Worth The Watch!! - Page 2

Falla39 · #11 09-06-2008, 12:24 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tstew

Falla, that is a very moving video. I certainly respect that kid and the sacrifice that he made. However, without getting into the specifics of the Iraq war, I do think that it is a mistake to base whether or not a war was a mistake on whether there were real sacrifices made. If that were the criteria, then that would mean that every war ever fought could not have been a mistake. I recognize and respect the sacrifice that the soldiers are making and I'm able to do so and simultaneously examine the justification of asking them to do it.

As I watched the video and read of the obvious pride this young man's father had in him, I could not help but think about the parents who sent kids over there who they will never see again. I think about kids who will never know their mother or father and how our decisions today will shape families and legacies for decades to come.

Arguing the merits of the Iraq war is one thing in my opinion, but tying the justification for the war to the level of the sacrifice our kids are making is a mistake to me.

Bro. Tstew,

In 1944, my late father, a young man in his twenties, with a young wife
and four small children under seven yrs. old, was DRAFTED into a war known
as WWII. He didn't decide on his own to go, he was drafted by his country.
I had just had my 5th birthday three days before he was inducted into the
United States Army. Dad didn't want to leave his family and his parents even
went and spoke with the gentleman who represented our local draft board.
They knew it would be an hardship on the family. But to no avail.

Dad served in the Phillipeans and also in Japan. Dad did not carry a weapon
but served as a medical aide man right on the front lines of battle.He couldn't
conscienteously do some things, but he would do what he could do. He treated
the wounded and help carry the bodies of those killed in battle, off of the front
lines. I can't even imagine what it must have been like to have been where he had been.
But God brought him safely back to us after the war. Dad learned a whole lot about what
it meant to REALLY trust God, no matter the location or situation he found himself in.

David found himself in some situations but he had learned to trust God in
the everyday life. First he killed a lion and a bear. Then later Goliath. He
took on a bunch of Philistines, etc. What David learned that no matter the
location or situation, God would be with him.

Dad came back home and over a period of years, raised eleven children,
founded a work for God, beginning it with his own family, and fathered or
pastored that work for over 30 yrs. until God took him Home. Just as Noah
built an ark to the saving of his OWN house, Dad built a "place where his
own family could be saved. November will mark 50 yrs. since that "plant
was planted". Three generations of my own children and grandchildren still
attend there. Strong men begat strong families that begat strong faith in
God and in His Word. Our two eldest grandsons are called to the ministry.
One grandson (we have 15 g-sons, 5 g-daughters) will turn 15 yrs. old
tomorrow and will preach his first sermon Sunday morning, the Lord willing.

Living and trusting in God has not been spasmatic but has been a LIFESTYLE!

It began with a young man that was CALLED by men to serve for his country.
Later he was called by GOD to serve in HIS ARMY. Fighting the good fight of
faith, and laying hold of eternal life. Not that which is spiritual first but that
which is natural. And then that which is spiritual. Paul said a man should first
know how to take care of his own house. If he can't take care of his own
house, how can he take care or rule over the house of GOD!

I heard my Dad say that his experience in the Army and in trusting God as
a young man, (ever having been over 60 miles away from his small home
town) and going half way around the world and back, helped him a lot in
trusting in God for many other things. He and Mom trusted God for every-
thing. They believed God could do anything but lie and fail. Seeing their
faith in God has influenced my life tremendeously.

Avoiding the hard things in life doesn't make us "strong in the Lord and in
the power of His might, but the overcoming of the things that come our way
and trusting and looking unto Jesus, the Author and Finisher of our faith.

Jesus said there would be wars and rumors of war. To the one that puts
their trust in the Lord, whose Word says that "the steps of a good man
are ordered by the Lord, can know that whatever befalls them, God doeth
all things well.

Paul said that "if in this life only we had hope, we would be of all men most
miserable".

Brother, this is lengthy but it is what I felt to write. May God use it to bless
someone, in Jesus Name!

No offense is ever intended in my posts!

Blessings,

Falla39

Falla39 · #12 09-06-2008, 12:36 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tstew

CN, I would never diminish the sacrifice that any person military person and their families have made. I was raised in a military household. My father was in the army for 22 years before he became a missionary. My only point was that we cannot use the valant bravery and sacrifice of those like your dad and your brother as justification to put them in harm's way in the first place. I thank God that your dad and your brother and my dad returned (to fulfil his purpose as a missionary). I'm just saying that many will never return to fulfil their destiny and we must be sure that our admiration for their sacrifice is not being used as the justification to demand that sacrifice.
In my opinion, it is entirely possible for good people to sacrifice and honorably serve in a war that is ill-advised and we owe their sacrifice the honor of making sure that that doesn't happen.

Dear Bro. Tstew,

Incidentally, my father came back from WWII with such a burden for
foreign missions, that in 1988 our church which was much smaller at
the time, was awarded 3rd place per capita giving worldwide. He prayed
for those places while over there and brought the burden home with him.
He was a person who sacrificed greatly for the cause of missions. He was
truly the missionary's friend.

Falla39

Falla39 · #13 09-06-2008, 07:50 AM

One more note:

When they tried to "force" Dad to carry a weapon AFTER he got overseas,
(he signed up as a conscienceous objector in the states and trained as a
medic) he told them that he was a CO, they told him they "left all those back
in states". Dad explained that the Constitution of the United States allowed him
that right. The commander told him with a few added words that "we'd
be in a "hellava mess if we all believed the way you do". To which my late father re-
plied "No, Sir! If you all believed the way I do, there would be no war". In the
end, before they came home, one of the men in a high position said, "I will say this,
Blakey is a true Christian. We get men who come over here and claim they are this
and they are that, but when the heat is on, they cave in".

A TRUE man/woman of God will STAND for what is RIGHT regardless! When they are
alone and no one but God knows, when they are overseas and the "women" make
themselves available, they will do what is right. Whatever, whenever, forever!

For a long time after Dad came home, he wouldn't talk about the things he
experienced overseas. It was after he became a pastor that he began to
tell the experiences and used them to glorify his God. They built faith in my
heart that that kind of God would be my God too. I'm sure that is what
happened to Ruth. Watching Naomi look to her God she decided, "thy God
shall be my God".

What is sad is when those brave soldiers go and fight for what they feel
is right and come home to the flag burners, the demostrators, protestors,
etc., and are made to feel that all they went through was in vain.
I believe something has been lost in our faith in God, family and country.
My late father from the time he returned from WWII, he became one of
the most patroitic men I have ever seen. He'd been there, knew both sides,
the American side and the side across the ocean.

Blessings,

Falla39

Cindy · #14 09-06-2008, 07:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tstew

CN, I would never diminish the sacrifice that any person military person and their families have made. I was raised in a military household. My father was in the army for 22 years before he became a missionary. My only point was that we cannot use the valant bravery and sacrifice of those like your dad and your brother as justification to put them in harm's way in the first place. I thank God that your dad and your brother and my dad returned (to fulfil his purpose as a missionary). I'm just saying that many will never return to fulfil their destiny and we must be sure that our admiration for their sacrifice is not being used as the justification to demand that sacrifice.
In my opinion, it is entirely possible for good people to sacrifice and honorably serve in a war that is ill-advised and we owe their sacrifice the honor of making sure that that doesn't happen.

Okay, gotcha I misunderstood your point. And my point is most wars are ill-advised, but sometimes neccessary.
But let's imagine being in a country where we couldn't openly discuss our opinions, and WMD or not some things are still worth fighting for.

tstew · #15 09-06-2008, 09:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cneasttx

Okay, gotcha I misunderstood your point. And my point is most wars are ill-advised, but sometimes neccessary.
But let's imagine being in a country where we couldn't openly discuss our opinions, and WMD or not some things are still worth fighting for.

I would not want to live in a country where we could not openly discuss our opinions...but I also would not leap to the conclusion that it is the responsibility of our kids to go over there and fight against that. When the United States found themselves in that position 200 years ago, they rose up themselves to rid themselves of the tyrrany. Of course I know that they did receive assistance from other countries who already had a vested interest, but that was years after they had begun the fight and declared independence. And the U.S. militias did the bulk of the fighting here. I resist the notion that we have the sole responsiblity of going over and freeing the oppressed...particularly if we can't say for certainty that the oppressed want us there in the first place.

I just think that the sending of kids to their deaths is a tremendous undertaking that permanently changes the landscapes of families. We do them a disservice when we allow people to use our emotional response to those who sacrifice as justification for that sacrifice.

And sometimes wars are well-advised and necessary...and I think we must be careful to not get embroiled in one of the ones that aren't.

Falla39 · #16 09-06-2008, 10:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tstew

I would not want to live in a country where we could not openly discuss our opinions...but I also would not leap to the conclusion that it is the responsibility of our kids to go over there and fight against that. When the United States found themselves in that position 200 years ago, they rose up themselves to rid themselves of the tyrrany. Of course I know that they did receive assistance from other countries who already had a vested interest, but that was years after they had begun the fight and declared independence. And the U.S. militias did the bulk of the fighting here. I resist the notion that we have the sole responsiblity of going over and freeing the oppressed...particularly if we can't say for certainty that the oppressed want us there in the first place. I just think that the sending of kids to their deaths is a tremendous undertaking that permanently changes the landscapes of families. We do them a disservice when we allow people to use our emotional response to those who sacrifice as justification for that sacrifice.

And sometimes wars are well-advised and necessary...and I think we must be careful to not get embroiled in one of the ones that aren't.

Brother,

Would that apply to the missionaries going over there! What if those
that are oppressed in the foreign lands do not want us there.

Blessings,

Falla39

tstew · #17 09-06-2008, 10:21 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Falla39

Brother,

Would that apply to the missionaries going over there! What if those
that are oppressed in the foreign lands do not want us there.

Blessings,

Falla39

Sis Falla, I would absolutely not apply that to missionaries as we have a God-given mandate to spread the gospel to the ends of the earth...but I honestly don't see it as the same thing.

Falla39 · #18 09-06-2008, 12:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tstew

Sis Falla, I would absolutely not apply that to missionaries as we have a God-given mandate to spread the gospel to the ends of the earth...but I honestly don't see it as the same thing.

Bro. Tstew,

No offense intended! Just a thought!

Blessings,

Falla39