Why, believer or not, you seek a Monotheistic God.

[Gnostic Bishop]

[QUOTE=shazeep;1341961]

I'd like to refute point by point...unfortunately, I'm on an iPad, so please bear with me.

@ 'if a law is written,' up top, then please note which of the Hammurabic commands you think are 'bad?'

"An eye for an eye, and a tooth for a tooth." is garbage.

You can supply the next rule you wish to discuss if you agree that this one is not as good as some think.

"Evil must be done to survive?" Why do you say this?

Read post 9.

@ "can you help but do evil?" I would say that yes, I can, and yet I have not been killed for my past evils; while simultaneously wishing death upon those who have committed evil upon me in the past. More...

If you can, why did you not?

What intentional evil did you do?

And did you understand post 9 and what it says about you having to do evil as you compete for resources or a job?

Regards
DL

[shazeep]

@ "free will can only be taken," this suggests that animals have had something taken from them, rather than that we have had something given to us; and also that God did not expect that Eve would choose the fruit of knowledge, both fallacious imo...

@ "without us doing some of both, we would likely go extinct" I see a big hinge, possibly the crux of a matter; which I see Christ's refusal to be crowned (taking up Judas' temptation), thus competing with Caesar, as addressing.

I have no problems with Theistic Evo, but I think it is precisely that recognizing that the law of the jungle is inadequate for free will beings is the point there. This is distinct from the law in the garden of Eden in our mythology, the fact that most Christians abhor the term 'mythology' notwithstanding.

[shazeep]

[QUOTE=Gnostic Bishop;1341963]

Originally Posted by shazeep

"An eye for an eye, and a tooth for a tooth." is garbage.

You can supply the next rule you wish to discuss if you agree that this one is not as good as some think.



Read post 9.



If you can, why did you not?

What intentional evil did you do?

And did you understand post 9 and what it says about you having to do evil as you compete for resources or a job?

Regards
DL

Yes, of course 'an eye for an eye' is inadequate, and widely recognized as given to limit human retribution. It is not a commandment anyway. Have to exit to read post 9...

[shazeep]

Ok, I reread post 9; but you have not established that one 'must' do evil to survive, imo; billions of organisms survive quite well without it.

I can, but did not, due to selfish desires that had nothing to do with actual survival; or due to ignorance. I was, of course, able to justify it at the time.

Competing for resources or a job is an illusion that we are drawn into when we accept the worldly model of scarcity, which I do not to adhere to. I have no 'job,' only plenty of work. Haven't had a reg paycheck for years. I eat good, too, Ty God!

[BrotherEastman]

Originally Posted by Gnostic Bishop

Indeed. Wherever Christians and other religious idol worshipers hang about.

No one can lie like a Christian.

Regards
DL

You're doing a pretty bang up job yourself. lol

[shazeep]

thus evening the score, I guess...

[Gnostic Bishop]

Originally Posted by shazeep

Ok, I reread post 9; but you have not established that one 'must' do evil to survive, imo; billions of organisms survive quite well without it.

I can, but did not, due to selfish desires that had nothing to do with actual survival; or due to ignorance. I was, of course, able to justify it at the time.

Competing for resources or a job is an illusion that we are drawn into when we accept the worldly model of scarcity, which I do not to adhere to. I have no 'job,' only plenty of work. Haven't had a reg paycheck for years. I eat good, too, Ty God!

That does not take away the fact that you had to compete for resources and had to do evil to the loser of that competition. So that makes this a lie.

"selfish desires that had nothing to do with actual survival;"

Regards
DL

[shazeep]

Originally Posted by Gnostic Bishop

That does not take away the fact that you had to compete for resources and had to do evil to the loser of that competition. So that makes this a lie.

Regards
DL

i disagree. While I may have competed to some extent for resources in the past, it was in ignorance, and i def did not have to-I just thought I did. Scarcity is an illusion, that may only be perpetrated upon Gnostics, wadr. Or, what resources do you suppose that I must compete for? This thinking = 'the world' to me; and I will tell you that I have gone to what even most Christians would describe as extraordinary lengths to disenfranchise myself from the world. However, I am still a hypocrite, so...enlighten me.

[Gnostic Bishop]

If you think scarcity to be an illusion, then why is it that about 10 million children under the age of 10 starve and die of other preventable cause yearly?

Regards
DL

[shazeep]

Because we choose human government over spiritual, in a rejection of God, as outlined in 1Sam8; and now suffer the consequences down there at the bottom of the story. The world's leaders have plainly stated their goals of population reduction, which for me at least reduce to 'killing humans,' satan's fave sport. Surely you are aware of the estimates of some 50-70 billions that the earth could actually support; yet it is prolly a crime for you to grow vegetables in your front yard