Ray Boltz????

[nahkoe]

Originally Posted by HappyTown

Nope, God can! But not everyone is healed are they???

And I say that has more to do with the church's reaction than God's ability, or lack of if, or desire or lack of it, to heal, deliver, and restore.

Originally Posted by HappyTown

It stay in the closet due to reactions such as yours!

Not quite.

Originally Posted by HappyTown

Or their way of asking for help! Not one I'd take.

By the time a person is openly gay and living an openly gay lifestyle, they are not asking for help. They've given up hope.

Originally Posted by HappyTown

This is sad, and should also open our eyes to the fact many people suffer in silence.

And *this* is the idea I was trying to get across.

[HappyTown]

Originally Posted by nahkoe

\

And *this* is the idea I was trying to get across.

We agree on this!

[nahkoe]

Originally Posted by mfblume

I have personally cast devils of homosexuality out of people. It is demonic. These things cannot simply be "healed" or overcome. Spirits make it more of an issue. Some may mock away, but I saw it is an issue of the demonic, first hand. It's too unnatural, anyway. Romans 1 makes it a severe sin. I honestly do not know if it can occur without demonic influence.

I won't mock, but I am going to have to say that I don't think all cases are demonic in nature. I'm not sure any are...but I won't go so far as to say for sure they're not.

I've already given the impression, I'm sure, that I'm no stranger to homosexuality. And since I can't quite work out how to say what I'm trying to say without admitting to this openly... I identified as bi-sexual quite openly for a lot of years.

When you say that these things cannot simply be healed or overcome, you're selling God very, very short.

I nearly drowned in this, I knew it was against the Word of God, but I knew it was who I was. I couldn't change it. It was as much a part of me as breathing and my heart beating. I also knew better than to go to my first pastor with this revelation. I'd heard him say a lot of the same things said in this thread so far. The pity doesn't help. The judgment definitely doesn't help. I tried to just deal with it on my own, trust me, that wasn't going to work. I couldn't just compartmentalize it and pretend it wasn't there. That would have consumed me. See Ray? I know where he's at, not just because I can guess or imagine. That he's dealt with this for YEARS, alone, I really meant it when I said I'm in awe of that.

My 'family' has been instrumental in me dealing with this. Some people here have known. My pastor knows. Some friends know.

The statement "Jesus loves you, and there's nothing you can do about it" (Hi Griff, I assume you'll be reading this whenever you get power again ) was for me, key to beginning to heal. He was right when he said that. God loves me, He'd pursued me, wooed me, captured my attention and made clear His desire for a relationship, all while knowing full well who I was. I could run from that forever, I could do anything, and that fact would never change.

I almost literally threw this skeleton at my pastor. I'm pretty sure it was included in like the 2nd email I ever sent him. See, it hadn't been in any closet, I'd lived quite openly before coming back to God. I couldn't quite figure out how to make this skeleton fit in the closet with all the others. I knew that's what you were "supposed" to do when you come back to church and God. Shove all the unmentionables into a closet and let them rot there. Or, that's sure the idea I had at least.

My pastor's words rocked my world. It took me MONTHS to finally understand what he was trying to say. "It's not that it doesn't matter, but *it doesn't matter*." He was right. Even if I had actually done something about the desires of my heart, even if I had actively sought out a relationship and acted on it, it would never have changed how God felt about me. That acceptance, "this is who you are, but it's not who you will become" was so important to me.

I've been using the past tense in this post because while I was thinking about this earlier I realized I couldn't place the last time I'd had thoughts or desires cross my mind. Do I think it's really a thing of the past? I don't know. What I do know is that this was all consuming for *years and years* of my life. That I can't remember when, or what, the last thought was is amazing to me.

And a note regarding sin... Understanding God's Love in no way gives license to sin. It's inspired me to learn what He desires from me, and to put every effort into being what He wants. That He desired me when I was who I was, and was where I was, is beyond comprehension. He is my God, Holy in every way, that He would dirty Himself to pick me up from where I was is awesome beyond words. I've prayed so often, "God you already knew who I was, what I was, and I can't change it. I've tried. If it needs to be changed, if you don't like it, don't want it, have something better in mind, You have to change it."

*edited to add*

My sig line is more than a verse to me, it's very, very intimately personal. It's my story, past, present and future.

[Steve Epley]

Okay who is Ray Boltz?????????????????/ No I am not kidding.

[nahkoe]

Originally Posted by Steve Epley

Okay who is Ray Boltz?????????????????/ No I am not kidding.

Christian singer and song writer from the 90s. Watch some of the videos TalkLady posted to get an idea of what he wrong/sang.

[HappyTown]

Originally Posted by nahkoe

I won't mock, but I am going to have to say that I don't think all cases are demonic in nature. I'm not sure any are...but I won't go so far as to say for sure they're not.

I've already given the impression, I'm sure, that I'm no stranger to homosexuality. And since I can't quite work out how to say what I'm trying to say without admitting to this openly... I identified as bi-sexual quite openly for a lot of years.

When you say that these things cannot simply be healed or overcome, you're selling God very, very short.

I nearly drowned in this, I knew it was against the Word of God, but I knew it was who I was. I couldn't change it. It was as much a part of me as breathing and my heart beating. I also knew better than to go to my first pastor with this revelation. I'd heard him say a lot of the same things said in this thread so far. The pity doesn't help. The judgment definitely doesn't help. I tried to just deal with it on my own, trust me, that wasn't going to work. I couldn't just compartmentalize it and pretend it wasn't there. That would have consumed me. See Ray? I know where he's at, not just because I can guess or imagine. That he's dealt with this for YEARS, alone, I really meant it when I said I'm in awe of that.

My 'family' has been instrumental in me dealing with this. Some people here have known. My pastor knows. Some friends know.

The statement "Jesus loves you, and there's nothing you can do about it" (Hi Griff, I assume you'll be reading this whenever you get power again ) was for me, key to beginning to heal. He was right when he said that. God loves me, He'd pursued me, wooed me, captured my attention and made clear His desire for a relationship, all while knowing full well who I was. I could run from that forever, I could do anything, and that fact would never change.

I almost literally threw this skeleton at my pastor. I'm pretty sure it was included in like the 2nd email I ever sent him. See, it hadn't been in any closet, I'd lived quite openly before coming back to God. I couldn't quite figure out how to make this skeleton fit in the closet with all the others. I knew that's what you were "supposed" to do when you come back to church and God. Shove all the unmentionables into a closet and let them rot there. Or, that's sure the idea I had at least.

My pastor's words rocked my world. It took me MONTHS to finally understand what he was trying to say. "It's not that it doesn't matter, but *it doesn't matter*." He was right. Even if I had actually done something about the desires of my heart, even if I had actively sought out a relationship and acted on it, it would never have changed how God felt about me. That acceptance, "this is who you are, but it's not who you will become" was so important to me.

I've been using the past tense in this post because while I was thinking about this earlier I realized I couldn't place the last time I'd had thoughts or desires cross my mind. Do I think it's really a thing of the past? I don't know. What I do know is that this was all consuming for *years and years* of my life. That I can't remember when, or what, the last thought was is amazing to me.

And a note regarding sin... Understanding God's Love in no way gives license to sin. It's inspired me to learn what He desires from me, and to put every effort into being what He wants. That He desired me when I was who I was, and was where I was, is beyond comprehension. He is my God, Holy in every way, that He would dirty Himself to pick me up from where I was is awesome beyond words. I've prayed so often, "God you already knew who I was, what I was, and I can't change it. I've tried. If it needs to be changed, if you don't like it, don't want it, have something better in mind, You have to change it."

*edited to add*

My sig line is more than a verse to me, it's very, very intimately personal. It's my story, past, present and future.

Thanks for being so open and honest. That old saying true, unless you walked in my shoes, you'll never understand!

[mfblume]

Originally Posted by nahkoe

I won't mock, but I am going to have to say that I don't think all cases are demonic in nature. I'm not sure any are...but I won't go so far as to say for sure they're not.

I've already given the impression, I'm sure, that I'm no stranger to homosexuality. And since I can't quite work out how to say what I'm trying to say without admitting to this openly... I identified as bi-sexual quite openly for a lot of years.

When you say that these things cannot simply be healed or overcome, you're selling God very, very short.

I meant to say aside from casting out of devils it is not simply "healed." Like I said, I have cast devils of homosexuality out of people. It seems the casting out of devils has been relegated to medieval foolishness in many circles, and people cannot see a need for it in favor of "healing" etc. Something caused by a demon cannot be dealt with in ways aside from dealing with the evil spirit.

It can be suppressed perhaps, but a devil will most likely be cast out when full recovery is found. Without such deliverance, the battle is always there.

[Cindy]

Originally Posted by DerrickS

While I agree that it is a sin, I find it difficult to claim to know what someone with these tendencies goes through. I would hesitate to assume that it is some fun thing they are doing because they want to sin for a season. I guarantee you that most gay people would rather NOT have those tendencies. Life would certainly be much easier. I try to imagine how difficult it would be if I had the same feelings for men that I currently have for women. While it may not be "natural", it is a tendency that occurs for whatever reason. Environmental, psychological, etc. HOW you came to be that way wouldn't make it any easy to ignore.

Praying for Ray Boltz.

Derrick it is a choice plain and simple, just as any other sin is a choice. I didn't say anything about it being fun at all as I know it is not. It is a horrible lie that the enemy deceives people with. I will pray for any sinner to be delivered from sin whatever it may be.

[Cindy]

Originally Posted by ManOfWord

I'm just flipped out.....that's about all I can say! Is there no one who can overcome ungodliness as a good soldier? Sure battling sin is tough! That's why it's called a fight! But it is a good fight!

You don't fight, you get defeated! Plain and simple! What a cop out to say that it is just too hard! How hard was it for Jesus to say, "If it be possible, let this cup pass from me?" But he ended up saying, "Nevertheless, not my will, but Yours be done!"

That is what overcomers do. Sometimes you don't get OVER things....you just have to get THROUGH them...day by day, prayer by prayer!! No, it's not easy...but I can do ALL things through Christ who strengthens me!

Oh Amen Pastor, as I battle daily. Thank you for this reminder that we can be overcomers through Him.

[nahkoe]

Originally Posted by mfblume

I meant to say aside from casting out of devils it is not simply "healed." Like I said, I have cast devils of homosexuality out of people. It seems the casting out of devils has been relegated to medieval foolishness in many circles, and people cannot see a need for it in favor of "healing" etc. Something caused by a demon cannot be dealt with in ways aside from dealing with the evil spirit.

It can be suppressed perhaps, but a devil will most likely be cast out when full recovery is found. Without such deliverance, the battle is always there.

Have you read the other part of my testimony I posted here a few days ago?

http://www.apostolicfriendsforum.com...ad.php?t=18510

I'm also no stranger to demons and dealing with things caused by demons. I can say pretty certainly that while I don't really know what led down this path, it wasn't demonic in nature.