the bible out of love for God and my fellow human beings

[votivesoul]

Originally Posted by Amanah

Clothesline standards can be taught but not legislated. The end goal of holiness is fruit of the spirit not hypocrisy

There is some legislation on them in the Bible. Gold, costly array, that sort of thing. But even those things can get bogged down in details. What kind of gold? All kinds? Certain carats? How much is too much before it's costly?

Trying to reach a consensus is the never ending battle that seems to divide more than unify.

[Amanah]

Originally Posted by votivesoul

There is some legislation on them in the Bible. Gold, costly array, that sort of thing. But even those things can get bogged down in details. What kind of gold? All kinds? Certain carats? How much is too much before it's costly?

Trying to reach a consensus is the never ending battle that seems to divide more than unify.

Yes, but the motive must be love.

Galatians 5:22-23King James Version (KJV). But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, longsuffering, gentleness, goodness, faith, Meekness, temperance: against such there is no law.

1 Corinthians 13
1 Though I speak with the tongues of men and of angels, but have not love, I have become sounding brass or a clanging cymbal. 2 And though I have the gift of prophecy, and understand all mysteries and all knowledge, and though I have all faith, so that I could remove mountains, but have not love, I am nothing. 3 And though I bestow all my goods to feed the poor, and though I give my body [a]to be burned, but have not love, it profits me nothing.

Holiness is obeying the bible out of love for God and my fellow human beings

[Amanah]

this is holiness:

1 Corinthians 13 King James Version (KJV)
13 Though I speak with the tongues of men and of angels, and have not charity, I am become as sounding brass, or a tinkling cymbal.
2 And though I have the gift of prophecy, and understand all mysteries, and all knowledge; and though I have all faith, so that I could remove mountains, and have not charity, I am nothing.
3 And though I bestow all my goods to feed the poor, and though I give my body to be burned, and have not charity, it profiteth me nothing.
4 Charity suffereth long, and is kind; charity envieth not; charity vaunteth not itself, is not puffed up,
5 Doth not behave itself unseemly, seeketh not her own, is not easily provoked, thinketh no evil;
6 Rejoiceth not in iniquity, but rejoiceth in the truth;
7 Beareth all things, believeth all things, hopeth all things, endureth all things.
8 Charity never faileth: but whether there be prophecies, they shall fail; whether there be tongues, they shall cease; whether there be knowledge, it shall vanish away.
9 For we know in part, and we prophesy in part.
10 But when that which is perfect is come, then that which is in part shall be done away.
11 When I was a child, I spake as a child, I understood as a child, I thought as a child: but when I became a man, I put away childish things.
12 For now we see through a glass, darkly; but then face to face: now I know in part; but then shall I know even as also I am known.
13 And now abideth faith, hope, charity, these three; but the greatest of these is charity.

[consapente89]

Originally Posted by Amanah

Clothesline standards can be taught but not legislated. The end goal of holiness is fruit of the spirit not hypocrisy

Galatians 5:22-23King James Version (KJV). But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, longsuffering, gentleness, goodness, faith, Meekness, temperance: against such there is no law.

1 Corinthians 13
1 Though I speak with the tongues of men and of angels, but have not love, I have become sounding brass or a clanging cymbal. 2 And though I have the gift of prophecy, and understand all mysteries and all knowledge, and though I have all faith, so that I could remove mountains, but have not love, I am nothing. 3 And though I bestow all my goods to feed the poor, and though I give my body [a]to be burned, but have not love, it profits me nothing.

Holiness is obeying the bible out of love for God and my fellow human beings

In my experience, God is so much easier to love than the latter. God help!

Very good thread.

[consapente89]

Originally Posted by votivesoul

There is some legislation on them in the Bible. Gold, costly array, that sort of thing. But even those things can get bogged down in details. What kind of gold? All kinds? Certain carats? How much is too much before it's costly?

Trying to reach a consensus is the never ending battle that seems to divide more than unify.

No gold.

[Michael The Disciple]

Whats this all about? Was God being holy in his actions here?

Ezekiel 16:8-14

8Now when I passed by thee, and looked upon thee, behold, thy time was the time of love; and I spread my skirt over thee, and covered thy nakedness: yea, I sware unto thee, and entered into a covenant with thee, saith the Lord GOD, and thou becamest mine. 9Then washed I thee with water; yea, I throughly washed away thy blood from thee, and I anointed thee with oil. 10I clothed thee also with broidered work, and shod thee with badgers' skin, and I girded thee about with fine linen, and I covered thee with silk. 11I decked thee also with ornaments, and I put bracelets upon thy hands, and a chain on thy neck. 12And I put a jewel on thy forehead, and earrings in thine ears, and a beautiful crown upon thine head. 13Thus wast thou decked with gold and silver; and thy raiment was of fine linen, and silk, and broidered work; thou didst eat fine flour, and honey, and oil: and thou wast exceeding beautiful, and thou didst prosper into a kingdom. 14And thy renown went forth among the heathen for thy beauty: for it was perfect through my comeliness, which I had put upon thee, saith the Lord GOD.