Stew,
Why would they join in the first place if they felt conflicted? They know they are going to end up in the Middle East, so what's the point of enlisting?
I know career military people who are Muslim and or Arabic who didn't join assuming they would be fighting in the Middle East. I know some who joined for the same reasons that many other people join...because they love America and would like to defend her. I don't think it's as simple as saying no Arabic or Muslim should join the military. We went years and years without these types of wars in the Middle East. If we would have attacked one of the other Axis of Evil like North Korea should our only approach be "why did you join"?
When you have so many Americans wondering why we get involved in certain things, you have to recognize that Arab American Muslims are that much more conflicted.
I think that there are legitimate things that should be candidly explored.
__________________
There are no weapons of mass destruction in Iraq, Chuck Norris lives in Houston.
Either the United States will destroy ignorance, or ignorance will destroy the United States. – W.E.B. DuBois
That is so much different, IMO, than a Muslim or Jew joining. A pacifist might think he/she can do their stint and go on to college. The global war is more personal, IMO, for a Jew or a Muslim.
My point is the same in both of these situations. If we were ever (God forbid) in a situation where we attacked and occupied Isreal, I think that the conflict of the soldiers should not be ignored. My approach then would not be "why did an Israeli or Jew join the military". And now that they're in I would look to find ways to address it.
__________________
There are no weapons of mass destruction in Iraq, Chuck Norris lives in Houston.
Either the United States will destroy ignorance, or ignorance will destroy the United States. – W.E.B. DuBois
Pretending that it doesn't exist is irresponsible and a little insensitive in my opinion. I would certainly consider allowing those who legitimately did not want to serve in that theater the option of not doing so.
__________________
There are no weapons of mass destruction in Iraq, Chuck Norris lives in Houston.
Either the United States will destroy ignorance, or ignorance will destroy the United States. – W.E.B. DuBois
I know career military people who are Muslim and or Arabic who didn't join assuming they would be fighting in the Middle East. I know some who joined for the same reasons that many other people join...because they love America and would like to defend her. I don't think it's as simple as saying no Arabic or Muslim should join the military. We went years and years without these types of wars in the Middle East. If we would have attacked one of the other Axis of Evil like North Korea should our only approach be "why did you join"?
When you have so many Americans wondering why we get involved in certain things, you have to recognize that Arab American Muslims are that much more conflicted.
I think that there are legitimate things that should be candidly explored.
Yes, but we are talking about now and not years ago. I think there probably are some Muslims that want to fight because they love America. Human beings love life and if they look at the country they could be a part of and don't agree with it and know they can come here to gain freedom from that - let them fight.
I personally believe that mistakes are made in war and life that teach us. We never thought someone would drive planes through buildings, but NOW we know, so we watch for that.
We are at a point where the American people are fed up with the "politucal correctness" and this Killeen incident is a good example. If someone has any legitimate signs of siding with the enemy, they need to be pulled.
Pretending that it doesn't exist is irresponsible and a little insensitive in my opinion. I would certainly consider allowing those who legitimately did not want to serve in that theater the option of not doing so.
I believe they ignored a lot of red flags on this guy for sure.
__________________
Master of Science in Applied Disgruntled Religious Theorist Wrangling
PhD in Petulant Tantrum Quelling
Dean of the School of Hard Knocks
My point is the same in both of these situations. If we were ever (God forbid) in a situation where we attacked and occupied Isreal, I think that the conflict of the soldiers should not be ignored. My approach then would not be "why did an Israeli or Jew join the military". And now that they're in I would look to find ways to address it.
Well, I think we could take an example from the Bible - if they will kneel down and lap water like a dog - they get to fight. Otherwise, you are released.
But, seriously, I don't know the process when they take that oath. At some point, it needs to be especially expressed to all that we don't have to voice what religion we are, but if this is ever a conflict for you, then you need to rethink it because this is America, you live here, you have taken a pledge to uphold that and to guard this country with your life, if you can't do that, you need to get out. We will come after you, if you look like you are turning on us.
Yes, but we are talking about now and not years ago. I think there probably are some Muslims that want to fight because they love America. Human beings love life and if they look at the country they could be a part of and don't agree with it and know they can come here to gain freedom from that - let them fight.
I personally believe that mistakes are made in war and life that teach us. We never thought someone would drive planes through buildings, but NOW we know, so we watch for that.
We are at a point where the American people are fed up with the "politucal correctness" and this Killeen incident is a good example. If someone has any legitimate signs of siding with the enemy, they need to be pulled.
I'm not talking about extremist. I'm talking about decent hard-working military men and women who may have legitimate conflict. I think often the extremes get in the way of addressing the middle where most of us live. On one hand you have political correctness forbidding a legitimate discussion. On the other hand you have extreme fear of being considered unAmerican forbidding a legitimate discussion.
If I step back and objectively put myself in the shoes of a practicing Muslim of Arabic background I can see myself being legitimately conflicted. Heck, I'm a black Apostolic and I'm conflicted about our Middle East policies and our involvement.
__________________
There are no weapons of mass destruction in Iraq, Chuck Norris lives in Houston.
Either the United States will destroy ignorance, or ignorance will destroy the United States. – W.E.B. DuBois
I'm not talking about extremist. I'm talking about decent hard-working military men and women who may have legitimate conflict. I think often the extremes get in the way of addressing the middle where most of us live. On one hand you have political correctness forbidding a legitimate discussion. On the other hand you have extreme fear of being considered unAmerican forbidding a legitimate discussion.
If I step back and objectively put myself in the shoes of a practicing Muslim of Arabic background I can see myself being legitimately conflicted. Heck, I'm a black Apostolic and I'm conflicted about our Middle East policies and our involvement.
Even if they are not extremist - they have taken an oath. America places a great deal of comfort in the fact that they have taken an oath. So, IMO, there are no excuses. Either do it or get out.
Even if they are not extremist - they have taken an oath. America places a great deal of comfort in the fact that they have taken an oath. So, IMO, there are no excuses. Either do it or get out.
Yeah, we give all politicians an oath to uphold the constitution, etc...how's that working out for ya
I'm just saying that often things are multi-layered and not so simple. Getting out is not always an option. And like I said this is not just a Muslim thing to me, I would be saying the same thing if we had to fight Israel. I think it is something to consider.
Having taken the oath, how would I as a devout Apostolic feel about fighting other devout Apostolics in the birthplace and epicenter of Apostolism(is that a word?). When you factor in the opinion that many have that we should not be there or that most of the people that are dying did not attack us, it leaves a lot of room for legitimate concern that should be addressed IMHO.
Of course, I never expect PO to agree with MHO. LOL
__________________
There are no weapons of mass destruction in Iraq, Chuck Norris lives in Houston.
Either the United States will destroy ignorance, or ignorance will destroy the United States. – W.E.B. DuBois
The aversion of the media to mentioning Islam in connection with Hasan is crumbling. This is becoming less an issue of a man's conflicted psychology and more an issue of the man simply being a terrorist. ABCNews has in interesting article about this now.
There was no doubt in my mind that he did become a terrorist. He may have been a man who was always an extremist, I do not know. But I do think that it is also possible for conflicted psycholgy to lead to terrorism. In fact, if I had more time I would be interested in looking into situations that may reflect that.
Either way, I was not just talking about those who go to the extreme that he did, but about the many other who probably won't.
__________________
There are no weapons of mass destruction in Iraq, Chuck Norris lives in Houston.
Either the United States will destroy ignorance, or ignorance will destroy the United States. – W.E.B. DuBois
Linear Mode
