Obama's SS: Step One

[scotty]

Originally Posted by Aquila

My wife's family is Jewish. One thing that a lot of non-Jewish people never notice is how often so many compare their political adversaries to "Hitler". Jews get tired of hearing it because people have compared Bush, Clinton, Reagan, Nixon, etc. to Hitler...and NONE of them come close to being as evil as Hitler. Now, to compare Obama to Hitler is to essentially downgrade Hitler's evil to that of an average American politician. That's offensive to some Jews, especially a sizable number of the Jewish community who voted for him.

Oh for the love of Pete will ya'll get over yourselves !! There is no comparison like this being made on this thread ! Wow, the attempt to build a city on a garden plot here is just amazing.

Now, on another note, most Western countries around the World including Britain, Israel, Canada, Italy, and many, many, many more have a process whereby local law enforcement can be placed under the authority of the national government, especially in the event of a national emergency.

None of this is unexpected. I'm all for diligence and keeping an eye on this kind of thing...but this is par for the course in the post-9/11 world we live in.

Exactly, but, what you speak of is already in place. It was put into place within the policies of the Homeland Security Department. So why this ?

I think we should be weary of those who cry wolf. Think about it... a lot of the same people who are crying wolf with Obama right now unconditionally supported the Bush Administration's Patriot Act and the preemptive invasion of Iraq which was based on highly questionable intelligence. If you ask me, that's far closer to being despot than anything we've seen to date.

And this is just more in a direction that is not intended here. I could care less about everyones political asspirations based on what little knowledge they have of true government operations. (and yes , I know you work for the federal government, still does not hold water as I have seen your post in this area before)

I had no problem with the Patriot Act, as far as Im concerned, those who truley believed that the government is listening to them whispering sweet nothings to there girlfriends are right up there with the UFO loonies. If your not discussing bomb building then they didnt care less about your phone calls to grandma.

And start another thread if you really want to rehash Iraq because your statement above is right off the script from last weeks "The View"..

If Bush ever pushed a policy to have a federal police force I would have been calling him on it too.

[Aquila]

Originally Posted by scotty

And this is just more in a direction that is not intended here. I could care less about everyones political asspirations based on what little knowledge they have of true government operations. (and yes , I know you work for the federal government, still does not hold water as I have seen your post in this area before)

I had no problem with the Patriot Act, as far as Im concerned, those who truley believed that the government is listening to them whispering sweet nothings to there girlfriends are right up there with the UFO loonies. If your not discussing bomb building then they didnt care less about your phone calls to grandma.

And start another thread if you really want to rehash Iraq because your statement above is right off the script from last weeks "The View"..

If Bush ever pushed a policy to have a federal police force I would have been calling him on it too.

Bro, the point is, this was already in works long before Obama. Obama's just the man of the hour who's going with one of the plans that's been discussed for the past few years. Things like this weren't just thought up yesterday by the Obama Administration. Plus consider how much many of these agency heads have been pressuring the White House to streamline their domestic security and law enforcement processes since 9/11. Obama isn't the only one pushing this agenda. This has been in the works and has been supported by many high level agency heads since 9/11.

Scotty my bro... the word "alarmist" comes to mind. But... I do see your concern. I think there needs to be some definite checks and balances to this so as to not give a President or the Pentagon too much power on the domestic front. We'll have to see how it all unfolds.

[Pressing-On]

Originally Posted by Aquila

Bro, the point is, this was already in works long before Obama. Obama's just the man of the hour who's going to go with one of the plans that's been discussed for the past few years.

You are right, it did start with the Clintons. The government funds half of Public Allies through Clinton's Americorps. Obama wants to have it fully funded and expand it to a national program. It is estimated to cost about $500 billion.

Obama's words: "We've got to have a civilian national security force that's just as powerful, just as strong, just as well-funded" as the military, he said.

[scotty]

Originally Posted by Aquila

Bro, the point is, this was already in works long before Obama. Obama's just the man of the hour who's going with one of the plans that's been discussed for the past few years. Things like this weren't just thought up yesterday by the Obama Administration. Plus consider how much many of these agency heads have been pressuring the White House to streamline their domestic security and law enforcement processes since 9/11. Obama isn't the only one pushing this agenda. This has been in the works and is supported by many high level agency heads.

Ummm, got sources ??

You see, as I have said. This is already being done through the Homeland Security Dept. That was one of the main objectives of its creation after 911. And again, if you will read my first post, I have stated that this was brought up during the campaign about 8 or 9 months ago, not yesterday or suddenly. I see no where nor have I seen anywhere that this has been in the works nor that there is a push for this from any heads of government. Otherwise there would be no need for a Presidential directive, he could just run it through the process like anything else.

[scotty]

Originally Posted by Pressing-On

Obama's words: "We've got to have a civilian national security force that's just as powerful, just as strong, just as well-funded" as the military, he said.

And if this is to be funded by the federal government, then ok, no problem there. But who controls it ?

And Americorps is a huge volunteer program that has little law enforcement authority or initiative as it stands now, this addition would have to be new and seperate all together.

[Pressing-On]

Originally Posted by scotty

And if this is to be funded by the federal government, then ok, no problem there. But who controls it ?

The bigger question is, "Why is it necessary?" If there is a civil war in this country, and it is surely heading in that direction, civilians will protect themselves with their own firearms. If it is outside interference, Americans always rally and the military enlisting rises. There is no need, IMO, for a civilian force.

[nahkoe]

Originally Posted by Pressing-On

The bigger question is, "Why is it necessary?" If there is a civil war in this country, and it is surely heading in that direction, civilians will protect themselves with their own firearms. If it is outside interference, Americans always rally and the military enlisting rises. There is no need, IMO, for a civilian force.

Exactly.

[Aquila]

Originally Posted by Pressing-On

You are right, it did start with the Clintons. The government funds half of Public Allies through Clinton's Americorps. Obama wants to have it fully funded and expand it to a national program. It is estimated to cost about $500 billion.

Obama's words: "We've got to have a civilian national security force that's just as powerful, just as strong, just as well-funded" as the military, he said.

You're exactly right. A lot of people don't have a clue. Even the majority of the policies found in the Patriot Act were drafted under President Clinton as a response to the first WTC attack in 1993 and were opposed by the GOP. Very little of the Patriot Act was from the Bush Administration. Even the controversial wiretapping processes were part of Clinton's package. Many don't know that it was the Republican Congress that rejected and defeated Clinton's domestic security policies, challenging them on Constitutional grounds, and accusing President Clinton of trying to distract Americans from his scandalous affair with Monica Lewinski when he launched cruise missile attacks to kill bin Laden and disrupt al Queda. Clinton even sent legislation to Congress to add tagents to explosives, providing better tracking of explosives used by terrorists. It was defeated by the Republicans in Congress because of opposition from the NRA.

It's all a mess.

But the point is.... much of this has been in the works long before Obama.

[Pressing-On]

Originally Posted by Aquila

You're exactly right. A lot of people don't have a clue. Even the majority of the policies found in the Patriot Act were drafted under President Clinton as a response to the first WTC attack in 1993 and were opposed by the GOP. Very little of the Patriot Act was from the Bush Administration. Even the controversial wiretapping processes were part of Clinton's package. Many don't know that it was the Republican Congress that rejected and defeated Clinton's domestic security policies, challenging them on Constitutional grounds, and accusing President Clinton of trying to distract Americans from his scandalous affair with Monica Lewinski when he launched cruise missile attacks to kill bin Laden and disrupt al Queda. Clinton even sent legislation to Congress to add tagents to explosives, providing better tracking of explosives used by terrorists. It was defeated by the Republicans in Congress because of opposition from the NRA.

It's all a mess.

But the point is.... much of this has been in the works long before Obama.

You are correct, BUT Obama has been a tool for them. As you see he set up the Public Allies deal in 1992.

[scotty]

Originally Posted by Aquila

You're exactly right. A lot of people don't have a clue. Even the majority of the policies found in the Patriot Act were drafted under President Clinton as a response to the first WTC attack in 1993 and were opposed by the GOP. Very little of the Patriot Act was from the Bush Administration. Even the controversial wiretapping processes were part of Clinton's package. Many don't know that it was the Republican Congress that rejected and defeated Clinton's domestic security policies, challenging them on Constitutional grounds, and accusing President Clinton of trying to distract Americans from his scandalous affair with Monica Lewinski when he launched cruise missile attacks to kill bin Laden and disrupt al Queda. Clinton even sent legislation to Congress to add tagents to explosives, providing better tracking of explosives used by terrorists. It was defeated by the Republicans in Congress because of opposition from the NRA.

It's all a mess.

But the point is.... much of this has been in the works long before Obama.

Sorry , two different subjects. Again what you speak of is a federally funded volunteer force...thats been known. Obama has stated the desire for an active force under federal authority. FBI foot soilders if you will. Whether or not he can build it to that point without opposition remains to be seen. But the fact that this has been a Democratic goal is no less surprising either.