Psychotropic Drugs in Religious Rituals

[Evang.Benincasa]

Originally Posted by Aquila

I already explained that.

Oh, feigning suicide, is explainable?

[Aquila]

Originally Posted by Evang.Benincasa

No, have you?

You know they tried to get me to get prescription meds for my PTSD.

No, Chris, it was a mixture of used for irritable stomach. What we do down here is take Braggs Apple Cider Vinegar mixed with water to aid in hydration. Also in the Middle East the ancients used fermented milks and vegetables to aid in digestion. All Judeans and Israelis practiced moderation, in foods, and in wine. Also ancient fermented wine is about 10 proof, far from the super wines we have today. Also the poor had a wine called vinegar which was heavily watered down, and was about 5 proof 2.5 % A B V. Hence the reason they drank MIXED WINE Proverbs 23:30. They did it to get hammered.

Godly men didn't get hammered. But there were plenty of drunkards. I'm sure that if you did a deep study on it, you'll discover that they had wines just as strong as any of ours. They had "strong drink" too, which was much like our liquors. The lighter wines you're talking about were used for daily drinking because it was safer than the water.

You also mentioned aspirin, so? Here is where you start posting to your opponent like they are morons. Do you have any friends outside this forum? 'm serious as a heart attack, you need to find a group of people who believe in Jesus Christ, the power of Jesus name, baptism in Jesus name, the infilling of the Holy Ghost to the miraculous power! Get help.

No. I have absolutely no friends outside of this forum. Not a single one. lol

And none of them are Apostolic, they're all heathen pagans, drinking green tea to the triune god. lol

Yeah, like back in the 1960s Camel cigarettes claimed more doctors smoked their brand. Cocaine was supposed to help you with asthma, menstrual cramps, baldness, seizures. Opium juice a panacea for its treatment of headaches, nausea, depression, diarrhea, gout. Even Benjamin Franklin used it, and loved it. Quaker’s Black Drop, an opium-based lozenge, and Dr. Barton’s “brown mixture,” which combined opium with licorice. What about Morphine! After the Civil War vets were returning with PTSD, they weren't sent to the little church down the lane. They were given morphine to calm shell shock. Look, we've been suffering as a people for hundreds of years, not from just illness, but for the stupidity of "Some studies indicate!!!"

You're comparing the heyday of false advertising, non-existent studies, and outright lies to modern, peer reviewed, studies throughout the international community? LOL

If a bullfrog had wings he wouldn't bump his rear end every time he hopped.

LOL! Awesome quote. Love it.

The Holy Ghost works, dope doesn't.

Cannabis only treats symptoms. God heals as He desires in any manner He chooses, if He chooses at all. I think it is presumptuous to assume that God is like a cosmic Santa Claus who will always give us everything on our Christmas list. God didn't deliver Paul from his thorn in the flesh. And obviously, God hadn't healed Timothy of his stomach problems. The painful truth is... God doesn't always heal.

We have the history of potheads and Holy Ghost filled saints. Sorry, but smoking a shake bag doesn't get you to a brighter day

Well, maybe you've not experienced the dark days of PTSD. And, I'm thankful that you haven't. It's hell on earth sometimes.

When was the last time you smoke weed?

It's been a while.

Chris, heroin was once given to children for seizures, pot effects the brain adversely. Burn out ring a bell? Mr Expert? Your quote was hypothetical? So, what does that mean? You actually didn't believe your hypothesis would work? Chris, your quote is what you believed, what you believe would happen if people smoked pot. That was your hypothetical for a hypothetical dad who needed a to stop blowing up with his family. A dad who didn't have a good relationship with people around him. He smokes a bag, and he is walking in victory and newness of life. Hypothetical, made up story, a hallucination, something you dreamed, whatever, you posted that people smoking grass will be converted to newness of life.

Nope. Cannabis doesn't offer the newness of life that Jesus does. Never has, never will. But, for some, it can help with various symptoms they find themselves having to live with. Like any medication, it helps, but it isn't the answer to everything.

Chris, own it, stop already.

I can't own what you're saying because you're distorting my points.

Aquila, you became a member when you were an Apostolic. You got your divorce while you were a member. You were here during the IHATEAPOSTOLIC days when everyone loved to discuss how the Ultra conservative Apostolics were cults. You were here when the Apostolics mostly left to other forums which didn't have the "I hate pastors, I hate standards, I hate tithing to a pastor, I hate having anyone tell me anything" crew. But I guess that is what always strikes me odd about religious people, they are nuts. They leave Islam, but want to hang out with Muslims, and complain about Islam. Problem is, that the devout Muslims don't allow it. Catholics also don't play, Eastern Orthodox don't have time, Hindus, really don't dig hearing the opinion of those who leave Hinduism. But seriously, if I wasn't Apostolic Pentecostal, I would NEVER post here EVER!!!!!

I'm Apostolic. I still believe in Oneness, Acts 2:38, speaking in tongues, and the rest of it. I just don't buy into the legalisms.

You were the kid smoking oregano. Dude did you even hang out with smokers? Did you listen to the Dead and go to the concerts, ever been to a Dead concert? Bro, did you know any crispy dudes and dudettes?

Actually, no, I didn't. lol

I didn't even touch a drop of alcohol until I was 30. No, I never listened to "the Dead" or go to the concerts. And no, I've never known any "crisp dudes or dudettes". I know vets, paramedics, doctors, police officers, and men currently in the military, some of which smoke cannabis to ease anxiety, stress, and symptoms of PTSD. I've been to Amsterdam and California (San Francisco), and I've mingled with some of the natural healing crowd who are a part of the budding (pun intended) cannabis industry.

No my man, you are advocating that.
No doubt in my mind.

Well, you're wrong.

When was the last time you smoked a joint? When was the last time you ingested cannabis?

Like I said, it's been a while. It's illegal in Ohio without being registered for medical, so my experience with it has been mainly while abroad.

But why? Why would you go as far to paint dope as a life changing conversion? Pretty telling how you framed your hypothetical? Or else you believe we are the blind, and you are the one eyed king?

Why would you keep insisting that I paint "dope" as a "life changing conversion" when I haven't? I'm only speaking in the context of its medicinal value.

Bro, you are back peddling, I have been reading your stuff since you were in a conservative Apostolic church. Blowing out of proportion? You would like everyone to believe that. Yet, you are a skater, shapshifter, you want to smoke dope to get your inner demons under control. Well, that's all on you. Hard trying to get someone who was once in Holy Ghost services to believe that could ever help them again. Didn't you say you went to an Apostolic Church and your PTSD started acting up? Hey, don't answer that, this conversation is going nowhere.

My PTSD acted up because of the bang-clang music and the screaming. I've enjoyed quite a few Apostolic Bible studies since then. I also don't like any crowded places. I was at a county fair and the loud speakers near the hogs sent me into cold sweats when someone shouted like they were surprised at something. Loud noises, sudden loud noises, dropped drinking glasses, car horns, screaming, shouting, being startled, those things are triggers.

What a shame.

The only shame is the mischaracterizations and distortions you're making to malign my character and reframe my statements and intentions.

[Aquila]

Originally Posted by Evang.Benincasa

Oh, feigning suicide, is explainable?

This is an example of your dishonesty. Here's what I said, and I quote:

Originally Posted by Aquila

Sure thing bro. If Jesus doesn't heal me, and I shoot myself to end this, will you take care of my kids? I'd appreciate that.

In English, words have meanings. I never said, "I'm going to kill myself.", nor did I say, "I'm going to commit suicide."

Pay close attention, so that you don't misunderstand...

The question is intended to make you realize that you have no skin in the game. It asks, if anyone listens to you, and God doesn't behave like a dime-store candy machine by spitting out an instant healing (as you insist that He will), will you be there to pick up the broken pieces? If they off themselves, can you look into the eyes of that person's kids and say, "Yes, little Johnny, I told your dad to quit taking his meds and get the Holy Ghost."???

Of course you couldn't.

You'd run from them like a little girl. And if cornered, you'd blame their mom or dad's lack of devotion. You'd argue like some cowardly televangelist, who isn't worth the money spent on his suit, that if their mom or dad "only had faith" they wouldn't be dead and would have been healed. You wouldn't own up to an ounce of your responsibility in such a circumstance. Your advice could be very dangerous if heeded and God doesn't come running to heal on command like the cosmic Satan Claus you insist that He is.

Those of us who have prayed for healing, and it has so far been delayed, we know your type all too well.

[Evang.Benincasa]

Originally Posted by Aquila

This is an example of your dishonesty. Here's what I said, and I quote:

You mean this.... which I already enlarged with bolded font, and red letters?

Originally Posted by Aquila

Sure thing bro. If Jesus doesn't heal me, and I shoot myself to end this, will you take care of my kids? I'd appreciate that.

Originally Posted by Aquila

The question is intended to make you realize that you have no skin in the game.

By posting that you will kill yourself? Was it also for Amanah? Do you want her to realize? Was it also for houston? There is your three witnesses.

Originally Posted by Aquila

If anyone listens to you, and God doesn't behave like a dime candy machine and spit out an instant healing like you insist that He will, will you be there to pick up the broken pieces? Of course not. You'll just laugh it off and blame their lack of faith. The point is... your advice could be very dangerous if heeded and God doesn't come running to heal on command.

If anyone listens to you, they get the same old religious double standard. Jesus will make all your dreams come true, that's if you got a good roll on the dice. PTSD is so prevalent in our culture right now with psychiatrists, psychologists, you would think the entire nation has it. Listen Chris, Pysch majors walk out of class thinking they have it. You don't believe Jesus can heal, deliver, set free those who are bound, then listen, I don't believe you.

You never got the Holy Ghost, you never got the power that delivers to the uttermost. Weed is your salvation, weed is going to hypothetically deliver mommy and daddy to love each other and do right? That is a lie, and Sonny Jim, you are peddling it. You want to smoke a bag? Then you go and get yourself free, but don't try to tell me that Jesus is in smoking dubes.

[Amanah]

Originally Posted by Aquila

I want to thank you for being concerned for my welfare, and for inquiring about my motives without accusation. The kindness, concern, and gentleness of your spirit is beautifully refreshing.

I pray that I have adequately explained my understanding, my motives, and my intentions so as to leave no doubt that I'm not advocating the abuse of any substance or drunkenness.

I can only hope that you can see how my detractors have distorted what I'm saying and maligned my character time and time again, causing me to strive to clarify myself, time and time again.

Thank you for your kindness, your time, and your consideration.

May God richly bless you and yours.

I do care and am praying for you. I see you as being talented with amazing potential.

It has been a hard journey and so many things have happened in your life that seem like obstacles that you don't know how to overcome, but God never gives up on us and you can find a way if you look to Jesus, the author and finisher of our faith.

[Evang.Benincasa]

Originally Posted by Aquila

You know they tried to get me to get prescription meds for my PTSD.

Pastor Huss Shearer tried to get you on medications? I know he didn't, but your story gets into hyper drive after you were in Pentecost. Back when you first became a member and you were married you never brought up having episodes. How'd you get through it when you were with Brother Shearer? Actually how long were you an Apostolic?

Originally Posted by Aquila

Godly men didn't get hammered. But there were plenty of drunkards. I'm sure that if you did a deep study on it, you'll discover that they had wines just as strong as any of ours. They had "strong drink" too, which was much like our liquors. The lighter wines you're talking about were used for daily drinking because it was safer than the water.

Excuse me? a deep study of it? Go home with that baloney. It is the Bible,. not nuclear physics. I'll discover, that you have no life, and need to get yourself together, Hopefully with Jesus as front and center.

Originally Posted by Aquila

No. I have absolutely no friends outside of this forum. Not a single one. lol

No you have acquaintances, because if you had something called checks and balances. They would help you, which it seems they are not.

Originally Posted by Aquila

And none of them are Apostolic, they're all heathen pagans, drinking green tea to the triune god. lol

Oh, those were the so called godly men who believed you should smoke dubes? Those Apostolics? Chris, your friends are Apostolic, but you can't go to their church? Chris do you lie?

Originally Posted by Aquila

You're comparing the heyday of false advertising, non-existent studies, and outright lies to modern, peer reviewed, studies throughout the international community? LOL

No, it is being able to sell something that does something to make money.

You see, they don't care if you suffer from PTSD, they just want your money. You are just the convenient dupe who propergates their propergand. Edward Bernays would be proud.

Originally Posted by Aquila

LOL! Awesome quote. Love it.

Of course you do, because you are naked in ashes. Chris, you are confused, you need to get it together. A forum is the worse place in the world to substitute for fellowship and church.

Originally Posted by Aquila

Cannabis only treats symptoms.

Oh, its garbage, that just puts the bullet on the bullet wound. Good job, Chris. The more you post the more I'm convinced.

Originally Posted by Aquila

God heals as He desires in any manner He chooses, if He chooses at all.

So, if weed does what your hypothetical proclaimed then we stick God in there somewhere and we feel good. Chris you are wrong, but you don't care about being wrong.

Originally Posted by Aquila

I think it is presumptuous to assume that God is like a cosmic Santa Claus

That's what you believe, don't walk that by me. That's your burden. You never got anything out of your walk. Why? Because you blow it all on God. God doesn't this, God doesn't that, God doesn't do this for me, God doesn't do that for me. Seriously? So it is God's fault, bro, anyone around here believe in a Cosmic Santa it is YOU.

I have read enough of your posts to see that in full living crystal.

Originally Posted by Aquila

who will always give us everything on our Christmas list. God didn't deliver Paul from his thorn in the flesh.

Paul's thorn wasn't illness or PTSD, it was a minister messing with the saints of Corinth. Chris, go find a church. Not the barefoot hippy stuck in the 80s Casting Crowns Sensitivity Groups.

[Evang.Benincasa]

Originally Posted by Aquila

And obviously, God hadn't healed Timothy of his stomach problems. The painful truth is... God doesn't always heal.

Indigestion? You make out like the guy had stomach cancer, give you an Oscar. Here go get Lady GaGa Applause let it play for an hour. Sweet love of God, you need Jesus.

Originally Posted by Aquila

Well, maybe you've not experienced the dark days of PTSD. And, I'm thankful that you haven't. It's hell on earth sometimes.

Cosmic Santa. You see Chris has his condition worse than any other person.
Chris' problems eclipse anyone else. Chris, I'm a solution guy, and I hate talking about problems which never have solutions. Now, i understand terminal cancer, severed limbs, spinal cord injuries, I understand. Just lost a close family member. But, Chris, the people I've een suffer in my life didn't talk like you, Some weren't Apostolic, some were. They didn't talk about dead ends, walls, no break through. Your issue you wave like a flag, I keep hearing NPR when you post. The people I've been with wanted to live as much as you, but they never talked to invite darkness, and despair. Bro, sometimes an crummy attitude about who you are personally does more damage then the so called illness.

Originally Posted by Aquila

It's been a while.

How long is awhile?

Originally Posted by Aquila

Nope. Cannabis doesn't offer the newness of life that Jesus does. Never has, never will. But, for some, it can help with various symptoms they find themselves having to live with. Like any medication, it helps, but it isn't the answer to everything.

Chris, you go back and read your hypothetical I reposted for you. Go back and read it. You got pot look like it can deliver from PTSD, heal hemorrhoids, and help you catch the 5 o clock bus.

Originally Posted by Aquila

I can't own what you're saying because you're distorting my points.

That's not true, you refuse to own your own behavior.

Originally Posted by Aquila

I'm Apostolic. I still believe in Oneness, Acts 2:38, speaking in tongues, and the rest of it. I just don't buy into the legalisms.

Get out of here, bro, you have to believe in legalism. If you are in a religion!!!

You can't have any sort of religion that has a do or not do without legalism.

No wonder people can't stand to hear religious people discuss what they believe.

Originally Posted by Aquila

Actually, no, I didn't. lol

I didn't even touch a drop of alcohol until I was 30. No, I never listened to "the Dead" or go to the concerts. And no, I've never known any "crisp dudes or dudettes". I know vets, paramedics, doctors, police officers, and men currently in the military, some of which smoke cannabis to ease anxiety, stress, and symptoms of PTSD. I've been to Amsterdam and California (San Francisco), and I've mingled with some of the natural healing crowd who are a part of the budding (pun intended) cannabis industry.

OK, good bye. You know nothing.

Originally Posted by Aquila

Well, you're wrong.

No, you are trying to push this idea of weed will free the mind.

Originally Posted by Aquila

Like I said, it's been a while. It's illegal in Ohio without being registered for medical, so my experience with it has been mainly while abroad.

What is awhile?

Originally Posted by Aquila

Why would you keep insisting that I paint "dope" as a "life changing conversion" when I haven't? I'm only speaking in the context of its medicinal value.

I'll use a quote from you, Because English means things, your hypothetical spoke volumes. If it wasn't so long I would post it in my signature. So you would have to see it every time I post. Maybe that would wake up an honest bone in your body.

Originally Posted by Aquila

My PTSD acted up because of the bang-clang music and the screaming. I've enjoyed quite a few Apostolic Bible studies since then. I also don't like any crowded places. I was at a county fair and the loud speakers near the hogs sent me into cold sweats when someone shouted like they were surprised at something. Loud noises, sudden loud noises, dropped drinking glasses, car horns, screaming, shouting, being startled, those things are triggers.

When did you get this PTSD?

Originally Posted by Aquila

The only shame is the mischaracterizations and distortions you're making to malign my character and reframe my statements and intentions.

Yes, you are the poor wee lamb, bro, what you post is as clear as a spring day. Problem is, you don't do well in these types of discussions. Because you end up zinging and zagging ( no pun intended) .

It's like you don't think enough about your postings. Let me tell you, if you start smoking fatties you are really not going to fare well in a forum.

[Evang.Benincasa]

Originally Posted by Aquila

Now, imagine smoking legally prescribed cannabis and while a high is produced that lasts four or so hours, for the next 4 days, you feel sound and balanced. No nervous shaking, cold sweats, anxiety attacks, violent impulses, nightmares, racing thoughts, intrusive memories, or thoughts of suicide. In fact, compared to how your mind felt prior to smoking, you feel clear as a bell. Calm as rock. For four days. On day five, you detect an instance of racing thoughts, but it fades quickly. Day 6, the racing thoughts begin to come back, subtle anxiety is setting in again. Your mind feels clouded as it did prior to smoking. Nightmares might return at this time. And so, you now know your threshold... four days. So you smoke a little cannabis every four days before bed... for six months... and during that period... everyone who knows you wants to know what happened because now your actually talking to them and interacting normally. Your kids say, "Mom and dad don't fight like they used to.", "I'm not afraid of dad anymore.", "Dad doesn't scream and break things like before.", and your performance at work increases. Your love life returns to normal... it's like you get your entire life back.

Now imagine if the same guy got the Holy Ghost.

Just as hypothetical, right?

It all depends on which would you choose.

[houston]

A 4 hour high that heals you for 4 days? LOL LOL
That’s not a thing.

[n david]

Originally Posted by houston

A 4 hour high that heals you for 4 days? LOL LOL
That’s not a thing.

The number 4 is very significant. It's no accident a 4 hour high can heal you 4 days.

There are 4 seasons. 4 main elements. 4 directions. 4 divisions of the day. On the 4th day, God created the Sun, Moon and Stars.

There are 4 Gospels in the Bible. There are 4 beasts around the Throne. The priest's ephod stones were in 4 rows. There are 12 minor prophets (divisible by the number 4). There are 4 epistles in the NT which have a first and second book. Genesis begins with 4 words, "In the beginning, God...."

In Song of Solomon 6:13 it says "return" 4 times: "Return, return, O Shulamite; return, return," (Only word repeated 4 times in a single verse in the Bible)