Daniel's 70th week

[Esaias]

Originally Posted by Evang.Benincasa

Anyway Jussie Smollet has all 16 FELONY counts dropped.
Our country where we currently live is reprobate. A piece of human garbage like Smollett is freed and we are all supposed to take it. Good gravy it’s done.

Yes, a lot of folks have seen that and are taking notes, and beginning to have somewhat of an "ah ha" moment. Especially as it comes out that Michael- er, I mean "Michelle" Obama is connected to this episode of Idiocracy.

[Ehud]

Originally Posted by Esaias

Which brings up an interesting point. If gentiles were somehow barred from salvation during and because of the Seventy Weeks, it means no gentile could become a proselyte during the Seventy Weeks. It also means gentiles COULD be "saved" prior to the Seventy Weeks. So God created a 490 year parenthesis in the middle of world history during which He refused salvation to gentiles? Doesn't make any sense at all.

That's a very good point. It's often times a reflex to assume 'saved' means the Acts 2:38 variety, but depending on the time frame, it may very well not mean that at all. As you said, backing up 490 years and not even having a single new proselyte doesn't make much sense.

[Ehud]

Originally Posted by Evang.Benincasa

Exactly, and simple to the point. What on earth was the purpose was the vision of Peter to go to a Noahide. If uncircumcised Romans were already speaking in tongues in Acts 2?

[Esaias]

Originally Posted by Ehud

That's a very good point. It's often times a reflex to assume 'saved' means the Acts 2:38 variety, but depending on the time frame, it may very well not mean that at all. As you said, backing up 490 years and not even having a single new proselyte doesn't make much sense.

Exactly. And, the fact there WERE proselytes in Acts 2 proves that gentiles could become proselytes prior to the end of the Seventy Weeks, unless one wanted to argue all those proselytes became Jews less than 50 days prior to Pentecost.

[Esaias]

Getting back to the Seventy Weeks:

We need to determine when they start. Then, we will clearly see when the seventieth week began and ended, and may compare events of that seven year period to see if they match the prophecy.

Most people begin with an assumed date of the Lord's death, or birth, then work backwards to find the start of the 70 Weeks. Also, various dates have been proposed for the start point. From what I have been able to determine, the most likely starting point would have to be the decree of Artaxerxes in 458 BC. Ezra ch 7 says this was in the seventh year of Artaxerxes' reign, which was 458 BC.

That would put the end of the 490 years of 70 Weeks in 33 AD.

So, was Jesus crucified in 33 AD?

According to the Bible, He began His ministry at 30 years of age, which would make His birth in late 2 BC. There is no year 0, you go from 1 BC to the next year of 1 AD, if He was born in the fall of 2 BC thirty years later would be the fall of 29 BC. 3.5 years of ministry till His death would put His death in the spring of 33 AD.

If Jesus was in fact born in 2 BC, then His ministry and death fit perfectly with the timing of the Seventieth Week.

Jesus was, in fact, born in 2 BC: According to Josephus, Herod died right before an eclipse. There was a 30 day mourning period, followed by some negotiations with roudy Jews, culminating in the infamous Passover massacre. The only year for this to fit is 1 BC, with a Jan 9th eclipse. Other proposed years have an eclipse at the wrong time of year to allow for the month long mourning period followed by the negotiations of Archelaus with the Jews culminating in the Passover massacre.

Also, Herod was 70 when he died. He was 25 years old when he began his governorship of Galilee in 47 BC. He was therefore 70 years old from 2 BC until early 1 BC when he died.

Also, Luke says Cyrenius was governor of Syria when Jesus was born. Cyrenius (Quirinius) was made lieutenant governor of Syria in 2 BC and was responsible for registration and taxation of all subjects of Rome in the mid east area in celebration of the 25th anniversary of Augustus Caesar being declared Father of the Country. Thus, subjects this year would have to go their birth town, register for the census, etc, which is what was happening when Jesus was born (the reason His family was in Bethlehem).

All this indicates fall of 2 BC as really the only year He could have been born.

Now, it says in the middle of the (final) week He would cause sacrifice and oblation to cease. We know this cessation would be in the eyes of God, and irrespective of man's actions, because sacrifices continued until 70 AD or so, but nobody makes 70 AD the middle of the 70th Week.

Instead, the middle of the 70th Week is clearly in 29 AD, when Jesus happened to be 30 years old and began His mission by being baptized by John the Baptist. This fulfilled a type foreshadowed by the Day of Atonement and is good reason to suspect He was actually baptized on the Day of Atonement.

On Atonement, a goat was presented "for the Lord" who would be offered as a sin offering symbolizing the covering up of sin. A second goat was presented "for Azazel" and was led by a "fit man" into the wilderness, symbolizing the putting away of sin. Jesus, at His baptism, was presented to God and accepted, and was led by the Spirit into the wilderness to be tempted by the devil (Azazel). At this point, as far as God was concerned, the Atonement sacrifice had been presented and would be offered (His whole ministry was an offering). Sacrifices under the Old Covenant would then be irrelevent because HE was the one that mattered now. Thus, sacrifices would be ceased as efficacious because Messiah was now on the scene.

The atonement offering had to die, which is what happened when Christ was baptized. Baptism is a type of death and burial (and resurrection), and His "legal" death for the purposes of Atonement occurred in His baptism. (His later death on Passover had to do with His role as Paschal Lamb, whereas His symbolic death on Atonement at His baptism had to do with His role as Atonement offering.)

All this indicates that Jesus was baptized in the midst of the Seventieth Week, ending sacrifices for sin, and died during the last year of it.

[Esaias]

Interesting point:

Jesus told Peter to forgive 490 times. Then gave a parable to illustrate what He meant. The forgiveness of debt in the parable was an EXTENSION OF TIME until reckoning could be done. At the reckoning, debt would either be paid or canceled, depending on whether the debtor also forgave debts.

This implies the 490 years of the Seventy Sevens was an extension of time until the debt of sin could be dealt with, paid off by Messiah, and forgiven to those willing to participate in God's debt cancelation program. Which in turn is another indicator the Seventy Weeks ENDED with Christ's death (and resurrection). Once Christ died, the debt was paid and pardoned. Those who rejected it were then destined for destruction (culminating in AD 70, delivered to the "tormentors" to exact what they owed).

God divorced the House of Israel, but not Judah. Instead, God made provision to pardon their (Judah's) sins, but Judah waxed evil and was unrighteous and unmerciful, so the reckoning came and Judah and Jerusalem was turned over to the collection agency of Rome.

[Esaias]

Originally Posted by Esaias

Interesting point:

Jesus told Peter to forgive 490 times. Then gave a parable to illustrate what He meant. The forgiveness of debt in the parable was an EXTENSION OF TIME until reckoning could be done. At the reckoning, debt would either be paid or canceled, depending on whether the debtor also forgave debts.

This implies the 490 years of the Seventy Sevens was an extension of time until the debt of sin could be dealt with, paid off by Messiah, and forgiven to those willing to participate in God's debt cancelation program. Which in turn is another indicator the Seventy Weeks ENDED with Christ's death (and resurrection). Once Christ died, the debt was paid and pardoned. Those who rejected it were then destined for destruction (culminating in AD 70, delivered to the "tormentors" to exact what they owed).

God divorced the House of Israel, but not Judah. Instead, God made provision to pardon their (Judah's) sins, but Judah waxed evil and was unrighteous and unmerciful, so the reckoning came and Judah and Jerusalem was turned over to the collection agency of Rome.

And this shed's light on what the actual purpose of the 70 Weeks was. It wasn't a determined time period meant to exclude gentiles from salvation. (Again, IF gentiles were barred from salvation, such a barring didn't really have to with the Seventy Weeks, but rather had to do with the nature and rules of Covenanting with God.) Dispensationalism proposes that the Seventy Weeks are a divine time period where God is dealing exclusively with Jews. They say the last Week (or the last half of it) has been separated from the others, put on hold. This, they say, allows for God to deal with gentiles, thus the "dispensation of grace for gentiles". They say the last Week (or last half) will resume, God will once again be concerned with Jews, the gentile grace period will be ended, etc. All of this bad eschatology and bad theology is due to a fundamental lack of understanding the purpose of the 70 Weeks.

If Jesus' use of "seventy times seven" in His discourse on forgiveness is no accident or mere coincidence, then there is a connection to the "seventy sevens" of Daniel's prophecy. Since He then immediately said "THEREFORE, the Kingdom is like..." and proceeded to give the parable of the bad debtor (Matt 18:23-35), it follows that the parable is an explanation not merely of the condition of pardon, but contains an explanation of the 70 Weeks "seventy sevens" of Daniel.

It was a probationary period determined upon Judah and Jerusalem, during which God would "forgive" their sins. That is, He would not utterly divorce them and scatter them as He had previously done to the other tribes of the House of Israel by the hand of the Assyrians. However, they did not use the grace given them to extend grace to others, but descended into violence and extortion under the scribes, Pharisees, Sadducees, etc. Eventually they killed Messiah, grace and pardon incarnate. So the probation was revoked at the crucifixion of Christ, and they were delivered to the tormentors (Rome) which was finished in AD 70 with the destruction of Jerusalem and end of Judea as a national Israelitish entity.

[Esaias]

But this raises the question of the relation between AD 70 and the 70 Weeks. Why a 40 year or so delay between the end of the Seventy Weeks and the final destruction of the city and of Judea as an Israelite political entity?

If Jesus was crucified in 33 AD (I believe He was, see previous posts) then there was actually 37 years between His death and the destruction of the Temple. His death was on Passover of 33, and the destruction of Jerusalem was finished in the fall of 70. So it was 37 and a half years, or in the 38th year after the cross.

Apparently, the wilderness wanderings in Sinai actually took 38 years.

That being the case, it seems the 38 years appended to the end of the Seventy Weeks have some connection to the 38 years added to Israel's time since the Exodus. They weren't supposed to be in the wilderness that long at all, but it was a punishment added to them because of their unbelief.

I am willing to bet there is a connection here to a Divine adjustment of the Jubilee cycles, to bring Israel's jubilee years into alignment with the genuine intended jubilee years as counted from Creation.

[Evang.Benincasa]

Originally Posted by Esaias

Exactly. And, the fact there WERE proselytes in Acts 2 proves that gentiles could become proselytes prior to the end of the Seventy Weeks, unless one wanted to argue all those proselytes became Jews less than 50 days prior to Pentecost.

Proselytes are no longer Gentiles, they are converts to Israelism. They are circumcised like father Abraham who was also circumcised to come into the covenant. But need to understand what Cornelius is all about. If Noahides were already in the church with Peter prior to Peter visiting Cornelius. Why the vision? Why the angel visiting Cornelius to inform him to send for Peter? Maybe I'm not understanding what is being discussed here as far as circumcised converts and uncircumcised Noahides?

[Evang.Benincasa]

Originally Posted by Esaias

But this raises the question of the relation between AD 70 and the 70 Weeks. Why a 40 year or so delay between the end of the Seventy Weeks and the final destruction of the city and of Judea as an Israelite political entity?

If Jesus was crucified in 33 AD (I believe He was, see previous posts) then there was actually 37 years between His death and the destruction of the Temple. His death was on Passover of 33, and the destruction of Jerusalem was finished in the fall of 70. So it was 37 and a half years, or in the 38th year after the cross.

Apparently, the wilderness wanderings in Sinai actually took 38 years.

That being the case, it seems the 38 years appended to the end of the Seventy Weeks have some connection to the 38 years added to Israel's time since the Exodus. They weren't supposed to be in the wilderness that long at all, but it was a punishment added to them because of their unbelief.

I am willing to bet there is a connection here to a Divine adjustment of the Jubilee cycles, to bring Israel's jubilee years into alignment with the genuine intended jubilee years as counted from Creation.

This is interesting.