1. Not inherently, just as marajuana isn't inherently evil, but will you also justify partaking of that?
2. Biblical principles is the precise reason why we should reject ornamentation; it walks hand in hand w/ idolatry/paganism & God repeatedly shown His displeasure over it.
3. So, if the song leader got up Sun. morning in a bikini to lead service, would that reflect at all on the condition of her heart? "You shall know them by their fruits."
1. You are correct in your definition, jewelry is not inherently evil. However, your comparing the wearing of jewelry to marijuana (substance abuse) is inappropriate and off base. Would you care to tell someone wearing a wedding ring or a Rolex that they are no less than someone smoking marijuana? You have taken a biblical principle and made a crude, rigid rule out of it. A rule that is so incomplete, no one can rightly defend it. Ministers are constantly revising their definitions to "plastic buttons that appear to be gold," and "hair pieces that resemble expensive diamonds." Here is your conundrum. You can never really justify half of what your brethren wear, because by design, most clothing is ornamentation on some level. There are ties that are more flashy than some necklaces. There are beautiful beads and and buttons that cost more than some rings. Is it bright colors or shininess, is it texture or design, that is so displeasing to God? I suppose you take issue with the wearing of such like objects or clothing? Should we boycott Nordstrom's and Saks Fifth too then? Would you have women wear burlap sacks? This approach accomplishes precisely what you have become, a crude judge of your brethren.
2. The biblical principle here is modesty and moderation. It is error to exclusively single out the wearing of jewelry as being equal to idolatry and paganism. You have attempted to "fill in the blanks" where scripture is silent. You and others have superseded the Holy Bible with this erroneous doctrine! I can give you more scripture for God's favor of ornamentation, precious stones and metals, and jewelry, than you can with your twisted hunk of convoluted junk meanings.
3. I see you have no problem putting your brethren on trial for what they wear. This is precisely the same problem the Apostle Paul dealt with in his epistles. Its called Pharisaism. It is also the basis for legalism. Your extreme example of wearing a bikini on the platform fails to address the issue. You are trapped my friend! To uphold this doctrine, you must continue to resist the Apostle Paul's admonishments and rebukes against condemning your brethren, following strange and diverse doctrines, and causing division. You have usurped the domain of God, in that you and others are willing to judge the intent of the heart, and prove mens rea upon all those that wear jewelry or such like apparel!
Last edited by noeticknight; 10-26-2009 at 07:25 PM.
Tks. for the concession, but Deut. 7:25 includes silver, Is. 3 mentions "rings" & "bracelets" & so on. The context is ornamentation...not just "gold" & "pearls," though they certainly flow into the topic.
Deuteronomy 7:25 was specifically about gold and silver from idols. In fact it says do not take it unto thee. In the exodus from egypt God told his people to borrow the egyptians jewelry. Did God command his people to commit an abomination?
Isaiah 3 shows God taking away jewelry in judgment. It does not support your position.
Quote:
Originally Posted by rdp
How in the world can one "contort" the word "not"?????????????????????
Silly, & I never said that God doesn't hear sinners prayers. Classical straw man attack.
He was not making a straw man. He was attempting to show the how your logic is flawed. Whether he was right or not you should address why the logic you are using on these verses could not be used to mean what he is claiming it does with those other passages.
Quote:
Originally Posted by rdp
How many times do I have to quote the Greek manuscripts to you people? Can you not read?
Jer. 4:30 depicts jewelry in connection w/ a woman of whoredom [& so does another verse in Ezek.]. Will you be consistent & now renounce the practice as you embrace it based upon the same book??????? I doubt it!
I Cor. 11 plainly says that it's a disgrace for a woman to "shorn/cut" her hair & Deut. 22:5 clearly affirms that it's an "abomination to the LORD" to engage in gender cross dressing....of course, I do not expect the rebels on this site to believe the Bible.
Put your erasers up, it'll still be there when you're finished! Sad, very sad.............
Quote:
Originally Posted by rdp
The literal transliteration of this verse says, "the wearing of apparel ADORNING". And the NKJV, NIV, etc. accurately reflects this.
Good grief, what's wrong w/ you people???????????????
As for the translation of 1 Peter 3:3. Here are the translations.
I have bolded the translations that agree with me. Clearly there is quite a bit of variance on exactly how that verse should be translated. But a large enough number of them agree with me that I am not convinced that they are saying what you think they are. If you want to say it says something in the greek please post how the whole verse would read in the greek.
I wanted to add one other thing. The deuteronomy 22:5 verse is from the laws. 4 verses later there is a verse about having a battlement on your roof and the verse right after that is one about not wearing garments which are made of two materials. Tell me, do you do either of those things rdp?
in each case, it is not condemning fixing the hair, putting on jewelry, or wearing clothes but contrasting the outward and superficial with the inward and real. Why can't people see that? I'm not the sharpest knife in the drawer or the brightest light on the tree and I can see it.
in each case, it is not condemning fixing the hair, putting on jewelry, or wearing clothes but contrasting the outward and superficial with the inward and real. Why can't people see that? I'm not the sharpest knife in the drawer or the brightest light on the tree and I can see it.
Oh, and I was agreeing that I see that, not that you are not the sharpest knife in the drawer or the brightest light on the tree! LOL!
in each case, it is not condemning fixing the hair, putting on jewelry, or wearing clothes but contrasting the outward and superficial with the inward and real. Why can't people see that? I'm not the sharpest knife in the drawer or the brightest light on the tree and I can see it.
in each case, it is not condemning fixing the hair, putting on jewelry, or wearing clothes but contrasting the outward and superficial with the inward and real. Why can't people see that? I'm not the sharpest knife in the drawer or the brightest light on the tree and I can see it.
I see it also, and it's very clear.
__________________
I've gone and done it now! I'm on Facebook!!!
One question I would like to ask here - why do you care what I or my wife wears? Are you genuinely concerned that wearing jewelry will damage my relationship with God -- or are you more concerned with getting me to look like you do? Or, do you think it would be better for you to not wear jewelry, because it offends your spirit; and leave me alone to wear jewelry, because it does not offend my spirit?
I personally don't wear any jewelry at all (not even a wedding ring), but not from a righteousness standpoint -- I just don't like the way it feels on me. My wife, however, wears jewelry almost daily. Since she started, I haven't noticed her walk with God grow any weaker -- in fact, it seems to have grown stronger (at least from what I can tell).
When I stand before God to account for my life, I don't think you will be there. And, when you're standing before God, I won't be there. It will be just Him and me, and I pray that I (and you) will be ready.
It is completely inconsistent to use Isaiah 3 as opposition for jewelry unless you take THIS passage into account as possible support for jewelry:
Eze 16:10 I clothed thee also with broidered work, and shod thee with badgers' skin, and I girded thee about with fine linen, and I covered thee with silk. Eze 16:11I decked thee also with ornaments, and I put bracelets upon thy hands, and a chain on thy neck. Eze 16:12 And I put a jewel on thy forehead, and earrings in thine ears, and a beautiful crown upon thine head. Eze 16:13 Thus wast thou decked with gold and silver; and thy raiment was of fine linen, and silk, and broidered work; thou didst eat fine flour, and honey, and oil: and thou wast exceeding beautiful, and thou didst prosper into a kingdom. Eze 16:14 And thy renown went forth among the heathen for thy beauty: for it was perfect through my comeliness, which I had put upon thee, saith the Lord GOD.
__________________
"God, send me anywhere, only go with me. Lay any burden on me, only sustain me. And sever any tie in my heart except the tie that binds my heart to Yours."
--David Livingstone
"To see no being, not God’s or any, but you also go thither,
To see no possession but you may possess it—enjoying all without labor or purchase—
abstracting the feast, yet not abstracting one particle of it;…."
--Walt Whitman, Leaves of Grass, Song of the Open Road
Linear Mode
