What gives Apostolics the right...

[jfrog]

Originally Posted by MissBrattified

I did a quick search, and I had to wonder...who got left out? I suppose this is referring to the original 12, including the one who replaced Judas.

Revelations 21:14 And the wall of the city had twelve foundations, and in them the names of the twelve apostles of the Lamb.

Paul [Saul] presumably received the Holy Ghost at the hands of Ananias, who was not among that number.

We do not know how, where or when Paul received the Holy Ghost. The account with Ananias does not say.

You are right that Revelations speaks only of 12 apostles. It almost implies that there are just 12 apostles...

[pelathais]

Originally Posted by MissBrattified

I guess the obvious question would be, then: Who were the "apostles?" What were the qualifications that made them such?

Acts 1:21-26. And then Paul was called and ordained as an apostles later after having seen the risen Lord. The other apostles all confirmed Paul position as such.

[pelathais]

Originally Posted by jfrog

We do not know how, where or when Paul received the Holy Ghost. The account with Ananias does not say.

You are right that Revelations speaks only of 12 apostles. It almost implies that there are just 12 apostles...

The "foundation" upon which the church is built can be seen as the ministry and testimony of "the Twelve" (Jesus Christ Himself being the Chief Cornerstone). They are the symbolic representation of the Twelve Patriarchs of the people of Israel.

I suppose, that just as the children of the patriarchs shared in the name, position and authority as members of the "people of God" in OT times, so also might the spiritual children of the apostles be seen in a similar way.

Historically, the whole thing had to get started some how. Real human beings living real lives were impacted and placed into situations where they and their actions became the "foundation" of what was to follow.

In the OT it was the patriarchs and their natural progeny. In the NT it is "the Twelve" and their spiritual heirs.

[MissBrattified]

Originally Posted by jfrog

We do not know how, where or when Paul received the Holy Ghost. The account with Ananias does not say.

You are right that Revelations speaks only of 12 apostles. It almost implies that there are just 12 apostles...

You're right, it doesn't say, explicitly, but it seems implied. (To me.)

Act 9:17-18 And Ananias went his way, and entered into the house; and putting his hands on him said, Brother Saul, the Lord, even Jesus, that appeared unto thee in the way as thou camest, hath sent me, that thou mightest receive thy sight, and be filled with the Holy Ghost. ...And immediately there fell from his eyes as it had been scales: and he received sight forthwith, and arose, and was baptized.

Originally Posted by pelathais

Acts 1:21-26. And then Paul was called and ordained as an apostles later after having seen the risen Lord. The other apostles all confirmed Paul position as such.

No doubt that Paul was an apostle...but is this passage about him?

[Praxeas]

So what is the real point here? Why we ask the same question or laying on hands by Apostles?

BTW what gives evangelicals the right to quote Paul? How come they can quote Paul but we can't?

Act 16:31 And they said, Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ and you shall be saved, and your household.

[pelathais]

Originally Posted by Praxeas

So what is the real point here? Why we ask the same question or laying on hands by Apostles?

BTW what gives evangelicals the right to quote Paul? How come they can quote Paul but we can't?

Act 16:31 And they said, Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ and you shall be saved, and your household.

Well, that cleared things up for me.

[MissBrattified]

Originally Posted by pelathais

Well, that cleared things up for me.

[Michael The Disciple]

Originally Posted by Praxeas

So what is the real point here? Why we ask the same question or laying on hands by Apostles?

BTW what gives evangelicals the right to quote Paul? How come they can quote Paul but we can't?

Act 16:31 And they said, Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ and you shall be saved, and your household.

Good question Prax.

[pelathais]

Originally Posted by MissBrattified

You're right, it doesn't say, explicitly, but it seems implied. (To me.)

Act 9:17-18 And Ananias went his way, and entered into the house; and putting his hands on him said, Brother Saul, the Lord, even Jesus, that appeared unto thee in the way as thou camest, hath sent me, that thou mightest receive thy sight, and be filled with the Holy Ghost. ...And immediately there fell from his eyes as it had been scales: and he received sight forthwith, and arose, and was baptized.



No doubt that Paul was an apostle...but is this passage about him?

No. I should have stressed the "AND THEN" part. Acts 1, happened and the number of "The Twelve" was replenished. AND THEN (years later) the circumstances involving Paul took place.

Paul was called to salvation when the number of the Twelve remained intact. Then James was killed in Acts 12:1. Many have suggested that this was the impetus for Paul's elevation to apostleship, though of course the text is silent about that.

And, the office of an apostle appears to be something different from the "Foundation of the Apostles" or being numbered in "The Twelve."

[Praxeas]

Originally Posted by pelathais

Well, that cleared things up for me.

I shall punish you for your insolence!