Unfair/Unrealistic/UnScriptural Expectations

[Neck]

Originally Posted by LadyRev

This thread is NOT what you think!

Its NOT about a pastors/preachers expectations of members or attendees.

This is about members/attendees expectations of pastors/preachers.

I'll start it off...

It is UNSCRIPTURAL for a pastor to be expected to put church members/attendees BEFORE his/her own family. (And I'm not talking about a kids basketball games vs. a member in the ER - Common sense here)

It is UNFAIR to expect a pastor/preacher to be available 24-7 even if they derive their income solely from the church/churches.

It is UNREALISTIC to expect a pastor/preacher to be perfect, never have a bad day, never make a mistake, etc.

NEXT!

If that is the case then some of these pastors need to work as hard as the saints.

See I work 60 hours a week in Telecommunication sales.

I support Healthcare organizations.

Their communications do not sleep nor take days off.

I might get a call on Thanksgiving day that their systems are down.

So do I hide from my cell phone? No!

And I am not in the business of my actions causing folks to lose their souls.

Pastors like many of the working saints in our demanding world.

Better give a good 40 hour week.

Then bring their A-game to the pulpit.

It is what our boss demands...

It is also what their boss demands....

My experience has always been most pastors give much of their time and heart....

[LadyRev]

Originally Posted by Neckstadt

If that is the case then some of these pastors need to work as hard as the saints.

See I work 60 hours a week in Telecommunication sales.

I support Healthcare organizations.

Their communications do not sleep nor take days off.

I might get a call on Thanksgiving day that their systems are down.

So do I hide from my cell phone? No!

And I am not in the business of my actions causing folks to lose their souls.

Pastors like many of the working saints in our demanding world.

Better give a good 40 hour week.

Then bring their A-game to the pulpit.

It is what our boss demands...

It is also what their boss demands....

My experience has always been most pastors give much of their time and heart....

According to scripture, a pastors first responsibility is to spouse and children. Same goes for other church leaders. Same goes for husbands and wives.

God comes first, family comes second, everything else - including ministry, comes next.

Do you put your job before your family?

Again, I'm talking about using common sense. There are exceptions, special needs, etc. on BOTH sides of the fence.

[GodsBabyGirl]

Originally Posted by LadyRev

According to scripture, a pastors first responsibility is to spouse and children. Same goes for other church leaders. Same goes for husbands and wives.

God comes first, family comes second, everything else - including ministry, comes next.

Do you put your job before your family?

Again, I'm talking about using common sense. There are exceptions, special needs, etc. on BOTH sides of the fence.

Exactly!

I just quit a job because it was taking away too much time from my kids.

We are not to put a job, a career, or a ministry before our families, and definitely not before God!

Priorities, priorities....

And if the pastor's house goes to hell in a hand basket, what do you think would come of the church he leads?????

I just alluded to this in another post about there being no revival.

We rely way too much on church leadership for our own walks with God. Way WAY too much!

We, I will personalize it, I need to take responsibility for our own souls, prayer lives, walk with Christ, etc.

Not the pastor, not the church, not the elder, not the leaders.....

[Michael Phelps]

Originally Posted by LadyRev

This thread is NOT what you think!

Its NOT about a pastors/preachers expectations of members or attendees.

This is about members/attendees expectations of pastors/preachers.

I'll start it off...

It is UNSCRIPTURAL for a pastor to be expected to put church members/attendees BEFORE his/her own family. (And I'm not talking about a kids basketball games vs. a member in the ER - Common sense here)

It is UNFAIR to expect a pastor/preacher to be available 24-7 even if they derive their income solely from the church/churches.

It is UNREALISTIC to expect a pastor/preacher to be perfect, never have a bad day, never make a mistake, etc.

NEXT!

The bolded statement is the only one that I'd take issue with.

I believe a pastor should be accessible 24-7, simply because families in crisis can't always schedule their problems during normal working hours, lol.

Now, I do agree that this privilege should never be abused by the congregation.

The pastor shouldn't be called at 3 am if a member wakes up with a stomachache, or a hangnail.

But, if there is a death, or a grave illness, I would expect that it's in the heart of most pastors to react immediately.

The good news is that those situations are usually few and far between.

[Esther]

I rarely ever call my pastor. I only used to call my former pastor because I was in leadership positions that required discussing.

But I don't call to report I won't be there, I only call IF I have a serious need or need to leave vital information.

Probably in the nearly 10 years I have been here I have called less than five times for a personal need.

[tbpew]

LadyRev,
I think these kind of discussions are helpful to bringing a certain light to the the issues of boundaries, roles, and realms.

Boundaries are real and purposeful in God's design of things.

If we could look at owner responsibility, individual diverse giftings, and the operation of a bondservant of Jesus in ministry, with a clear acknowledgement of where it should operate and when a boundary crossing is involved, peace and spiritual maturity would be served.

If we have inadvertantly (or even purposely) created a man-centric delivery system, then we are going to continually be frustrated by the tarpit caused by individuals thinking they have access/priviledge rights without acknowledgement of responsibility and boundaries.

Those who I serve are neither my master nor are they my sheep. Because I love the Good Shepherd who first loved me, I serve my Lord and saviour in serving his sheep.

In times past, some folks operating within roles as gifting servants among the saints, have expressed chronic fatigue for the constant examination of the roles and boundaries that should apply among the members of the body of Christ. My sense is that the misapplication of these roles and boundaries is the underlying cause that results in the setting of your thread start.

[Pressing-On]

Originally Posted by tbpew

LadyRev,
I think these kind of discussions are helpful to bringing a certain light to the the issues of boundaries, roles, and realms.

Boundaries are real and purposeful in God's design of things.

If we could look at owner responsibility, individual diverse giftings, and the operation of a bondservant of Jesus in ministry, with a clear acknowledgement of where it should operate and when a boundary crossing is involved, peace and spiritual maturity would be served.

If we have inadvertantly (or even purposely) created a man-centric delivery system, then we are going to continually be frustrated by the tarpit caused by individuals thinking they have access/priviledge rights without acknowledgement of responsibility and boundaries.

Those who I serve are neither my master nor are they my sheep. Because I love the Good Shepherd who first loved me, I serve my Lord and saviour in serving his sheep.

In times past, some folks operating within roles as gifting servants among the saints, have expressed chronic fatigue for the constant examination of the roles and boundaries that should apply among the members of the body of Christ. My sense is that the misapplication of these roles and boundaries is the underlying cause that results in the setting of your thread start.

Excellent points!!!

[HeavenlyOne]

Originally Posted by Michael Phelps

The bolded statement is the only one that I'd take issue with.

I believe a pastor should be accessible 24-7, simply because families in crisis can't always schedule their problems during normal working hours, lol.

Now, I do agree that this privilege should never be abused by the congregation.

The pastor shouldn't be called at 3 am if a member wakes up with a stomachache, or a hangnail.

But, if there is a death, or a grave illness, I would expect that it's in the heart of most pastors to react immediately.

The good news is that those situations are usually few and far between.

I think she was speaking of 'normal' circumstances.

There are people who think that if they are suffering from insomnia, the pastor should know about it.

[StillStanding]

Originally Posted by Michael Phelps

The bolded statement is the only one that I'd take issue with.

I believe a pastor should be accessible 24-7, simply because families in crisis can't always schedule their problems during normal working hours, lol.

Now, I do agree that this privilege should never be abused by the congregation.

The pastor shouldn't be called at 3 am if a member wakes up with a stomachache, or a hangnail.

But, if there is a death, or a grave illness, I would expect that it's in the heart of most pastors to react immediately.

The good news is that those situations are usually few and far between.

If a pastor doesn't make himself available 24/7 for crisis situations, he doesn't have the calling of a shepherd and should get a secular job somewhere.

I was raised in a pastor's home, and I realize that some folks will take advantage from time to time over trivial stuff.

But.....being a pastor is a calling, and that calling is 24/7!

[HeavenlyOne]

Originally Posted by Pianoman

If a pastor doesn't make himself available 24/7 for crisis situations, he doesn't have the calling of a shepherd and should get a secular job somewhere.

I was raised in a pastor's home, and I realize that some folks will take advantage from time to time over trivial stuff.

But.....being a pastor is a calling, and that calling is 24/7!

I think her point is that the crisis situations of others don't take precedence over the crisis situation of one's own family. She can speak for herself, but that's how I took it. Not that if the pastor is playing Monopoly with his kids then the saint who is in the ER with a heart attack can wait.

I'm sure your father had less than perfect saints who would call him for insane reasons all hours of the night (and even day), taking away from his family for something that could have waited until a more opportune time.

There was a woman who called the pastor at 2am to ask him to pray for her because she couldn't sleep. The pastor said he hoped God answered that prayer because if He didn't, then he wasn't getting any sleep either!