I Joined the UPC

[Sam]

Originally Posted by Jay

I would not be surprised by any of this. It is a well known fact that this is where they are going.

Maybe my dream is "prophetic."
I'm 75 years old and may not see this happen in my life personally but in our lifetime we may see the UPC go this way.

I remember quite a few years ago I had a very brief dream. I was in a store, I think it was a bakery and someone asked me, "Did you hear about the merger between the UPC and Pentecost?" That was the extent of the dream. I took "Pentecost" as meaning what we some times call "trinity pentecost."

[Monterrey]

You seen all the facial hair on them lately?

Symbol of pride and that goes before destruction.

They all look like they are purpose driven!

[seekerman]

Originally Posted by Jay

I would not be surprised by any of this. It is a well known fact that this is where they are going.

Where are they going?

[tv1a]

I look forward to the day the upci gets back to the Bible and out of the manual.

Originally Posted by Jay

I would not be surprised by any of this. It is a well known fact that this is where they are going.

[seekerman]

Originally Posted by tv1a

I look forward to the day the upci gets back to the Bible and out of the manual.

Whatchamean? Give specific examples of the UPCI being 'out of the bible'.

[LifeGuide]

For the record; 4 Pastors in 87 yrs. (including Pastor Urshan). Pretty good by most standards. And your dream sounds very much like Jesus' last prayer before ascending to heaven.

Originally Posted by Sam

I only heard him preach once and that was a sermon I downloaded. He does all right. I would expect him to go "far" in the UPC.

There are currently 3 "UPC" churches in Cincinnati. Joel Urshan pastors one of the oldest. It was started in the 1920's when Bro. Frank Curts took over a split group that had left another church. I'm not sure if any of the non-UPC churches in Cincinnati are descended from that church that was split back then or not. Bro. Curts came from Indiana and started with about 13 people and got up to several hundred at one time. It was called Bethlehem Tabernacle and later changed the name to First Apostolic (FAC).

In 1945 a group split off the congregation Bro. Curts was pastoring and became the Full Gospel Church. They later hired a pastor, Joe David Sizemore, and then became an ALJC Church. After Joe David Sizemore died he was replaced by Shelley Hendricks and the church became UPC. I think it is still UPC and also affiliated with Joel Osteen.

The FAC church split in the 1960's and Bro. and Sis. Norman Paslay left with a pretty good sized group and started the Calvary Church which is now pastored by their son Norman Paslay III

FAC passed to Bro. Leroy Buller after Bro. Curts died and Bro. Buller pastored until he retired. He is now the "Bishop" and they have been through 2 or 3 pastors. Joel Urshan is the current pastor

[Jay]

Originally Posted by seekerman

Where are they going?

They are moving toward the open wearing of more ostentatious jewelry, cutting of women's hair, women wearing pants, etc. This is why his dream comes as no surprise to me. For the last several years, they have been interested in having ecumenical discussions with other churches. It is one thing when they were speaking with the PAW, ALJC, and other Oneness orgs. However, they have also started engaging in talks with the AOG, the Church of the Nazarene, and others.

[Sam]

Originally Posted by Jay

They are moving toward the open wearing of more ostentatious jewelry, cutting of women's hair, women wearing pants, etc. This is why his dream comes as no surprise to me. For the last several years, they have been interested in having ecumenical discussions with other churches. It is one thing when they were speaking with the PAW, ALJC, and other Oneness orgs. However, they have also started engaging in talks with the AOG, the Church of the Nazarene, and others.

I personally wish the split over the Godhead had not happened almost 100 years ago and that the OP's were all still preaching justification/salvation/regeneration at faith/repentance followed by water baptism ("formula" left up to local pastor and congregation) and the Holy Ghost as an enduement of power for those who are saved.

[Jay]

Originally Posted by Sam

I personally wish the split over the Godhead had not happened almost 100 years ago and that the OP's were all still preaching justification/salvation/regeneration at faith/repentance followed by water baptism ("formula" left up to local pastor and congregation) and the Holy Ghost as an enduement of power for those who are saved.

I believe that the split was inevitable. You can not have two such doctrines battling for supremacy in an organization. The very bedrock of Christological understanding was being shaken. Further, the 'traditional' mode of baptism was being altered, and that had implications for the wider church world in general, and Protestantism in particular. If baptism in Jesus' name was the only legitimate mode, that meant that all of their ancestors could be in lost. This made it easier to reject the new doctrines. The 'Light Doctrine' was an attempt to cover this base without compromising newly revealed truth. This of course satisfied neither the traditionalists, nor those who strongly embraced the new doctrines.

This made a split inevitable, if undesirable. The fact of the matter is that the Assemblies of God would be the largest Oneness organization today if the split had not occurred. That was how rapid the spread of the doctrine was. Had they waited another five years to oppose the Oneness doctrine, it would have been to late, as the major figures in the AOG would have been supporting it.

[seekerman]

Originally Posted by Jay

They are moving toward the open wearing of more ostentatious jewelry, cutting of women's hair, women wearing pants, etc. This is why his dream comes as no surprise to me. For the last several years, they have been interested in having ecumenical discussions with other churches. It is one thing when they were speaking with the PAW, ALJC, and other Oneness orgs. However, they have also started engaging in talks with the AOG, the Church of the Nazarene, and others.

And I'm assuming you feel this is a bad thing?