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Deep Waters 'Deep Calleth Unto Deep ' -The place to go for Ministry discussions. Please keep it civil. Remember to discuss the issues, not each other.


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  #161  
Old 03-18-2007, 11:46 PM
Newman Newman is offline
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Originally Posted by Felicity View Post
With due respect .... that's a very poor weak argument sis.
How so?
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  #162  
Old 03-18-2007, 11:46 PM
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Felicity Felicity is offline
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Originally Posted by Felicity View Post
With due respect .... that's a very poor weak argument sis.
Something that your salvation is based on would be mentioned with all the writing Paul did. How many times did he mention blood, forgiveness, grace, justification, repentance, etc. Over and over and over again. But no mention of tongues. Neither did any of the other apostles.
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  #163  
Old 03-18-2007, 11:51 PM
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Originally Posted by Newman View Post
We weren't told to dip in water either but saw what those that knew what they were talking about did.
Huh?

The word "baptizo" says it all. And besides that's the way John baptized. There was John's example. He was the forerunner.
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  #164  
Old 03-18-2007, 11:51 PM
Truly Blessed Truly Blessed is offline
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Originally Posted by Felicity View Post
In regard to this and to add to it .....

You know even most apostolics when working with people to show them more truth will allow for recognizing what God has already done in a person's life .... for the change that has taken place ..... and then lead them on from there. They won't discount or nay say the testimony of the believer. The apostles certainly didn't.

Surely God is a miracle working God. He can do anything. He can certainly change a life -- bring about spiritual transformation in that life -- and then lead a person on to more truth and more light.

Many of the people who come into our churches come in this way. They've already been living for God but have a hunger and thirst for more and find a fulfilling enriching experience in the baptism of the Holy Ghost ..... just as Topeka Bible School students did ..... just as I did.
This method sounds familiar for some reason! "When Priscilla and Aquilla heard him [Apollos], they invited him to their home and explained to him the way of God more adequately." (Acts 18:26)
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  #165  
Old 03-19-2007, 09:30 AM
OGIA OGIA is offline


 
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Telling someone they have to speak in tongues to be saved is like telling them they have to get wet to be saved.
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  • Ignorance of the Identity of the One True God is not a valid reason to practice idolatry.
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  #166  
Old 07-04-2011, 10:46 AM
mizpeh mizpeh is offline
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Re: What does having the Holy Spirit mean?

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Originally Posted by Theophilus View Post
"Prove it to me!"

This post is a great example of the attitude one has to have to disbelieve. It is likened unto doubting Thomas, or those that sought a sign of Jesus in the midst of his fulfilling the very letters of their Holy Books.

There they were, all the proof in the world written out for them, and they missed him standing right in front of them.

Thomas wouldn't even believe his contemporaries when they all told them that the Lord had risen.

John 20

24 But Thomas, one of the twelve, called Didymus, was not with them when Jesus came. 25 The other disciples therefore said unto him, We have seen the Lord. But he said unto them, Except I shall see in his hands the print of the nails, and put my finger into the print of the nails, and thrust my hand into his side, I will not believe.

What an attitude to take. Look at how Jesus handled it. Interesting to me that Thomas had to disbelieve in their company for eight days. I imagine he went for some long walks.

26 And after eight days again his disciples were within, and Thomas with them: then came Jesus, the doors being shut, and stood in the midst, and said, Peace be unto you. 27 Then saith he to Thomas, Reach hither thy finger, and behold my hands; and reach hither thy hand, and thrust it into my side: and be not faithless, but believing. 28 And Thomas answered and said unto him, My Lord and my God. 29 Jesus saith unto him, Thomas, because thou hast seen me, thou hast believed: blessed are they that have not seen, and yet have believed. 30 And many other signs truly did Jesus in the presence of his disciples, which are not written in this book: 31 But these are written, that ye might believe that Jesus is the Christ, the Son of God; and that believing ye might have life through his name.

You see TB, not all was written in the New Testament, however what is written is given that we might believe. There are no guarantees. The Word falls on all kinds of ground.

Jesus had an interesting way of revealing himself and teaching.

Let's take a look at John 10.

22 And it was at Jerusalem the feast of the dedication, and it was winter. 23 And Jesus walked in the temple in Solomon's porch. 24 Then came the Jews round about him, and said unto him, How long dost thou make F22 us to doubt? If thou be the Christ, tell us plainly. 25 Jesus answered them, I told you, and ye believed not: the works that I do in my Father's name, they bear witness of me. 26 But ye believe not, because ye are not of my sheep, as I said unto you. 27 My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me: 28 And I give unto them eternal life; and they shall never perish, neither shall any man pluck them out of my hand. 29 My Father, which gave them me, is greater than all; and no man is able to pluck them out of my Father's hand. 30 I and my Father are one. 31 Then the Jews took up stones again to stone him. 32 Jesus answered them, Many good works have I shewed you from my Father; for which of those works do ye stone me? 33 The Jews answered him, saying, For a good work we stone thee not; but for blasphemy; and because that thou, being a man, makest thyself God. 34 Jesus answered them, Is it not written in your law, I said, Ye are gods? 35 If he called them gods, unto whom the word of God came, and the scripture cannot be broken; 36 Say ye of him, whom the Father hath sanctified, and sent into the world, Thou blasphemest; because I said, I am the Son of God? 37 If I do not the works of my Father, believe me not. 38 But if I do, though ye believe not me, believe the works: that ye may know, and believe, that the Father is in me, and I in him.

39 Therefore they sought again to take him: but he escaped out of their hand, 40 And went away again beyond Jordan into the place where John at first baptized; and there he abode. 41 And many resorted unto him, and said, John did no miracle: but all things that John spake of this man were true. 42 And many believed on him there.

Jesus teaches some here and not only do they not believe, they want to kill him. He teaches others and they both see and follow.

Why did he teach in proverbs and parables? Matthew 13.

10 And the disciples came, and said unto him, Why speakest thou unto them in parables? 11 He answered and said unto them, Because it is given unto you to know the mysteries of the kingdom of heaven, but to them it is not given. 12 For whosoever hath, to him shall be given, and he shall have more abundance: but whosoever hath not, from him shall be taken away even that he hath. 13 Therefore speak I to them in parables: because they seeing see not; and hearing they hear not, neither do they understand. 14 And in them is fulfilled the prophecy of Esaias, which saith, By hearing ye shall hear, and shall not understand; and seeing ye shall see, and shall not perceive: 15 For this people's heart is waxed gross, and their ears are dull of hearing, and their eyes they have closed; lest at any time they should see with their eyes, and hear with their ears, and should understand with their heart, and should be converted, and I should heal them.

Even Paul, being full and inspired by the Holy Ghost, was a difficult one to understand.

2 Peter 3

15 And account that the longsuffering of our Lord is salvation; even as our beloved brother Paul also according to the wisdom given unto him hath written unto you; 16 As also in all his epistles, speaking in them of these things; in which are some things hard to be understood, which they that are unlearned and unstable wrest, as they do also the other scriptures, unto their own destruction.

So, getting back to the material of your post.

The evidence of tongues as an elemental aspect of Spiritual Baptism is sound, yet not mentioned in redundancy. It's not needful.

Do I need to refer to all the gifts of the Spirit, or the fruits thereof every time I refer to the terms? Not if you've already been taught what they are.

You suggest that because there is not pure and complete redundancy that it is not provable.

You demand that since these large outpourings aren't laid out to your satisfaction, then they didn't speak in tongues. Well now, where is the proof that they repented? It's not mentioned, yet their experience is seen and manifest in their subsequent ACTS.



Matthew 7

21 Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven. 22 Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works? 23 And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.

Christendom is full of those that do wonderful things and follow some scripture, yet the Lord has not known them. I find this amazing.
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To be a servant of God, it will cost us our total commitment to God, and God alone. His burden must be our burden... Sis Alvear
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  #167  
Old 07-04-2011, 10:48 AM
mizpeh mizpeh is offline
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Re: What does having the Holy Spirit mean?

Quote:
Originally Posted by OGIA View Post
Telling someone they have to speak in tongues to be saved is like telling them they have to get wet to be saved.
And no one does that so why set up a strawman?
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His banner over me is LOVE.... My soul followeth hard after thee....Love one another with a pure heart fervently. Jesus saith unto her, Said I not unto thee, that, if thou wouldest believe, thou shouldest see the glory of God?

To be a servant of God, it will cost us our total commitment to God, and God alone. His burden must be our burden... Sis Alvear
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  #168  
Old 03-10-2014, 10:41 PM
mizpeh mizpeh is offline
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Re: What does having the Holy Spirit mean?

bumpo
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His banner over me is LOVE.... My soul followeth hard after thee....Love one another with a pure heart fervently. Jesus saith unto her, Said I not unto thee, that, if thou wouldest believe, thou shouldest see the glory of God?

To be a servant of God, it will cost us our total commitment to God, and God alone. His burden must be our burden... Sis Alvear
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  #169  
Old 03-10-2014, 10:59 PM
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Timmy Timmy is offline
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Re: What does having the Holy Spirit mean?

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Originally Posted by mizpeh View Post
And no one does that so why set up a strawman?
No one? We'll see.

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http://www.apostolicfriendsforum.com...ad.php?t=45790

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  #170  
Old 03-10-2014, 11:02 PM
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Timmy Timmy is offline
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Re: What does having the Holy Spirit mean?

Oh, look! Do you have to get wet to be saved?

Quote:
Originally Posted by MissBrattified View Post
Absolutely! In baptism.
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