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  #11  
Old 02-01-2015, 11:12 PM
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Esaias Esaias is offline
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Re: The House of Mourning

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Originally Posted by Rudy View Post
Here.
Why do you not baptise him?
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  #12  
Old 02-02-2015, 09:20 AM
Rudy Rudy is offline
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Re: The House of Mourning

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Why do you not baptise him?

Really don't feel qualified. I know technically I could, I may have to. I would prefer more of a church setting. She for some reason is reluctant to go to an I.C...
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  #13  
Old 02-03-2015, 06:44 PM
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Re: The House of Mourning

I must say I am impressed with all the responses. Thanks, everyone.

Now, onto the meatier stuff:

(A not really short version of a much longer story)

About two - three years ago, I had a dream in which I was standing on the WI District UPCI campgrounds (I live in WI and have been to the site many many times).

A service had just ended, and in the dream, the General Manager of the resort I worked at was there, hob-knobbing it and schmoozing with several of the licensed ministers. For some reason, I was the GM's personal valet and had to go into his office on the campgrounds to retrieve his suitcase and lock the door (why would the GM of the resort I work at have an office on the WI District UPCI's campgrounds?).

I did so, but didn't appreciate how it felt to be treated so. As I came out, he was smiling big and was about to get into his car with a particular minister (someone I know personally, very well - more on this later). I gave the GM his suitcase and the dream ended.

The next day, I prayed and asked God what the dream meant, if anything. The Spirit quickened in my mind and said "The church is married to the world".

For another, more detailed description of the dream, go here:

https://votivesoul.wordpress.com/201...hip-deception/

Jump forward to the end of last October. I was in a Wednesday night service, during the singing, and I began to have a vision. I didn't know it was one at first, thinking perhaps it was just my imagination. It was as follows:

The Lord Jesus came up to me and placed His right hand on my shoulder. That was it. I wanted to make sure I wasn't in my flesh, day-dreaming or something, so I prayed about it and right away, two verses of Scripture came to mind that convinced me the vision was the real thing.

Acts 23:11,

Quote:
11. And the night following the Lord stood by him, and said, Be of good cheer, Paul: for as thou hast testified of me in Jerusalem, so must thou bear witness also at Rome.
2 Timothy 4:17,

Quote:
17. Notwithstanding the Lord stood with me, and strengthened me; that by me the preaching might be fully known, and that all the Gentiles might hear: and I was delivered out of the mouth of the lion.
From this I perceived in the Spirit that the Lord was standing by to strengthen me. I thanked Him and continued to worship, thinking the vision was over.

But it wasn't. The next part of the vision came about and was as follows:

My pastor came up from behind me and put his hand on my shoulder, the same one the Lord had just touched. I turned to face him and as I did so, he ex-communicated me as a backslider and a heretic.

I prayed immediately and told the Lord "Oh, God, I hope not". But I knew it was a true vision. I kept it to myself until the next day, when I told me wife.

The next week, on Monday, we were having a fellowship in my home, and as we prayed at the end, a sister began to prophesy. I don't remember all of it, but the part that sticks out is as follows:

"You have to trust me" (spoken in first person as though it was Christ speaking).

As soon as I heard that portion of the prophetic utterance, I knew what the Lord was saying, at least to me: Life's about to get hard.

When everything died down, I shared with the group both the thought about the prophetic word and also the vision, only leaving out the part about it being the pastor who removed me from the church.

Six people where there. I told all of them that the reason I shared the vision was because I had, in the past, experienced a dream or vision that predicted the future, but didn't tell anyone, only to have the dream or vision come to pass exactly as the Lord showed it to me. I shared, therefore, so that when the vision came to pass, I would have witnesses that could be called upon to testify that I had been warned by the Lord what was going to happen, and that He was standing with me through all of it.

Jump forward again past a lot of details, but I eventually met with the pastor and my brother (who was the assistant pastor at the time - more on this later). I told him the vision and brought up the fact that there were certain doctrines I didn't believe to be true that I thought needed to be addressed. Of the three I mentioned, only one was talked about, namely tithing, i.e. that it's wrong.

The meeting went very well, and he was seemingly on board. I asked for an opportunity to meet with the other elders (I myself being one) to share with them all my particular views on things. He agreed.

The view I especially wanted to address was Biblical eldership, i.e. moving away from the Senior Pastor, monarchial bishopric model into the way Christ really Heads His church (go to www.gloriouschurch.com for more info on Biblical eldership in case you don't know what it is).

The meeting happened November 9th, 2014, the following Sunday.

This meeting also went very well, considering. There was a lot of back and forth, pretty cordial over all. It really came down to me and the pastor, though. My brother stayed quiet. The other pastor didn't say much, either. Nor did the other elder present (We were a team of five).

After I presented my schpiel, everyone was in agreement with what I had so far said, but the pastor didn't see how what I was saying applied to our church (I presented on the world's system of government and rule and that it wasn't supposed to be so in the church of Jesus Christ).

For a while, it was like a tennis match. The pastor would say something then I would retort, back and forth. He thought it was going to be a competition to determine who would be the pastor of the church. I tried to tell them no, it wasn't the case, that the only pastor the church needs is Jesus.

After about four hours with no resolution in sight, we took a break. After we came back, I shared with them how I had for years felt called to be an evangelist, and I gave several unmistakable reasons why.

This changed every thing. Suddenly the Holy Spirit began to move and the pastor began to weep uncontrollably. He confessed how he had been secretly divided against me because he was afraid that I was some day going to leave and he didn't want me to go. Pretty soon, almost everyone was in tears and by the end, it was decided that it was time to commission me and my family as Evangelists and give us a big goodbye service so we could go about doing the work of the Lord.

There was complete unity in the room and God had revealed His will. The pastor openly repented of resisting God's will for my life, and as we all prayed at the end, it became apparent that my time at our church was over.

After everyone left, I stayed and talked one on one with the pastor. Much was said but in the end, he confessed to me that he agreed with everything I believed and he knew things needed to change, with our church and with him. He admitted to some personal failures and areas of his life that needed crucifixion (namely fear of failure, after I gently and in love called him on it).

By the end of it all, he had extended to me the "right hand of fellowship", a promised good-bye service, a commissioning to our ministry, a letter to the district on our behalf, and financial support to help us along the way.

I was ecstatic. I couldn't believe it. I had felt the Lord telling me that the vision could have been avoided, if we all would just do the right thing. And now, it had been. Praise God, I thought!

It was decided I would meet with the church board and tender my resignation and in a few weeks, an announcement would be made of what was decided and that my family and I would be moving on as members in good standing.

So that Wednesday, I came to church alone. We all met and I shared with the board the good news.

Afterward, the pastor dropped the bomb.

"Aaron, after you left last Sunday, God started speaking to me..."

Can you guess what happened?

I walked right into a trap. I was told how I had caused confusion and doubt in the leadership, especially his leadership, and that if I knew I was leaving I shouldn't have said anything at all.

But, oh, since God had already revealed His will that it was time for us to go, just make tonight your last service and see you later. No goodbye, no nothing. Especially not for my wife and kids, since they were at home.

We were ex-communicated, just as the vision from God had predicted.

The following Sunday, they had a meeting and the church was told that I was out of the will of God for assuming to leave the church and that I was in false doctrine and that I needed to repent and then we could return to the church, which was God's will for us to do. But otherwise, we were to be dis-fellowshipped.

I didn't challenge any of it, but one part. I asked about the vision. I was told it was Satan masquerading as an angel of light. When I challenged that, that position was scrapped and I was told it was a self-fulfilling prophecy, i.e. that I was secretly a backslidden heretic, so my own subconscious mind dreamed it up (none of that was stated expressly, but that's the gist of a self-fulfilling prophecy, so...)

And that is exactly what happened. Even my brother has majorly distanced himself from us. I used to see him three times a week. Now, barely once a month.

Here's the good part:

The dream I had that I shared above, I told it to the pastor not too long after it happened, at least two summers ago. He agreed it was from God and that what I thought it meant was likewise from the Lord.

The part I didn't tell him was that he was one of the ministers hob-knobbing and schmoozing with the General Manager and that he was the one getting into the car with him to drive off.

So, all as unfolded exactly as the Lord indicated it would. The Lord truly does nothing unless He reveals it to His servants, the prophets. God is good. It has not been an easy road. It did get hard, just as the prophetic word indicated it would. But Jesus has been standing beside us the whole time with His hand on us, strengthening us.

We were so close to becoming a true New Covenant church. It's all gone now. But, thank the Maker, we've found a church not too far from us which practices Biblical eldership, which doesn't preach tithing, and which gathers in just the format the Bible describes in 1 Corinthians 12-14. everyone has a song, a revelation, a doctrine, and etc. We are blessed. Jesus is enthroned as the Head. Just as He should be.

But as I wrote in my blog article above, ever since that dream, I've had continual sorrow in my heart. I still do. I still mourn and feel depressed everyday for the wrongs in the Body.

I haven't really gotten mad. My wife, however, has had a very difficult time, at least at first. She's really gotten over the anger part, but some of the hurt remains.

In the interim, I found out that my brother and the other pastor were demoted because of me and the "confusion and doubt" I caused and now there is only one pastor of the church. For the other pastor, I don't know any details, but for my brother, he was curbed because he was really starting to believe the things I do and since they are false, according to the pastor, he obviously lacked discernment and so, couldn't be allowed to pastor anymore.

So if anyone has wondered why I haven't posted as much, or why that certain someone received a PM from me asking for prayer, now you know. I've had my world turned upside down.

But it's for the better. I'm glad it happened.

Stay tuned for more as it happens...
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  #14  
Old 02-03-2015, 07:21 PM
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KeptByTheWord KeptByTheWord is offline
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Re: The House of Mourning

Wow. I knew something had been going on with you, because you hadn't been posting much. I also knew your wife was expecting a baby, and suspected that might have been part of it.

Thank you for sharing your testimony and baring your heart. Without a doubt, the Lord is undertaking something great in your life, but like anything the Lord does, it is not without its pain and suffering. I have never known the Lord to do anything significant in my life, where it did not cause me to have to give up something dear to me, in order for Him to replace it with something much better.

Your family is in our prayers, as I am sure the trauma has been felt by all. I'm so thrilled to hear that you have found a church for fellowship, and you must share more about that. That news absolutely thrills me.

We are praying for you and your family!!!!!
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  #15  
Old 02-04-2015, 08:06 PM
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Michael The Disciple Michael The Disciple is offline
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Re: The House of Mourning

Aaron,

Im sorry to hear what you have went through. I have been praying as you requested and glad you are being obviously led of the Spirit. Peace and love my brother.

PS: I would like to hear more about the new group. Seems like most of the good Churches must be in Wisconsin!

Last edited by Michael The Disciple; 02-04-2015 at 08:09 PM.
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  #16  
Old 02-07-2015, 10:18 AM
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Godsdrummer Godsdrummer is offline
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Re: The House of Mourning

Aaron,

So much of your experience parallels what happened over the course of the last 10 years in my life. Wow did I just say that? Time flies, my family has been out of the controlling church environment over 10 years now.

For me I used to keep a journal, in which I took notes in service and many times wrote my disagreement with things that were preached. On one occasion I forgot my journal at church, and a dear sister that was cleaning read some of it and took it to the pastor. The very next service the pastor made reference to the things I wrote in such a manner that it left little doubt as to who he was referring to. While I was at work that night, I was not there to defend myself. Because of the way it was presented, my wife and children would not return to that church.

The pastor retired not long after, and the new pastor that were my wife and I's best friends when we were all going into ministry took over. For a time I would continue to visit when my mom would ask me. One Sunday during Sunday school, I brought out a thought, that was truly backing up the teacher, but he took it as trying to start an argument.
When all was said and done, the pastor told me, that if I came to start an argument I was not welcome to come back. Because HE was in charge of the spiritual condition of HIS flock and he would not allow someone to confuse his saints with anything contrary to the teachings he taught. That was the last time I have darkened the church doors of any UPCI church.

Fast forward to today, we too have found a great church, that fits our spirit. My eldest daughter and husband have moved into leadership positions, bring about even more change to not only the assembly we attend but getting into position to help other churches on a broad scale.

And to add to that all my children that are adults now with families of their own are all in stages of growing in the kingdom of God the right way.

So while it hurts at the time, keep on keeping up, as I know you will. Great things are in store for you.
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  #17  
Old 02-07-2015, 10:58 AM
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Re: The House of Mourning

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Originally Posted by Godsdrummer View Post
Fast forward to today, we too have found a great church, that fits our spirit. My eldest daughter and husband have moved into leadership positions, bring about even more change to not only the assembly we attend but getting into position to help other churches on a broad scale.

And to add to that all my children that are adults now with families of their own are all in stages of growing in the kingdom of God the right way.

So while it hurts at the time, keep on keeping up, as I know you will. Great things are in store for you.
So thankful to hear how the Lord has blessed your family GD!!!! Great testimony
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  #18  
Old 02-11-2015, 01:49 PM
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Re: The House of Mourning

Just everyone knows, I'm not blowing this post off or the responses. I just don't have internet at home and I can't really use it at work without there being issues; therefore I only get limited time per week online.

But I will come back to this post soon.

Peace and God bless,

Aaron
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  #19  
Old 02-11-2015, 06:20 PM
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Re: The House of Mourning

I have created a FB page called The House of Mourning. It is what they call a "secret group" meaning only members know it exists and can be a part of it. All others won't even know it's there.

I did this because something like this requires privacy. This is Prayer Closet 101. People who are not called to this by the Lord just won't understand.

So, if anyone is on Facebook and would like to join, add me as a friend and I will add you to the group. Once added, all are welcome to post and interact with other members. Just keep things on topic.

Peace and God bless,

Aaron VanDeBogert (look for the profile pic of the drawing of Jesus that I use here as votivesoul. It's the same one I use for myself on Facebook).

PS. I do intend to respond to everyone. Just need some time. But I have read everything that has been said. Thanks again for commenting and sharing.
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Old 02-11-2015, 06:51 PM
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Re: The House of Mourning

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Originally Posted by votivesoul View Post
I have created a FB page called The House of Mourning. It is what they call a "secret group" meaning only members know it exists and can be a part of it. All others won't even know it's there.

I did this because something like this requires privacy. This is Prayer Closet 101. People who are not called to this by the Lord just won't understand.

So, if anyone is on Facebook and would like to join, add me as a friend and I will add you to the group. Once added, all are welcome to post and interact with other members. Just keep things on topic.

Peace and God bless,

Aaron VanDeBogert (look for the profile pic of the drawing of Jesus that I use here as votivesoul. It's the same one I use for myself on Facebook).

PS. I do intend to respond to everyone. Just need some time. But I have read everything that has been said. Thanks again for commenting and sharing.
Good to hear from you! I am not on FB, but pray that the Lord continues to do great things through the burden and calling He has placed on your life. Please don't forget us here on AFF if the FB page takes off
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