Incarnation OR Indwelling?

[Steve Epley]

Originally Posted by tbpew

DerrickS,
stay the course, being fully led by the spirit that is within you.
If somebody says "you are not oneness", don't take it as point needing to be defended.

Godliness is the privilege of the creature being partaker in the divine purpose.

Our 'joint heir' gave a clear perspective when he witnessed:
The words which I speak are not my own, but the father who has sent me, he does the works. (see John 14:10)

It is what indwells the vessel that has the words of eternal life.
The vessel has no ability or power in and of itself to do the works.
God has made his habitation (indwelling) in the hearts of men, by his spirit.

Afre you saying God indwells us in the SAME way He indwelt the Son?

[Maple Leaf]

Originally Posted by Esther

Didn't want to lose this discussion from another thread.

Posted by Mapleleaf

The Son was not a body in which God dwelt; the Son was God manifested in flesh, Emmanuel, God with us.


It is the difference between incarnation and indwelling.

In Christ, God did not indwell a man, God became a man.

The birth of Christ was a unique joining of absolute Deity with perfect humanity, and of this we say, great is the mystery of godliness."

Not long ago I listened, horror stricken, to a man, immersed in the teachings of the modern Gnostics, say "I am not equal to God, but I am equal to Jesus."

That, I would submit, is the inevitable result of teaching indwelling versus incarnation.

The Son of God was, and is, incarnate Deity. I am a man indwelt by the Spirit of God.

Read the following post in the light of what I have just said, and then do a little Internet search on the use of the term "joint heir" among the disciples of Hagin and Copeland.

Originally Posted by tbpew

DerrickS,
stay the course, being fully led by the spirit that is within you.
If somebody says "you are not oneness", don't take it as point needing to be defended.

Godliness is the privilege of the creature being partaker in the divine purpose.

Our 'joint heir' gave a clear perspective when he witnessed:
The words which I speak are not my own, but the father who has sent me, he does the works. (see John 14:10)

It is what indwells the vessel that has the words of eternal life.
The vessel has no ability or power in and of itself to do the works.
God has made his habitation (indwelling) in the hearts of men, by his spirit.

[Maple Leaf]

Originally Posted by Steve Epley

Afre you saying God indwells us in the SAME way He indwelt the Son?

Ah, brother, you posted while I was preparing my post.

That is the inevitable end of the "indwelling" doctrine.

[tbpew]

Steve, your question does not give me any clear terms to use to reply. “In the same way?” what does mean?

So I will offer this for others…
The spirit of God indwelled his only begotten Son by virtue of God making his abode with his Son. So in that regard, YES, God indwelled his only begotten Son “in the same way”.

But what your question doesn’t even consider is the dramatic differences between our ROAD to the earthly REALM and the manner by which the only begotten Son of God entered into this earthly stage.

I am from BELOW, the only begotten Son of God is from ABOVE.
I was born first of the earth, earthly. I was first born of the will of my earthly father.

He was born of the will of the Spirit. He was fathered (begat by) the Spirit of God when God’s word spoke the creative seed that fertilized the OVUM in his handmaiden Mary. AT THIS POINT, God’s WORD/SEED became flesh.

So, YES, God’s Spirit indwells me in the SAME MANNER as his spirit INDWELLS his only begotten Son, but the origins of the two lives in which God is tabernacled, are different.

Also, John 3:31-36 reveals that the God gave the Spirit to his only begotten Son NOT WITH MEASURE, but we, as children by adoption, have only the earnest of our promise while we remain in these earthly vessels.

John 3:31-36

He that cometh from above is above all: he that is of the earth is earthly, and speaketh of the earth: he that cometh from heaven is above all.

And what he hath seen and heard, that he testifieth; and no man receiveth his testimony.

He that hath received his testimony hath set to his seal that God is true.

For he whom God hath sent speaketh the words of God: for God giveth not the Spirit by measure [unto him].

The Father loveth the Son, and hath given all things into his hand.

e that believeth on the Son hath everlasting life: and he that believeth not the Son shall not see life; but the wrath of God abideth on him

[Steve Epley]

Originally Posted by tbpew

Steve, your question does not give me any clear terms to use to reply. “In the same way?” what does mean?

So I will offer this for others…
The spirit of God indwelled his only begotten Son by virtue of God making his abode with his Son. So in that regard, YES, God indwelled his only begotten Son “in the same way”.

But what your question doesn’t even consider is the dramatic differences between our ROAD to the earthly REALM and the manner by which the only begotten Son of God entered into this earthly stage.

I am from BELOW, the only begotten Son of God is from ABOVE.
I was born first of the earth, earthly. I was first born of the will of my earthly father.

He was born of the will of the Spirit. He was fathered (begat by) the Spirit of God when God’s word spoke the creative seed that fertilized the OVUM in his handmaiden Mary. AT THIS POINT, God’s WORD/SEED became flesh.

So, YES, God’s Spirit indwells me in the SAME MANNER as his spirit INDWELLS his only begotten Son, but the origins of the two lives in which God is tabernacled, are different.

Also, John 3:31-36 reveals that the God gave the Spirit to his only begotten Son NOT WITH MEASURE, but we, as children by adoption, have only the earnest of our promise while we remain in these earthly vessels.

John 3:31-36

He that cometh from above is above all: he that is of the earth is earthly, and speaketh of the earth: he that cometh from heaven is above all.

And what he hath seen and heard, that he testifieth; and no man receiveth his testimony.

He that hath received his testimony hath set to his seal that God is true.

For he whom God hath sent speaketh the words of God: for God giveth not the Spirit by measure [unto him].

The Father loveth the Son, and hath given all things into his hand.

e that believeth on the Son hath everlasting life: and he that believeth not the Son shall not see life; but the wrath of God abideth on him

He had power to answer prayer-forgive sins in fact he was the Image of the invisible God. Are you saying YOU are God? It seems this is where this is going that God is a family.

[tbpew]

Originally Posted by Maple Leaf

Not long ago I listened, horror stricken, to a man, immersed in the teachings of the modern Gnostics, say "I am not equal to God, but I am equal to Jesus."

That, I would submit, is the inevitable result of teaching indwelling versus incarnation.

The Son of God was, and is, incarnate Deity. I am a man indwelt by the Spirit of God.

Read the following post in the light of what I have just said, and then do a little Internet search on the use of the term "joint heir" among the disciples of Hagin and Copeland.

Wow, imagine using scriptural terms to discuss scripture....
what will those tricky gnostics think up next!

[OnTheFritz]

Originally Posted by tbpew

Steve, your question does not give me any clear terms to use to reply. “In the same way?” what does mean?

So I will offer this for others…
The spirit of God indwelled his only begotten Son by virtue of God making his abode with his Son. So in that regard, YES, God indwelled his only begotten Son “in the same way”.

But what your question doesn’t even consider is the dramatic differences between our ROAD to the earthly REALM and the manner by which the only begotten Son of God entered into this earthly stage.

I am from BELOW, the only begotten Son of God is from ABOVE.
I was born first of the earth, earthly. I was first born of the will of my earthly father.

He was born of the will of the Spirit. He was fathered (begat by) the Spirit of God when God’s word spoke the creative seed that fertilized the OVUM in his handmaiden Mary. AT THIS POINT, God’s WORD/SEED became flesh.

So, YES, God’s Spirit indwells me in the SAME MANNER as his spirit INDWELLS his only begotten Son, but the origins of the two lives in which God is tabernacled, are different.

Also, John 3:31-36 reveals that the God gave the Spirit to his only begotten Son NOT WITH MEASURE, but we, as children by adoption, have only the earnest of our promise while we remain in these earthly vessels.

John 3:31-36

He that cometh from above is above all: he that is of the earth is earthly, and speaketh of the earth: he that cometh from heaven is above all.

And what he hath seen and heard, that he testifieth; and no man receiveth his testimony.

He that hath received his testimony hath set to his seal that God is true.

For he whom God hath sent speaketh the words of God: for God giveth not the Spirit by measure [unto him].

The Father loveth the Son, and hath given all things into his hand.

e that believeth on the Son hath everlasting life: and he that believeth not the Son shall not see life; but the wrath of God abideth on him

I agree with this.

[tbpew]

Originally Posted by Steve Epley

He had power to answer prayer-forgive sins in fact he was the Image of the invisible God. Are you saying YOU are God? It seems this is where this is going that God is a family.

Steve,
your polemics are so familiar from previous dances we have had together, I'll let you jump around wherever you want but I'm heading out for lunch.

Jesus could not be touched because he had yet to ascend to his father and his God.

Jesus testified that his witness and the witness of the father statisfied the law requiring TWO witnesses.

Jesus testified that the words he spoke were not his own.

Jesus testified that the works done through him were done by his father.

Jesus testified that his father was greater than he.

[Esther]

Originally Posted by Steve Epley

He had power to answer prayer-forgive sins in fact he was the Image of the invisible God. Are you saying YOU are God? It seems this is where this is going that God is a family.

That was always my understanding. Such as it is.

[Praxeas]

Originally Posted by Esther

Didn't want to lose this discussion from another thread.

Posted by Mapleleaf

The Son was not a body in which God dwelt; the Son was God manifested in flesh, Emmanuel, God with us.


It is the difference between incarnation and indwelling.

In Christ, God did not indwell a man, God became a man.

The birth of Christ was a unique joining of absolute Deity with perfect humanity, and of this we say, great is the mystery of godliness."

Both. God himself was incarnate in humanity, taking on a human nature in addition to His Divine. The Divine nature is Spirit and the Spirit was also indwelling in the humanity if you will. His Divine person can never be separated from His Divine nature.