The Authority Of God's Ministers

[Aquila]

Originally Posted by good samaritan

Someone told me recently that they got the Hoy Ghost under Bro. so and so. I asked them was it hard recieving with someone on top of them. lol. I told them I was just kidding, but at the same time we have been taught these unbiblical terms. We are called to be ministers and not lords. I give honor to those who labour in the gospel, but we can sometimes exalt someone beyond meassure.

I have heard people say that God will not call a man to a specific work without first speaking to his pastor. I just don't find that to be biblical. We should submit ourselves one to another and seek counsel from the pastor in our lives, but we are not to seek God through a middle man. We should have reverence for all the family of God and not just a select few.

This post reminds me of the following passage:

I Corinthians 1:10-17 (ESV)
10 I appeal to you, brothers, by the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, that all of you agree, and that there be no divisions among you, but that you be united in the same mind and the same judgment. 11 For it has been reported to me by Chloe's people that there is quarreling among you, my brothers. 12 What I mean is that each one of you says, “I follow Paul,” or “I follow Apollos,” or “I follow Cephas,” or “I follow Christ.” 13 Is Christ divided? Was Paul crucified for you? Or were you baptized in the name of Paul? 14 I thank God that I baptized none of you except Crispus and Gaius, 15 so that no one may say that you were baptized in my name. 16 (I did baptize also the household of Stephanas. Beyond that, I do not know whether I baptized anyone else.) 17 For Christ did not send me to baptize but to preach the gospel, and not with words of eloquent wisdom, lest the cross of Christ be emptied of its power.

We establish divisions when we claim to belong to a specific minister. And in doing so, we rob the cross of its power by glorifying a man along side Christ.

[Aquila]

Originally Posted by Sean

The role of the elder must be reexamined and not abused.
There is much said in scripture that makes all saints as equals to God, but only a couple that teach appreciations for elders.
These couple of verses have evolved into emulations.

In our fellowship we have no state licensed elders. All are therefore essentially equal. The "elders" are simply individuals who have manifested one or more of the five fold ministries in their lives and have demonstrated a calling and desire to use those gifts. If they desire to pursue the role of elder, the body votes to make them a deacon. The deacons are essentially elders in training and serve the needs of the body. For example, they make phone calls, assist with hospital visits, shut-ins, and help with our Helping Hands ministry (volunteer work at local charities). In addition, they clean up (or manage clean up) after gatherings, etc. They also teach and are allowed to lead gatherings under the watchful eye of an established elder. Many times they are tasked with providing music, if they know how to play an instrument. We try not to allow one to remain a deacon longer than 3 1/2 years. Then the elders vote to make him an elder (if there aren't three established elders, the body votes as a whole). Once one is accepted as an elder, they are encouraged to start a house church of their own.

[Sean]

Originally Posted by Aquila

In our fellowship we have no state licensed elders. All are therefore essentially equal. The "elders" are simply individuals who have manifested one or more of the five fold ministries in their lives and have demonstrated a calling and desire to use those gifts. If they desire to pursue the role of elder, the body votes to make them a deacon. The deacons are essentially elders in training and serve the needs of the body. For example, they make phone calls, assist with hospital visits, shut-ins, and help with our Helping Hands ministry (volunteer work at local charities). In addition, they clean up (or manage clean up) after gatherings, etc. They also teach and are allowed to lead gatherings under the watchful eye of an established elder. Many times they are tasked with providing music, if they know how to play an instrument. We try not to allow one to remain a deacon longer than 3 1/2 years. Then the elders vote to make him an elder (if there aren't three established elders, the body votes as a whole). Once one is accepted as an elder, they are encouraged to start a house church of their own.

That is a very good system of leadership, Chris.

Something like that is easy to send your adult kids to when they need a place to worship....safe place, free from pastor abuse.

[thephnxman]

His NAME is Jesus!

Originally Posted by good samaritan

Someone told me recently that they got the Holy Ghost under Bro. so and so. I asked them was it hard
receiving with someone on top of them. lol. I told them I was just kidding, but at the same time we have
been taught these unbiblical terms. We are called to be ministers and not lords. (1)I give honor to those
who labour in the gospel, but we can sometimes exalt someone beyond measure.
I have heard people say that (2)God will not call a man to a specific work without first speaking to his pastor.
I just don't find that to be biblical. We should submit ourselves one to another and (3)seek counsel from the
pastor in our lives, but we are not to seek God through a middle man. We should have reverence for all the
family of God and not just a select few.

(1) Honor is not the sole prerogative if the Ministry;
(2) the laying on of hands corresponds to the presbytery (full Ministry), and
not solely to a "pastor". A pastor may be led to submit (recommend) a person to
the presbytery, but if he (the pastor) is the sole Minister as a sole "church", well...
(3) we could seek counsel from a Minister, but eventually the presbytery (2-3
Ministers), should be involved.

It seems that the calling and authority of the apostle has been supplanted
by today's modern pastors.

Brother Villa