Should we teach others to rebel against standards?

[1ofthechosen]

Originally Posted by Aquila

think it was 1999. An evangelist came through one weekend and preached a pretty good sermon. But he got off track and started elaborating on how Johnson & Johnson's was owned by Satanists.The pastor got worked up and commanded that everyone had to get any products from the company out of their homes. About a week passed and the pastor lifted the ban because the evangelist's statements were verified as coming from an internet hoax that wasn't based on any factual information at all. Lol

That's extreme. That's unethical also. But I'm calling foul on that. Come on man!!! That didn't happen, you made that up.

[n david]

Originally Posted by Aquila

Funny story here. I think it was 1999. An evangelist came through one weekend and preached a pretty good sermon. But he got off track and started elaborating on how Johnson & Johnson's was owned by Satanists. The pastor got worked up and commanded that everyone had to get any products from the company out of their homes. About a week passed and the pastor lifted the ban because the evangelist's statements were verified as coming from an internet hoax that wasn't based on any factual information at all. Lol

Seriously, the BEST stories...

[houston]

Originally Posted by n david

Seriously, the BEST stories...

Hear about the woman who ran away wih a trucker because she wanted to live out something from a harlequin novel?

[Aquila]

Originally Posted by 1ofthechosen

That's extreme. That's unethical also. But I'm calling foul on that. Come on man!!! That didn't happen, you made that up.

Nope. It happened. I'm as serious as a heart attack. The young evangelist was named Harry Minor. And I believe it was 1999 (?). Many were new to the internet back then. Today, we laugh these things off. If you remember, back in the day, people would take those internet hoaxes seriously. I've heard several preachers include those hoaxes, especially about the New World Order, the Clintons, etc. lol

Well, today we do have fake news. And entire elections are effected by it.

It's all the same.

[Esaias]

Originally Posted by Aquila

Nope. It happened. The young evangelist was named Harry Minor. And I believe it was 1999. Many were new to the internet back then. Today, we laugh these things off. If you remember, back in the day, people would take those internet hoaxes seriously.

Well, today we do have fake news. And entire elections are effected by it.

It's all the same.

Pastor Harry Minor in Dayton? You sure about that?

[Aquila]

Originally Posted by Esaias

Pastor Harry Minor in Dayton? You sure about that?

I don't know if he's a pastor now or not. lol

If you know him, don't be hard on the guy. He was a young evangelist and you remember how email rumors were when they first started. lol

But my point was, not every well intended pastoral edict is based on reality. It's best for pastors to remain grounded in the book. It never changes.

[Aquila]

Originally Posted by n david

Seriously, the BEST stories...

Oh, I got some doozies. lol And yes, most people would never believe them unless they were there, or until someone they know could testify that they saw it too. lol

There was one night Jerome Bourne (I believe it was Jerome Bourne, it's been years, forgive me if I'm mistaken) was preaching about faith and testifying to dozens of miracles he's seen and that have happened to him. People were getting all hyped up and hanging from the chandeliers! One brother, who now lives in Colorado, took off running and lunged into the baptistery... WHILE JEROME WAS PREACHING! LOL So, imagine it. You're getting down, worshipping, watching the preacher, the music is going just right, people are shouting, some are crying, everyone's standing, many are dancing, the preacher's voice is booming through the mic about miracles... and SPLASH! Out of nowhere someone leaps into the baptistery completely dressed and is thrashing around dancing in the water in a storm of tongues! LOL Jerome kept preaching, he didn't miss a beat, and looked over his shoulder like, "What in tarnation???" LOL The ushers helped the brother calm down and get out of the baptistery and helped him dry off in the changing rooms.

After church, this brother explained that he had never felt his faith so strong and he thought that if he got up there and danced on the water behind the preacher all the visitors would believe in the power of God and get saved! LOL Bless his heart. His heart was in the right place. But zeal overcame wisdom at that moment. lol

[Aquila]

Originally Posted by Esaias

Pastor Harry Minor in Dayton? You sure about that?

One of my favorite "blunders" that I remember from Harry Minor was when he'd get all fired up and we'd be singing that song....

Faith, faith, faith, just a little bit of faith
Faith, faith, faith, just a little bit of faith
You don't need a whole lot
Just use what you got
Faith, faith, faith, just a little bit of faith.

Well, Harry would switch it up. He'd often exchange the word faith with words like "fire", "anointing", "power", etc. Well, one day he was singing and it was getting really powerful and all of the sudden he starts singing...

Truth, truth, truth, just a little bit of truth

We on the platform behind him all looked at each other like, "What??? Just a little bit of truth???" LOL

But here's the funniest part, IT WORKED! The congregation ate it up and exploded into worship. LOL

Harry's a great guy. And those early years were fun. lol

I'm sure that if he's a pastor now, he's grown quite a bit from those early days. From what I remember about him, he's a good man. Truly a good man.

[Amanah]

[Aquila]

Please don't get me wrong. I believe in pastoral authority. If a pastor tells me that he doesn't permit short sleeve shirts, and I ask why, and he explains that we brothers have to carry some of the modesty standards because we can't expect the women to bear all the standards, I'm in full compliance. The Bible has plenty to say about modesty. Even though the Bible doesn't specifically prohibit makeup, if a pastor says no makeup, I believe in having my family in compliance. Why? Because though Scripture may not specifically forbid makeup, every reference to makeup accept one is negative. So, I give it to that pastor to take the stand. Wedding bands, even though I believe in them, if a pastor has a standard against them, I believe in concurring, because Scripture does mention not wearing gold, pearls, or costly array.

But beards? There isn't a single shred of Scripture for a beard prohibition. A pastor might as well ban pickup trucks and apple pie. lol It's an unbiblical edict.

In the military we had what is called a "lawful" order. An "unlawful" order was an order that violated UCMJ or the direct lawful order of a superior. You were not bound to obey unlawful orders. And if an order was found to be unlawful, any charges of insubordination against you were dropped.

That's how I see this. If there isn't Scripture to back up a pastoral standard... it is an unlawful order. It would be no different from a pastor commanding you to let him sleep with your wife. There are boundaries. And Scripture helps to establish those boundaries. And there isn't a shred of Scripture for a pastor making men with beards second class citizens in the kingdom. Nor is there any Scripture that supports labeling men with beards, and driving them out of the church. Not a single shred of Scripture.

Now, there is a Scripture against assuming preeminence in the church.

3 John 9-10 King James Version (KJV)
9 I wrote unto the church: but Diotrephes, who loveth to have the preeminence among them, receiveth us not.
10 Wherefore, if I come, I will remember his deeds which he doeth, prating against us with malicious words: and not content therewith, neither doth he himself receive the brethren, and forbiddeth them that would, and casteth them out of the church.

Here, Diotrephes was prating against Spirit filled men, using malicious words, refused to receive them, and forbade those who would, and even cast them out of the church.

He had no biblical grounds to do so. He was simply wanting to be the king of his little kingdom. He wanted, "the preeminence among them". It's a spirit.

I think the spirit of Diotrephes could be behind the beard standard.