Christmas is not pagan

[good samaritan]

Originally Posted by Esaias

His accusers were false accusers:

Acts 25:7-8 KJV
And when he was come, the Jews which came down from Jerusalem stood round about, and laid many and grievous complaints against Paul, which they could not prove. [8] While he answered for himself, Neither against the law of the Jews, neither against the temple, nor yet against Caesar, have I offended any thing at all.

Paul did teach against the necessity of Gentile circumcision, that was not a false accusation.

[Esaias]

Originally Posted by good samaritan

Paul did teach against the necessity of Gentile circumcision, that was not a false accusation.

There was/is no "necessity of Gentile circumcision" in the Law of God, the traditions of the Pharisees/customs of the Jews, or the laws of Rome. The requirement for Gentiles to be circumcised was an erroneous belief promulgated by certain sectarians in regard to Gentile CONVERTS. Those Jewish sectarians were under the idea that in order to follow Messiah, one had to BECOME A JEW. Moses never said that, no prophet said that, Christ never said that, in fact as far as I know even the Talmud doesn't say that.

Meanwhile, Paul himself DENIED THE ACCUSATIONS LEVELED AGAINST HIM. So, who you gonna believe? The apostle Paul? Or your own speculative defense of an unscriptural view of Paul and what he taught?

[Esaias]

Meanwhile, the facts remain: Christmas is the modern Catholic continuation of the pagan holy day celebration of the birth of the Sun god. The rites of Mithra (otherwise known in Rome as Sol Invictus, the "Invincible Sun") were adopted by the catholic movement and elevated to the level of official state religion of the Empire. Those pagan sun worship rites have been continued by "Protestants" as well as the various heathen neo-pagans who have always been around (today they are atheists, secularists, new agers, wiccans, etc etc).

THIS IS WHY YOU PEOPLE HAVE CHURCH ON SUNDAY. It is documented historical fact that the catholic hierarchy suppressed Sabbath keeping in favor of Sunday-keeping. It is documented historical fact that the catholic hierarchy suppressed Oneness in favor of trinitarianism (keeping alive the triadism of pagan religion). It is documented historical fact that the catholic hierarchy suppressed Biblical apostolic conversion in favor of mystery-religion rites of infant baptism and "chrismation" and "sacraments" and "clergy". It is documented historical fact that the catholic hierarchy suppressed independent house churches and Bible reading in favor of episcopal bishoprics, dioceses, temples, altars, sacerdotalism, monasteries, papal ("patriarchal") authority, so called Holy Tradition, Creeds, Synods, Councils, and Canons.

There is nothing new under the sun.

[good samaritan]

Originally Posted by Esaias

There was/is no "necessity of Gentile circumcision" in the Law of God, the traditions of the Pharisees/customs of the Jews, or the laws of Rome. The requirement for Gentiles to be circumcised was an erroneous belief promulgated by certain sectarians in regard to Gentile CONVERTS. Those Jewish sectarians were under the idea that in order to follow Messiah, one had to BECOME A JEW. Moses never said that, no prophet said that, Christ never said that, in fact as far as I know even the Talmud doesn't say that

.

Nor was the law given on Sinai to gentiles, but it was given to Jews, and that is exactly to whom the Sabbath observance was instituted.

Meanwhile, Paul himself DENIED THE ACCUSATIONS LEVELED AGAINST HIM. So, who you gonna believe? The apostle Paul? Or your own speculative defense of an unscriptural view of Paul and what he taught?

I definitely believe Paul, but that is not my point. It wasn’t a false claim to make, that Paul instructed gentiles they where not under the law. He simply stated in Acts 25 that he committed no crimes against anyone’s laws. Some of their allegations may have been true, but they simply where not offenses.

[good samaritan]

Originally Posted by Esaias

Meanwhile, the facts remain: Christmas is the modern Catholic continuation of the pagan holy day celebration of the birth of the Sun god. The rites of Mithra (otherwise known in Rome as Sol Invictus, the "Invincible Sun") were adopted by the catholic movement and elevated to the level of official state religion of the Empire. Those pagan sun worship rites have been continued by "Protestants" as well as the various heathen neo-pagans who have always been around (today they are atheists, secularists, new agers, wiccans, etc etc)

Which has nothing to do with why people celebrate Christmas today.

THIS IS WHY YOU PEOPLE HAVE CHURCH ON SUNDAY. It is documented historical fact that the catholic hierarchy suppressed Sabbath keeping in favor of Sunday-keeping

Is it possible that it is because it was what most of Christianity was doing to start with. Gentiles never had a Sabbath day ordinance, it simply isn’t taught in the NT.

It is documented historical fact that the catholic hierarchy suppressed Oneness in favor of trinitarianism (keeping alive the triadism of pagan religion

Which the scriptures clarify who God is to us. We know by scripture to reject this teaching.

It is documented historical fact that the catholic hierarchy suppressed Biblical apostolic conversion in favor of mystery-religion rites of infant baptism and "chrismation" and "sacraments" and clergy".

Also we are taught by scripture that repentance is a necessary part of conversion. Those who taught those things deviated from the gospel.

It is documented historical fact that the catholic hierarchy suppressed independent house churches and Bible reading in favor of episcopal bishoprics, dioceses, temples, altars, sacerdotalism, monasteries, papal ("patriarchal") authority, so called Holy Tradition, Creeds, Synods, Councils, and Canons.

There is nothing new under the sun.

The 1st century church gathered and learned from whatever venue possible. They gathered in homes, synagogue, streets, etc.. They gathered at every opportunity that they where safe to do so and sometimes even when there was high risks, because it was worth whatever the costs. They where fluid in their new found religion, but naturally became more orthodox as the church grew to keep uniformity. Unfortunately for them, they deviated from the intimate and personal relationship it is to serve God. It kind of reminds me of Israel desiring a king. Before, Israel wanted God to lead them, but later they desired a king to rule over them. It is like they left being Spirit led to become just another orthodox religion

[Amanah]

Originally Posted by good samaritan

.

Nor was the law given on Sinai to gentiles, but it was given to Jews, and that is exactly to whom the Sabbath observance was instituted.



I definitely believe Paul, but that is not my point. It wasn’t a false claim to make, that Paul instructed gentiles they where not under the law. He simply stated in Acts 25 that he committed no crimes against anyone’s laws. Some of their allegations may have been true, but they simply where not offenses.

The 10 commandments are not done away with.

We are grafted into Israel. Israel is the light for all nations.

Both the old and new covenant are with the House of Judah and Israel

The old covenant is the law in stone

The new covenant is the law written on our hearts

Hebrews 8:8-10

8 For finding fault with them, he saith, Behold, the days come, saith the Lord, when I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel and with the house of Judah:

9 Not according to the covenant that I made with their fathers in the day when I took them by the hand to lead them out of the land of Egypt; because they continued not in my covenant, and I regarded them not, saith the Lord.

10 For this is the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel after those days, saith the Lord; I will put my laws into their mind, and write them in their hearts: and I will be to them a God, and they shall be to me a people:

How is it that you are a teacher in Israel and don't know these things?

[Esaias]

Originally Posted by good samaritan

.

Nor was the law given on Sinai to gentiles, but it was given to Jews, and that is exactly to whom the Sabbath observance was instituted.

Nice mythology. But, unfortunately for you, not true. But I explained this all to you before, so not doing it again.

I definitely believe Paul, but that is not my point. It wasn’t a false claim to make, that Paul instructed gentiles they where not under the law. He simply stated in Acts 25 that he committed no crimes against anyone’s laws. Some of their allegations may have been true, but they simply where not offenses.

The bolded part is why I'm not explaining this all over again to you. I really don't think you are even thinking before you post.

[good samaritan]

Originally Posted by Amanah

The 10 commandments are not done away with.

Do you know whatever happened to the Ten Commandments?

What we have is so much more glorious.

2 Corinthians 3:11
For if that which is done away was glorious, much more that which remaineth is glorious.

We are grafted into Israel. Israel is the light for all nations.

Both the old and new covenant are with the House of Judah and Israel

The old covenant is the law in stone

The new covenant is the law written on our hearts

Hebrews 8:8-10

8 For finding fault with them, he saith, Behold, the days come, saith the Lord, when I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel and with the house of Judah:

9 Not according to the covenant that I made with their fathers in the day when I took them by the hand to lead them out of the land of Egypt; because they continued not in my covenant, and I regarded them not, saith the Lord.

10 For this is the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel after those days, saith the Lord; I will put my laws into their mind, and write them in their hearts: and I will be to them a God, and they shall be to me a people:

How is it that you are a teacher in Israel and don't know these things?

We truly have been grafted into the true vine, and we also do have the law written into hearts (Which is obviously the infilling of the Holy Ghost.) We have the righteousness of the law written in our hearts, but we no longer need the Ten Commandments. The Sabbath that Christ has become is greater than any calendar day.

Matthew 11:28
Come unto me, all ye that labour and are heavy laden, and I will give you rest.

Hebrews 4:10
For he that is entered into his rest, he also hath ceased from his own works, as God did from his.

Ya’ll can keep a Sabbath day once a week, but that is not what saves you.

[Amanah]

Jesus says:
If you love me you will keep my commandments
John 14:15

[Amanah]

The ten commandments teach us how to love God
And love each other.

Matthew 22:36-40

36 “Teacher, which is the great commandment in the Law?” 37 And he said to him, “You shall love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind. 38 This is the great and first commandment. 39 And a second is like it: You shall love your neighbor as yourself. 40 On these two commandments depend all the Law and the Prophets.”